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Can IJN ships withdraw?

 
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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Scenario Design and Modding >> Can IJN ships withdraw? Page: [1]
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Can IJN ships withdraw? - 7/20/2012 10:30:47 PM   
Shark7


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Title is self explanatory. And by withdraw I mean be removed from the map. If not, then I think I have a work around to add in German ships that can be withdrawn, but if the ships can be withdrawn and be removed from map then it won't matter.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 7/20/2012 11:09:20 PM   
JeffK


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I would assume they can.

You set a withdrawal date in the editor, but would they have to be in port in Tokyo to be able to be withdrawn?

Maybe an unknown as normally, JFB are not looking at withdrawing even a fishing boat.


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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 7/21/2012 1:47:55 AM   
ckammp

 

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Japanese ships cannot withdraw.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 7/21/2012 12:39:39 PM   
Shark7


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Plan B it is then:

At withdrawal time, have the ships upgrade to barges and rename. Its a work around that should work if house rules are followed.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 7/31/2012 8:07:36 PM   
el cid again

 

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Japanese ships certainly have the field required to be set to withdraw. The problem is, where could you send the ship
to 'withdraw' it? Axis ships cannot leave the main map. This is a problem for RTN ships - which need to withdraw on a
certain date. [Thai resistance is in fact led by the commander of RTN! On 22 June 1944, the resistance becomes overt,
and Phibun falls from power] The conversion idea is a good one.


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Internment? - 8/1/2012 12:06:15 AM   
el cid again

 

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How about this: Instead of requireing a ship convert, simply rename it?

Conversion has costs. By the time Axis ships should withdraw, it is late in the war,
and Japan will have problems finding undamaged shipyards, and the points, to repair
ships. Repairing ships that are of no use is not going to be popular - or easy.

Instead, rename the ship.

For German subs, simply give them I numbers - in many cases the real one. Assume
the Japanese 'take over' the vessel. German surface ships can do the same, or be
treated like Thai ships below - modder's choice. The rename should occur about 7 May
1945 - some countries count 8 May (the signing in Berlin) and Russians count 9 May
(the date it was in Moscow when signed).

For Thai ships, rename them as a clue for the player. This probably should occur on 22 June
1944. You might name them "Interned DD" or something else clearly saying their status.
IF in port, it is simply against the house rule to form them into a Task Force. You could even
go farther and require they be in port on that date - but the point of the name change is -
the player might not realize it. IF at sea - the rule requires the ship head to the nearest port
and auto-disband. If in a TF with non Thai ships, it must leave that TF and form a new, all
Thai one.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 3:55:03 AM   
el cid again

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

Plan B it is then:

At withdrawal time, have the ships upgrade to barges and rename. Its a work around that should work if house rules are followed.



How do you rename a ship? There is no obvious mechanism.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 4:44:58 PM   
Shark7


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For one, it would be an upgrade that changes the class of the ship to another.

As far as the renaming, haven't tested it yet, but the blanks for renaming are in there.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 5:31:36 PM   
Gary Childress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

For one, it would be an upgrade that changes the class of the ship to another.

As far as the renaming, haven't tested it yet, but the blanks for renaming are in there.


Where do you see blanks for renaming? I'm looking in the editor at the "ships" tab and I don't see anything.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 7:40:36 PM   
JuanG


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As far as I know, the only ships that can be renamed are those in the build que with a 'II' or 'III' in their name.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 8:32:22 PM   
el cid again

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

For one, it would be an upgrade that changes the class of the ship to another.

As far as the renaming, haven't tested it yet, but the blanks for renaming are in there.


Where do you see blanks for renaming? I'm looking in the editor at the "ships" tab and I don't see anything.


There is a blank field under the ship name field, but the field to the left - which might be a date field - won't allow
entry - and without a date - I don't think it ever can take effect. I can't find any case where renaming is done
other than the case where a US (or possibly Allied) ship ends in II - and then a PLAYER is allowed to rename it -
it isn't defined by the modder at all. So far, I have done things like "I-68 later I-168" to indicate both names.
In this case, I would like to rename KM U-195 as I-506 on 7 May, 1945 (or possibly one day different), to tell the player
the ship is now IJN vice KM. Or to rename a RTN ship from HTMS (His Majisty's Thai Ship) abcd to "Interned abcd"
to say "leave in port, do not form into a TF" to the player on 22 June, 1944. It was a wonderful suggestion - but
there does not seem to be a way to implement it. There is no discussion of renaming in the (admittedly incomplete)
Editor manual. The manual also simply says that a certain field is a "withdrawall date" field without mentioning it
does not work for Axis ships. But while it triggers a notice to the player for Allied ships, data in the field is ignored
for Axis as far as I can tell. Nor do I see HOW one could actually withdraw an Axis ship - since they cannot leave the
map - nor where would they do that that would be logical - if allowed? RHS has an Axis Entry Point (Amsterdam Island)
but it hardly makes sense as a withdrawall point for - say - an RTN ship. So the renaming option was nice - but can
it be done?

< Message edited by el cid again -- 8/1/2012 8:36:09 PM >

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 8:58:47 PM   
JuanG


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quote:

ORIGINAL: el cid again
There is a blank field under the ship name field, but the field to the left - which might be a date field - won't allow entry - and without a date - I don't think it ever can take effect.


I'm fairly certain both of those are totally inert; as a general rule every field from the editor shows up in the .csv files (and then some; for example sub depths and weapon secondary data only show in .csv). I haven't found anything to suggest these fields actually work or save anything to the scenario, so I would guess they are just unused interface elements.

quote:

I can't find any case where renaming is done
other than the case where a US (or possibly Allied) ship ends in II - and then a PLAYER is allowed to rename it


It does not have to be allied or US. This works for any ship in the build que with a II or III in it.

This is how I will set up my 'launch as hull, convert to ship' system in my mod.

For example, there might be a hull named 'II Large Cruiser Hull (Ibuki)', that arrives half a year before that ships commission date. The II indicates its an empty hull, and makes it easy to sort, the Large Cruiser Hull is the type, and the name in brackets is the historical name of the completed ship (in this case the CA->CVL conversion Ibuki). Before the hull arrives the player can rename it what he wants, and can then convert it to one of several options; all suitable for a ~12,000ton hull.

< Message edited by JuanG -- 8/1/2012 9:01:47 PM >


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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/1/2012 10:24:35 PM   
US87891

 

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Remember a discussion about this a little over a year ago. IIRC JuanG was involved and everyone ended up with this same method. Don't know how long JuanG has been doing this, but Babes people have this in their toolbox for over a year now and it works perfectly well.

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RE: Can IJN ships withdraw? - 8/2/2012 1:05:32 AM   
Shark7


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Actually, if you put a number corresponding to a slot in the editor in those blanks under the name, it will bring up the ship in that slot...along with what class it is.

As to whether or not it actually does anything... only one of the devs can tell us for sure.

And even if they can't be renamed, they can at least be rendered 'inert' by making them into a barge or similar. After all, what's one more IJN barge in 1945 except a small target?

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