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Chinese Corps Divided

 
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Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 4:40:07 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 1370
Joined: 6/3/2006
Status: offline 		Folks I have a Chinese Corps that is divided into units A,B,C, and it will not recombine. All are in the same hex, same op mode, combat mode, prep target, HQ, and anything else I can consider (all settings seem to be the same) what am I missing? I've never had this problem before. Not giving specifics as I don't want my fine advisory to know (sorry Mark)! Hal

< Message edited by dr.hal -- 7/30/2012 5:07:05 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 4:55:21 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 6200
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

Folks I have a Chinese Corps that is divided into units A,B,C, and it will not recombine. All are in the same hex, same op mode, combat mode, prep target, HQ, and anything else I can consider (all settings seem to be the same) what am I missing? I've never had this problem before. Not giving specifics as I don't want my fine advisory to know (sorry Mike)! Hal


Often this is due to some devices having upgraded TOE and others in the other pieces having not.

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RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:03:19 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 1370
Joined: 6/3/2006
Status: offline 		Ahhh. That may be it, but I do have ALLOW UPGRADES and Replacements on all three parts, so I guess I should look for the "+" signs in one or two of three, thus knowing they are out of syc? Would that do it Bullwinkle?

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Post #: 3
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:08:30 PM   
witpqs

 

Posts: 12401
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline 		The "+" sign (plus sign) does not tell you that a squad/device can upgrade, it tells you that replacements are available for that squad/device.

The "=" sign (equals sign) tells you that a squad/device can upgrade because there are enough of the newer squad/device in the pool.

The "**" sign (two asterisks together) tells you that this device is different that the same device slot in another subordinate unit, and that fact will prevent the subordinate units from rebuilding into the parent unit.

Note:
I hope I got that ** symbol correct. Because of the font and the size it's kind of hard to tell on my screen, but I believe it is two asterisks in a row.

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Post #: 4
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:20:22 PM   
dr.hal


Posts: 1370
Joined: 6/3/2006
Status: offline 		Thanks witpqs, I'll look for that and get back to the group. Hal

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RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:21:09 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 6200
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: dr.hal

Ahhh. That may be it, but I do have ALLOW UPGRADES and Replacements on all three parts, so I guess I should look for the "+" signs in one or two of three, thus knowing they are out of syc? Would that do it Bullwinkle?


What witpqs said.

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Post #: 6
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:28:37 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 3281
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		Chinese Infantry squads do not differentiate between the years. They have the same name but your /A could be 41 type but the /B could be later.

Alfred

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 7
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 5:39:12 PM   
witpqs

 

Posts: 12401
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Chinese Infantry squads do not differentiate between the years. They have the same name but your /A could be 41 type but the /B could be later.

Alfred

Good point. In Babes they do, but in stock scenarios you will have to use Tracker and look up the units in question. But even if they have the same names (with no year indicated, as in Scenario 1), the code will still put in the **.

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Post #: 8
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 6:31:16 PM   
DaveConn

 

Posts: 215
Joined: 5/3/2001
From: Washington
Status: offline 		I believe (but haven't really kept track) that if some of the components have "miles" accumulated toward a move to another hex, it will keep components from recombining as well. If this is the case, try canceling the move.

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Post #: 9
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 6:35:43 PM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Chinese Infantry squads do not differentiate between the years. They have the same name but your /A could be 41 type but the /B could be later.

Alfred

Good point. In Babes they do, but in stock scenarios you will have to use Tracker and look up the units in question. But even if they have the same names (with no year indicated, as in Scenario 1), the code will still put in the **.


witpqs,

You are correct. However my recollection is (a) dr.hal is playing an earlier version before the marks indicating the state of affairs were introduced, and (b) he is playing one of the officical scenarios.

Alfred

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 10
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 6:37:14 PM   
Yaab


Posts: 315
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From: Poznan, Poland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DaveConn

I believe (but haven't really kept track) that if some of the components have "miles" accumulated toward a move to another hex, it will keep components from recombining as well. If this is the case, try canceling the move.


I noticed the same thing and stopped dividing Chinese corps which are moving - too much mess. Now I only divide units when a unit arrives in a city for resting.

< Message edited by Yaab -- 7/30/2012 6:38:01 PM >

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Post #: 11
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 8:12:23 PM   
witpqs

 

Posts: 12401
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Chinese Infantry squads do not differentiate between the years. They have the same name but your /A could be 41 type but the /B could be later.

Alfred

Good point. In Babes they do, but in stock scenarios you will have to use Tracker and look up the units in question. But even if they have the same names (with no year indicated, as in Scenario 1), the code will still put in the **.


witpqs,

You are correct. However my recollection is (a) dr.hal is playing an earlier version before the marks indicating the state of affairs were introduced, and (b) he is playing one of the officical scenarios.

Alfred


I believe he should still see the ** if applicable as the code goes by device # (not to be confused with weapon slot in the LCU) to make the comparison.

(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 12
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/30/2012 8:51:59 PM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 3281
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		michaelm added the "**" in beta patch 1108k7. Eight betas before that beta he introduced the other marks you listed. So if dr.hal is using that beta or the last official patch he should see the marks as you have stated. But I still maintain that I believe he hasn't upgraded yet.

Still it should clarify the position for everyone else who has upgraded.

Alfred

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 13
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 2:58:27 AM   
KPAX


Posts: 676
Joined: 6/3/2004
From: Where the heart is; Home of the Fighting Irish
Status: offline 		WEll, this is kinda on topic, well maybe a little off .....

It is May 1942 and an AVG unit has 1 H-81. There are not any more of those planess to come (as far as I can tell). What happens if a unit can not fill out ever but can upgrade?

Another question ... I have a air unit which has an upgrade available with enough planes, is completely filled out but it say "Upgrade not possible". What does that mean?

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Thanks !!

KPAX

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Post #: 14
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 4:30:29 AM   
jmalter

 

Posts: 990
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline 		1) you should be able to upgrade it eventually, but only when enough a/c are available to fill out the sqn. for Chinese fighters, that's usually 12 planes. meanwhile, you've got a 'training' sqn!

2) upgrade usually req's AF=7 and min 20k supply in the hex, sometimes the game-engine will cut you some slack, but not often. mouseover on the upgrade button for more info. i think an AirHQ in the hex helps beat the reqs.

re 1) - IIRC those AVG guys w/d on 4Jul42? the pilots go to USArmy pool, the plane (assuming your trainees haven't washed it out) goes to ChinaAF pool. don't be upgrading the AVG sqn at this late date, unless you're really starved for air defense. ChinaAF can train up a reasonable fighter-force by mid-43, but not if the AVG has expended all the planes.

(in reply to KPAX)
Post #: 15
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 5:51:43 AM   
LoBaron


Posts: 3845
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline 		Edit: I leave the screenshot for your convenience, upgraded squads have the same name. Question has already been answered before, didn´t notice...



< Message edited by LoBaron -- 7/31/2012 5:53:22 AM >

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Post #: 16
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 6:26:10 AM   
KPAX


Posts: 676
Joined: 6/3/2004
From: Where the heart is; Home of the Fighting Irish
Status: offline 		Thanks Jmalter,

Let me further this a bit, please.

When the AVG w/d in July, all their planes go into the China pool. The build rate on the P-39D is 25/mo at beginning of the war. So by mid March would have enough to completely change out all three AVGs. The H81 would go into the China pool.
The build rate for the I-16-III is well, zero. But there are enough planes scattered around to do some combining at the beginning of the war. Enough to fill a unit out, via withdrawals. Take a filled out I-16-III unit and upgrade it to the H-81s, rinse and repeat on each unit until April when you get the P-43A with its whopping build rate of 12/mo.

In a PBEM game it is May 42, I have 48 H-81s in the China pool and can consolidate a few units to make a full I-16, which I can convert to an H-81. I can field a 65+ air skill unit for the China H-81 unit. With the skills for the remaining pilots increasing fairly decently. Fast enough for the 2 additional H-81 conversions (leaving 12 H-81s for replacements) and then a P-43 unit will be ready soon. I could field like 4 full China air groups, with decent skill by mid May 42. That keeps China in the game with their own skin and allows more groups for India.



_____________________________

"War makes Heros on both sides." Hero (the movie)



Thanks !!

KPAX

(in reply to jmalter)
Post #: 17
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 7:21:31 AM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 3281
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		1. You don't have to consolidate the I-16 before upgrading to the H-81.

2. Upgrading the AVG to the P-40B is better than the P-39D.

Alfred

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Post #: 18
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 8:14:56 AM   
jmalter

 

Posts: 990
Joined: 10/12/2010
Status: offline 		given the zlow rate of China air production, imo you should be miserly on upgrades, and majorly on training. i had good success w/ I-15s defending Chunking early, w/ good exp gain & few losses. i think you're on the right path w/ upgrades - that is, upgrade your best sqns w/ your best planes, but leave enough of those planes in the pool to make up for combat losses. if you find you're taking hvy losses, mebbe withdraw the sqns? let your LCUs absorb the bomb-damage, keep your sqns out of harm's way.

i rode a v. conservative route w/ my China fighters, kept them well to the rear, 'til their BFs were filled out, morale'd up, & moved to built-up bases in SW China. i declined to fight the skies in China early-war, & minimized a/c loss. now i have 11 sqns of 'modern' fighters in SW China, 8 are ruling in local CAP, 3 are training 100' sweep for Defense skill.


(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 19
RE: Chinese Corps Divided - 7/31/2012 9:46:32 PM   
crsutton


Posts: 6203
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Chinese Infantry squads do not differentiate between the years. They have the same name but your /A could be 41 type but the /B could be later.

Alfred

Good point. In Babes they do, but in stock scenarios you will have to use Tracker and look up the units in question. But even if they have the same names (with no year indicated, as in Scenario 1), the code will still put in the **.


witpqs,

You are correct. However my recollection is (a) dr.hal is playing an earlier version before the marks indicating the state of affairs were introduced, and (b) he is playing one of the officical scenarios.

Alfred




My stock scen 2 game is in late 43 and my chinese squads being produced now are "43 Chinese Inf Squads, and are labled as such. Next upgrade type is 45 Chinese Inf squad due out soon.

Potential problem spots are the 37 to 57 AT gun upgrade and the 75mm to 105mm artillery upgrade. The rate of production is so slow that if you get one unit upgrade and not the others, you may wait forever.

< Message edited by crsutton -- 7/31/2012 9:48:05 PM >

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