Matrix Games Forums

Characters of World War 1Sign of for the Pike and Shot Beta!More Games are Coming to Steam! Deal of the Week: Combat Command Return to the Moon on October 31st! Commander: The Great War iPad Wallpapers Generals of the Great WarDeal of the Week Panzer CorpsNew Strategy Titles Join the FamilyTablet Version of Qvadriga gets new patch
Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

HQ overpowered

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Decisive Campaigns: Case Blue >> HQ overpowered Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 8:07:08 PM   
Templer


Posts: 945
Joined: 1/5/2009
From: Nürnberg, Germany
Status: offline
I often use HQs for attack and defense and thus achieved considerable success.

Is it just me, or even think other, HQs are simply too strong to in the game?
Post #: 1
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 8:13:34 PM   
alex0809

 

Posts: 72
Joined: 5/15/2012
Status: offline
Well, they are strangely useful if you overpower the enemy anyway and just need another side for the multiple sides attack bonus that's true
But if the HQ staff is killed the HQ will be less effective, so actual combat other than destroying small pockets imho not worth it.

If your question is whether the HQ is too strong in combat REGARDLESS of the side effect that your staff might be killed, I'd just say - the infantry of the HQ IS still regular infantry that can fight, so I don't see why it would be unreasonable ;)

(in reply to Templer)
Post #: 2
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 8:32:35 PM   
Keunert


Posts: 876
Joined: 9/9/2010
Status: offline
i would never ever use them for this role. they are far to important to use it in such a way. only exception under certain circumstances: positioning them in a way that makes a retreat impossible and thus forcing an ennemy unit to surrender.

but what i slowly have to accept is the use of artillery, aa, and at units as defenders in the front row without further protection. like any other units, if you attack them without reducing readiness and entrenchment before they will handle you heavy losses.

(in reply to alex0809)
Post #: 3
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 8:51:53 PM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 4870
Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline
Yes, they feel overpowered based on my limited experience so far.

_____________________________

We don't stop playing games because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing games - Anon.

WitE Alpha/Beta Tester

(in reply to Keunert)
Post #: 4
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 9:04:56 PM   
amatteucci

 

Posts: 316
Joined: 5/14/2000
From: ITALY
Status: offline
Ditto. I attacked a single German Corps HQ (unsupplied) after heavy air attacks, with a couple divisions and wasn't able to force a surrender (or retreat, and it had no hex to retreat into) for two times. I had to use almost a third of the Coastal Army to elimitate it!
Also, artillery units seems too resilent when attacked by other ground troops.

(in reply to elmo3)
Post #: 5
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 10:32:02 PM   
redmarkus4


Posts: 4084
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: 0.00
Status: offline
But an HQ represents all the support units, training cadres, replacements etc. in the Korps. Real life HQs do fight when they have to and they can fight effectively.

_____________________________

Cyberpower tower PC
Intel Core i7-3930k CPU, 3.20GHz processor
32 GB RAM
2TB HD
2xNVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 graphics cards, each with 4095 MB
Realtek sound card
Dell 3007WFP (running at 2560x1600) 32 bit monitor
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit O

(in reply to amatteucci)
Post #: 6
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 11:09:21 PM   
elmo3

 

Posts: 4870
Joined: 1/22/2002
Status: offline
Maybe so but Corps and Army HQ's were never in the front lines on attack as they can be used now.

_____________________________

We don't stop playing games because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing games - Anon.

WitE Alpha/Beta Tester

(in reply to redmarkus4)
Post #: 7
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/28/2012 11:57:49 PM   
Scouseair68


Posts: 42
Joined: 3/25/2008
From: Cardiff, UK
Status: offline
Maybe make them unable to attack...only defend?

(in reply to elmo3)
Post #: 8
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 12:25:12 AM   
Templer


Posts: 945
Joined: 1/5/2009
From: Nürnberg, Germany
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

But an HQ represents all the support units, training cadres, replacements etc. in the Korps. Real life HQs do fight when they have to and they can fight effectively.

Yes, but you just look at the amount and composition of these troops.
Not exactly an elite group!

(in reply to redmarkus4)
Post #: 9
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 1:31:44 AM   
Jeffrey H.


Posts: 2855
Joined: 4/13/2007
From: San Diego, Ca.
Status: offline
This is a problem that goes back at least all the way back to the original AT-WWII, they are far too powerful in combat. Strangely, the AI in AT and ATG realizes this ond often builds them in massive quantities and just squats in cities.



_____________________________

"Games lubricate the body and the mind" Ben Franklin.

(in reply to Templer)
Post #: 10
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 1:35:41 AM   
Templer


Posts: 945
Joined: 1/5/2009
From: Nürnberg, Germany
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

This is a problem that goes back at least all the way back to the original AT-WWII, they are far too powerful in combat. Strangely, the AI in AT and ATG realizes this ond often builds them in massive quantities and just squats in cities.

Thank you.
Maybe someone will solve this problem soon.

(in reply to Jeffrey H.)
Post #: 11
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 10:14:49 AM   
Blind Sniper


Posts: 760
Joined: 8/9/2008
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline
In the meantime it is easily addressed with a SSR, no HQ in attack.

< Message edited by Blind Sniper -- 7/29/2012 10:16:37 AM >


_____________________________

Advanced Squad Leader; Grand Tactical Series; Buzz Aldrin's Space Program Manager; War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition


(in reply to Templer)
Post #: 12
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 10:34:53 AM   
Keunert


Posts: 876
Joined: 9/9/2010
Status: offline
i wouldn't mind an opponent attacking with his HQ. if i manage to encircle one and destroy it he will be punished enough for taking this risk.

(in reply to Blind Sniper)
Post #: 13
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 11:21:52 AM   
Blind Sniper


Posts: 760
Joined: 8/9/2008
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Keunert

i wouldn't mind an opponent attacking with his HQ. if i manage to encircle one and destroy it he will be punished enough for taking this risk.


Sure, but I'm speaking when your opponent use it to encircle and destroy your unit.

I remember that in the previous title (WtP) you could use the engineer as scout unit given that even if attacked they were able to stand most the time, I thrown against this eng unit three French Cavalry units (they were brigade IIRC) and not only I lost the combat but I suffered more losses


< Message edited by Blind Sniper -- 7/29/2012 11:22:10 AM >


_____________________________

Advanced Squad Leader; Grand Tactical Series; Buzz Aldrin's Space Program Manager; War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition


(in reply to Keunert)
Post #: 14
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 11:52:55 AM   
Vic


Posts: 3632
Joined: 5/17/2004
Status: offline
@all,

I am going to make artillery,staff and flak a little bit more vulnerable in direct combat in probably patch 2.

best,
Vic

_____________________________

Victor Reijkersz Designs
www.vrdesigns.nl

(in reply to Blind Sniper)
Post #: 15
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 11:55:57 AM   
Blind Sniper


Posts: 760
Joined: 8/9/2008
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline
Thanks Vic, great support

_____________________________

Advanced Squad Leader; Grand Tactical Series; Buzz Aldrin's Space Program Manager; War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition


(in reply to Vic)
Post #: 16
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 2:50:03 PM   
Templer


Posts: 945
Joined: 1/5/2009
From: Nürnberg, Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Vic

@all,

I am going to make artillery,staff and flak a little bit more vulnerable in direct combat in probably patch 2.

best,
Vic

Proposal:
How about weaken the staff on defense a bit but weaken the staff extremely on offence?
Sounds realistic to me.

< Message edited by Templer -- 7/29/2012 2:52:38 PM >

(in reply to Vic)
Post #: 17
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 3:17:51 PM   
ComradeP

 

Posts: 7166
Joined: 9/17/2009
Status: offline
Why not remove most if not all of the infantry from HQ's? Another option would be giving them secondary infantry.

< Message edited by ComradeP -- 7/29/2012 3:18:46 PM >


_____________________________

SSG tester
WitE Alpha tester
Panzer Corps Beta tester
Unity of Command scenario designer

(in reply to Templer)
Post #: 18
RE: HQ overpowered - 7/29/2012 10:09:19 PM   
WilliePete

 

Posts: 254
Joined: 8/27/2010
Status: offline
just start off by doing what you proposed and see how they feel. Don't go crazy, I actually like them like they are now ;)

_____________________________

- They That Sow The Wind, Shall Reap The Whirlwind -

(in reply to Vic)
Post #: 19
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/1/2012 8:25:33 PM   
Ritterkrieg

 

Posts: 86
Joined: 8/15/2009
Status: offline
+1 on the HQ/ART units too strong!

Realistically, there isn't much chance an HQ should be able to resist fleeing before a 3-stack tank attack but it happens now a lot!

Troy

(in reply to WilliePete)
Post #: 20
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/1/2012 8:43:21 PM   
olivier34

 

Posts: 1002
Joined: 5/10/2010
From: montpellier
Status: offline
I have played a lot DC1 and now this game and I never thought to use my HQs in a "combat" offensive role . But I have often realise that HQs were quiet hard to destroy. I think that they should not be abble to attack. Maybe they could lose command points if they are near an ennemy unit and they should retreat easily when under attack.

(in reply to Ritterkrieg)
Post #: 21
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/2/2012 6:14:32 AM   
redmarkus4


Posts: 4084
Joined: 12/1/2007
From: 0.00
Status: offline
Should be easy to create a new SFT called Rear Area Troops and give it a reasonable defense setting but zero attack points, then assign these to the HQ TOE...?

_____________________________

Cyberpower tower PC
Intel Core i7-3930k CPU, 3.20GHz processor
32 GB RAM
2TB HD
2xNVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 graphics cards, each with 4095 MB
Realtek sound card
Dell 3007WFP (running at 2560x1600) 32 bit monitor
Windows 7 Professional 64-bit O

(in reply to olivier34)
Post #: 22
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/2/2012 1:51:35 PM   
ComradeP

 

Posts: 7166
Joined: 9/17/2009
Status: offline
I'm currently running a test where HQ's don't have infantry attached to them. It works well thus far.

One thing that shouldn't be overlooked is that experience is averaged, instead of being counted per element, so if a HQ attracts infantry replacements, its experience goes down and thus its command bonus, even though neither the staff nor commander were changed.

_____________________________

SSG tester
WitE Alpha tester
Panzer Corps Beta tester
Unity of Command scenario designer

(in reply to redmarkus4)
Post #: 23
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/2/2012 1:56:15 PM   
Blind Sniper


Posts: 760
Joined: 8/9/2008
From: Turin, Italy
Status: offline
Good to know, better stop any replacements requirement then.

< Message edited by Blind Sniper -- 8/2/2012 1:57:33 PM >


_____________________________

Advanced Squad Leader; Grand Tactical Series; Buzz Aldrin's Space Program Manager; War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition


(in reply to ComradeP)
Post #: 24
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/2/2012 2:03:26 PM   
Vic


Posts: 3632
Joined: 5/17/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: ComradeP
One thing that shouldn't be overlooked is that experience is averaged, instead of being counted per element, so if a HQ attracts infantry replacements, its experience goes down and thus its command bonus, even though neither the staff nor commander were changed.


Are you really sure? this is not intended behaviour.


_____________________________

Victor Reijkersz Designs
www.vrdesigns.nl

(in reply to ComradeP)
Post #: 25
RE: HQ overpowered - 8/2/2012 2:21:02 PM   
ComradeP

 

Posts: 7166
Joined: 9/17/2009
Status: offline
All HQ's that pulled replacements for themselves during my 1st Panzer Army campaign suffered a drop in experience levels and command bonus.

The system seems to see only 1 experience level for the entire unit, and substracts a couple of points from it when replacements are added just like with any other unit. You can lose part of the effect of a Personnel card again the next turn that way.

1st Panzer Army HQ in particular suffered significant drops in experience and thus in command bonus.

< Message edited by ComradeP -- 8/2/2012 2:22:21 PM >


_____________________________

SSG tester
WitE Alpha tester
Panzer Corps Beta tester
Unity of Command scenario designer

(in reply to Vic)
Post #: 26
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Decisive Campaigns: Case Blue >> HQ overpowered Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.102