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Bear Maturing

 
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Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:30:14 PM   
Marquo


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June 1943: In this match my Axis opponent is adopting a defensive stance; in the early winter, 1942 he pocketed ~250,000 in the steppe northeast of Kiew. A counterattack almost cut off his armored spearhead. and since both sides have ridden out the blizzard and the spring mud.

The Soviet army is over 9.000,000 strong and growing. I successfully evacuated much of my factories including HI, and the results are below.
I am posting this for comment as I beleive that saving as much factory assets as possible may indeed pay off - or I am missing something completely.

Thanks,

Marquo





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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:31:31 PM   
Marquo


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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:35:21 PM   
Marquo


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More Production Data





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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:35:38 PM   
Walloc

 

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At what point in time did axis stop attacking?
Sorry, not sure i understod correctly.


Kind regards,

Rasmus

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:51:48 PM   
Ketza


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With 9 million men did it matter when he stopped attacking?

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 9:57:46 PM   
Walloc

 

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Well, he didnt start with 9 million men. Question could be if russian got to 9m cuz axis side stopped attacking/counter attacking too "early".

Kind regards,

Rasmus

< Message edited by Walloc -- 8/11/2012 9:58:39 PM >

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 10:27:03 PM   
Marquo


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The Axis player stopped attacking at the end of the winter, 1942. He is adopting a strategy of conservation of force; he is quite capable of vicious limited attacks, but the CV of my units is now holding him to limited advances.

My point is that I have over 1.000.000 men and armaments in reserve and my strategy was maximum conservation of all factory assets; did this backfire or is it working out okay?

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 10:29:28 PM   
janh

 

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Besides what damage he did inflict in summer/autumn 41 (?), the key question is how many Soviet manpower centers he took or at least damaged/displaced? Soviet pools seem well filled, no hint of any shortage soon.

Yet if I look at the jump map, it would appear that the Red bear either has been rolling to Berlin already for several month by June 43, or the Axis player never got anywhere near Moscow or the large cities in the Ukraine? Maybe the Axis never got the bear even to tumble in this game, and will not even get the respite from that until late 43/early 44 as usual?

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/11/2012 10:42:28 PM   
Walloc

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marquo

The Axis player stopped attacking at the end of the winter, 1942. He is adopting a strategy of conservation of force; he is quite capable of vicious limited attacks, but the CV of my units is now holding him to limited advances.

My point is that I have over 1.000.000 men and armaments in reserve and my strategy was maximum conservation of all factory assets; did this backfire or is it working out okay?



U doing very well. It worked great, u got 1.4m supplies and plenty a arms and manpower in pools. Question is as Janh hints at, is how did u get there. I got no idea how 41 turned out, but as Janh hints at. How did u manage to do a maximum conservation of factories and apparently not lose to many men or territory doing it/what did axis side do?

Kind regards,

Rasmus

< Message edited by Walloc -- 8/11/2012 10:44:59 PM >

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/12/2012 1:42:12 AM   
Marquo


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The Axis pushed very hard in 41, and then adopted a conservative strategy of conservation of force. Leningrad fell, and Moscow was somewhat imperiled but held. Sevastopol fell; Stalino held. In 1942 my opponent gathered all of the armor into one fist and hard pushed in the South. I shifted every spare unit on the map to create multiple, successive belts of defensive lines wherever I saw the fist. Often it was 5 or 6 belts deep. I learned from watching AARs that too often the Soviet player leaves way too many forces where the Axis isn't. Anyway, I held onto my share of manpower: currently at 2971.

But he is very dangerous; I advanced a bit too far during the blizzard and a counterattack nailed 250,000 troops, many Guards.

My question: when should I stop building new units? I have 90 infantry corps/203 divisions and 31 armored/mech crops orgainzied into 8 Tank armies. Should I keep building new units? I seem to have an endless supply of manpower and armaments.

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RE: Bear Maturing - 8/12/2012 2:29:06 AM   
Walloc

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Marquo
The Axis pushed very hard in 41, and then adopted a conservative strategy of conservation of force. Leningrad fell, and Moscow was somewhat imperiled but held. Sevastopol fell; Stalino held.


Ok, thx. Thats bit of an error in my opinion, going conservation i mean. Force conservation isnt needed as much as hurting the russian in 41,
but ill go into that another day.

quote:


In 1942 my opponent gathered all of the armor into one fist and hard pushed in the South. I shifted every spare unit on the map to create multiple, successive belts of defensive lines wherever I saw the fist. Often it was 5 or 6 belts deep. I learned from watching AARs that too often the Soviet player leaves way too many forces where the Axis isn't. Anyway, I held onto my share of manpower: currently at 2971.


Ok, good strategy on ur part. Counter to this as german IMO and why will again hafta wait. Limit ur turn by turn objectives. U prolly had around 2500-2600 manpower by then. That 100k per turn. If u can use 20 pz divs to pinch off 1 or 2 hexes of full of units per turn that u cant rescue. Then that along with attrional losses will basicly stop any growth in the russian army. As well as start to create an AP crunch. There is no need to go deep. Just grind. Ppl might then say u wont win that grind. Well yes u will, but more on that another day. Ppl get to ambitious and go for more.

quote:


But he is very dangerous; I advanced a bit too far during the blizzard and a counterattack nailed 250,000 troops, many Guards.

My question: when should I stop building new units? I have 90 infantry corps/203 divisions and 31 armored/mech crops orgainzied into 8 Tank armies. Should I keep building new units? I seem to have an endless supply of manpower and armaments.


Ok well sounds like he got the counter attacking thing down. If u can keep SU army down in 41(either by taking much teritorry if he runs causing little replacements then grind in 42 or by taking out units), using the tactics i outline above in 42 u can basicly keep the army from rising much in strength, if not even falling. Then do counter attacks in later 42-43 as he is doing. U really can keep the SU army down. Seems like he got off to a bit too conservative 41 which starts the bad cycle. Instead of starting a good cycle to build on in 42. Ofc that easy to sit here and say. Non the less that would be my advise for him in learning for another time.

Traditionally its said u should preferbly have around 400 inf divs equivalent. u got 90*3 = 270+203 = 470. U shouldnt need more of that u havent mentioned arty divs. How many u got? if non start building those. If ur opponents starts to make lines of fortifications that would help along with eng to crack those. If u feel u really got an surpluse in arms. Making some AT Bde can have some merit depending on his style. If he makes fortified inf lines with Armor backing up in reserve. Using AT bde in attacking reserve as u need every frontline hex for CV units. This can pay off by giving some more AT power killing/disrupting his reacting Pz units. Else but depence on veh pool, Mech corps never hurts. If u ever able to create holes in his lines they are the only with staying power of ur exploiteble units. Losing some once and a while might even be worth while if he focuses on killing that one instead of restoring his lines. Its ofc very situasional.

Kind regards,

Rasmus

< Message edited by Walloc -- 8/12/2012 2:40:21 AM >

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