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NATO Icons confusion

 
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NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 3:59:29 AM   
jomni


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This is my first try in the series. But I have played ATG and I'm glad the UI is same.

But the NATO icons in DC is not dynamic. It does not conform to the elements inside the unit.
This means ARTY units still get INF or ARM NATO icons just because they are part of an INF / ARM Division.
I noticed that there's a little icon on the side to indicate that they are artillery.

Same goes with tanks, etc. I need to check the small icons on the side to see if they are PZ (tank) or Infantry to make sure what type of unit they are.
I've been fooled several times in my first game thinking that the unit is a tank unit only to find out that they are motorized infantry.

Now why not just change the NATO icon itself to skip this extra step? If you say it helps to keep organized and to easily know that they are part of a tank division, then we already have the counter highlights for that right?

Anyway, I guess I'll just have to get used to it. Sorry for the ranting.

< Message edited by jomni -- 7/19/2012 4:01:42 AM >


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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 5:07:08 AM   
Flaviusx


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Yes this convention is somewhat confusing. Less so for the Soviets than the Axis, but it's not very user friendly either way.



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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 8:29:00 AM   
PirateJock


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I've fallen foul to that a couple of times as well. However the silouhette counters does show the right unit type ... unfortunately they don't have the Division designation on them like the NATO counters Otherwise I may have been able to *force* myself to play with silouhettes

Cheers

Edit: the silouhette does show Division if showing counters stacked at max zoom but not if you're showing max zoom unstacked (Key 3 toggle). Basically it would be less confusing showing the correct NATO symbol for the unit type irrespective of divisional designation.

< Message edited by PirateJock -- 7/19/2012 8:46:49 AM >


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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 10:36:15 AM   
Vic


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This has been an issue of quite some debate for the previous game Decisive Campaigns : Warsaw To Paris.

Yes regimental units show their divisional NATO symbol...

Its a concious design choice and trade off. I think changing the nato graphic on a unit per unit basis makes it hard to quickly at a glance see where the whole (all units) division is.

It is something that could be quite easily modded if you really want to have more clarity. By changing the nato graphics 11.png and 16.png and give them some bright background or other large graphic to make them more obvious.

Best,
Vic


< Message edited by Vic -- 7/19/2012 10:37:14 AM >


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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 11:18:39 AM   
balto

 

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As Pirate Jock says, if you ZOOM in, you see.

I also ZOOM in, and toggle back and forth keys 1 and 2 several times so I get both NATO and Silouhettes. It is a little cumbersome, but there is never a misunderstanding that way.

I think it would be a good idea what when you are in the ATTACK screens and selecting units that you be able to toggle NATO (2) and Silouhettes (1). Presently, that is disabled when in the ATTACK screen.

< Message edited by balto -- 7/19/2012 11:26:56 AM >

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 6:30:04 PM   
Arinvald


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Yeah I think the Infantry NATO symbol for Artillery is very confusing because the Infantry symbol is so prominent and the little A beside it can get lost at a casual glance. I don't understand why the colored Division Bar is not enough to identify the parent Division. I don't have the game yet but eating up all the info I can on the game so maybe I am not understanding the issue correctly. Really need to wait until next week to order but you guys are making it very difficult.

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/19/2012 11:29:17 PM   
WilliePete

 

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I don't think it's really a big issue at all. Prior to reading this topic, I never even thought about it. Each infantry, motorized and armor unit will have it's organic artillery, and you just need to keep that in mind. After all, the main Nato symbol showing should be that of the parent unit showing what type of division it is, Infantry, Armor or Motorized. I like it fine the way it is!

If you like you can double-click on the unit name and change it! This is perfect for naming each regiment with their historical unit numbers for easier identification. However, this still will not make is easier to pick a unit out at a distance.

By the way, just buy the game. If you like this type of wargame, then CB is a no brainer. I just can't think of any other PC wargame out now that is this good!

< Message edited by WilliePete -- 7/20/2012 5:39:01 AM >


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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 3:20:24 AM   
jomni


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

Yeah I think the Infantry NATO symbol for Artillery is very confusing because the Infantry symbol is so prominent and the little A beside it can get lost at a casual glance. I don't understand why the colored Division Bar is not enough to identify the parent Division. I don't have the game yet but eating up all the info I can on the game so maybe I am not understanding the issue correctly. Really need to wait until next week to order but you guys are making it very difficult.


Just buy the game. Now that you're aware of this, it's just a matter of getting used to the system.

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 4:15:28 AM   
Arinvald


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jomni


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

Yeah I think the Infantry NATO symbol for Artillery is very confusing because the Infantry symbol is so prominent and the little A beside it can get lost at a casual glance. I don't understand why the colored Division Bar is not enough to identify the parent Division. I don't have the game yet but eating up all the info I can on the game so maybe I am not understanding the issue correctly. Really need to wait until next week to order but you guys are making it very difficult.


Just buy the game. Now that you're aware of this, it's just a matter of getting used to the system.

quote:

Just buy the game. Now that you're aware of this, it's just a matter of getting used to the system.



Well I cracked and bought it tonight. Yes I am weak but this just seems too good not to grab asap.

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 7:01:41 AM   
redmarkus4


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Welcome!

Here's why I like the game timescale. It gives you enough time to make smaller pockets, but it's tough to pocket a whole Soviet Army in one turn. The enemy has a chance to extract at least some of its forces, but not all.

I find this satisfying and there is a tension while you wait for the turn to resolve to see whether your pincers are still there and where the enemy is.




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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 7:53:20 AM   
glvaca

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald


Well I cracked and bought it tonight. Yes I am weak but this just seems too good not to grab asap.


No worries, you are in the company of weak men!

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 10:26:05 AM   
PirateJock


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

Well I cracked and bought it tonight. Yes I am weak but this just seems too good not to grab asap.

Join the club ... now have you seen the first game in the series, The Blitzkreig from Warsaw to Paris? They were doing a $10 discount on it last time I looked ... where's that devil smiley

Cheers

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 10:29:14 AM   
PirateJock


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jomni
... Now that you're aware of this, it's just a matter of getting used to the system.

Agreed.

Cheers

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 10:34:19 AM   
sanderz

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: redmarkus4

Welcome!

Here's why I like the game timescale. It gives you enough time to make smaller pockets, but it's tough to pocket a whole Soviet Army in one turn. The enemy has a chance to extract at least some of its forces, but not all.

I find this satisfying and there is a tension while you wait for the turn to resolve to see whether your pincers are still there and where the enemy is.





Am at work at the moment so can't access the game - quick question - is the different terrain colour for enemy territory one of your mods or is it a standard in game option?

Thanks

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 2:19:48 PM   
Arinvald


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PirateJock

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

Well I cracked and bought it tonight. Yes I am weak but this just seems too good not to grab asap.

Join the club ... now have you seen the first game in the series, The Blitzkreig from Warsaw to Paris? They were doing a $10 discount on it last time I looked ... where's that devil smiley


Hmm, I may need to purchase that as well. Thanks for the heads-up. This system just seems so sweet.

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RE: NATO Icons confusion - 7/20/2012 2:25:23 PM   
LarryP


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quote:

ORIGINAL: glvaca


quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald


Well I cracked and bought it tonight. Yes I am weak but this just seems too good not to grab asap.


No worries, you are in the company of weak men!


Hey, I cracked! Temptation was just too much for me...

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