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Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace!

 
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Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 9:41:48 PM   
Gary Childress


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Just when you thought it was safe to go swimming in the Pacific!




THAT'S RIGHT FOLKS, THIS MOD IS BRAVE! IT'S DARING! IT'S SIMPLE AND............................


IT'S HISTORICALLY COMPLETE DONKEY EXCREMENT!


THE ALTERNATIVE HISTORY OF WW 2:


A LONG TIME AGO... IN A GALAXY FAR FAR AWAY...

Queen Amadala...err...The roaring twenties almost collapse into a horrific Great Depression. State socialism begins to take root in much of the civilized world and thanks to massive government intervention in the world economies, the nations of the world manage to pull out of an economic nose dive. With greatly increased spending on their war machines, an artificial boom is created in the late 1920s through 1930s, leading up to a turbulent future. Attempts are made to stem the tide of militarism but none of the participant nations are able to come to any arms limitation agreements. In 1922 The Washington Treaty falls dead on its inception. A second attempt in London in 1930 fails as well.

A new age of naval experimentalism begins to take shape. Without treaties limiting their size and guns, the line between cruisers and capital ships slowly begins to fade as newer and heavier cruisers, mounting larger and larger guns and armor begin to appear. In 1932, after reviving the German economy Hitler and the National Socialist party begin a massive rearmament of Germany. Almost immediately the Z plan is put into effect to rebuild the German navy to make it once again a contender for world domination of the ocean.

Meanwhile Japan's 8-8-8 plan takes on a life of its own with the design in 1930 of the Yamato class 18" super Battleship. A new type of warship has also begun to emerge. The aircraft carrier begins to take shape. Immediately the navies of the world begin to see its potential.

In September 1939 Germany invades Poland. The next spring, France falls. Fortunately this time the French colonies doggedly resist German occupation of their homeland and continue on helping in the Allied war effort to liberate France. The remnants of the French Navy seek shelter in the Caribbean and Pacific from the German juggernaut. Hitler wisely decides not to invade the USSR and the USSR stays neutral for the entire war. Instead Hitler decides to concentrate his efforts on conquering the oil rich Middle East. After taking Malta, and Gibraltar the Africa Corps defeat Montgomery and the 8th Army. In the ensuing rout of the British army Germany takes control of the Middle East and India. The British Isles remarkably hang on and defeat operation Sea Lion in 1940 and again in 1941. However, the British Empire is in ruins. By August 1942, all that remains of the commonwealth are the home Isles, British Africa, Australia, Canada and Malaysia.

In the fall of 1942 things quiet down as Hitler contemplates his next moves. The British are in no position to move against Fortress Europe and the Soviets seem content to sit back and watch as the Western powers destroy each other. But to play it safe Hitler diverts substantial resources from fortress France to fortify Eastern Europe to ensure Stalin’s neutrality.

Unfortunately for the Japanese, Germany’s control of the Middle East doesn’t do Japan a whole of good. China, French Indochina and British Malaysia stand in the way to stop precious German oil from reaching them and there is only one logical course of action left. The Japanese must seize control of the supply lines from the Middle East to the homeland. Everyone knows this so no one is caught off guard on December 6th 1942 when the Japanese finally declare war on the Allies and the US.

It’s December 7th 1942, Admiral, the fate of the world hangs in the balance.



Plan 8-8-8 Light has been posted to my website: https://sites.google.com/site/garyswitpsite/

Plan 8-8-8 Light is simply the addition of numerous extra battleships to the stock game and was simply a quick and easy mod to incorporate some new art. Plan 8-8-8 Deluxe will feature an almost complete reworking of the entire WITP database.

CREDITS: Big B, Tomlabel and JWE are mostly to thank for the ship art in this mod, most of the ships are simply reworks of their magnificent art for AE.
Thank you Cathartes for the wonderful plane tops as well as all the stock AE plane sides (except for the Germans and Italians which are my doing). German and Italian plane sides are here thanks to all the wonderful and talented artists on the Internet who have posted their art, which I've combed through and resized and brushed up for my own uses. I wish I knew who the artists were but I have no idea. I've just collected a lot of sides in my scouring of the Internet over the years.

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 5/13/2013 3:59:18 AM >


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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 10:04:28 PM   
Norm3


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Souds like fun.

I guess modding the effects of ginger might be a little difficult. . .

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 10:17:00 PM   
Gary Childress


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IT CAME FROM MATRIX GAMES!!

OK. Not really. This is all my doing. I apologize for this attrocity.

Here's the battleship lineup. Basically all beligerants get their wet dreams. We have the Japanese 8-8-8 plan with the Yamatos taking the place of the originally planned No. 13 hulls.

NOTE: Yellow highlight denotes allied ships which will start the game in the Pacific. Red highlight denotes Allied ships which will not show up at all in the pacific.

SPECIAL THANKS TO BIG B!

Where possible I used his warship art for my alternative ships. Everything else (including most of the carriers) are purely my confabulations based upon existing AE art.




Attachment (1)

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 10:18:50 PM   
Gary Childress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Norm3

Souds like fun.

I guess modding the effects of ginger might be a little difficult. . .


Many thanks. I'll try to upload it somewhere when I get the last touches done (just in case there are other insane people out there in WITP-land who might like to play it. I plan on doing an AAR on this one.

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 10:52:57 PM   
Gary Childress


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DON'T WORRY FOLKS! THIS MOD IS SUBJECT TO THE STRICTEST QUALITY STANDARDS. THERE ARE SOME THINGS YOU JUST CAN'T BUY AND WE'VE GOT THE MOST SOPHISTICATED ART AND SPECIAL AFFECTS LACK OF MONEY WILL GET YOU!

Here's the carrier lineup. Again yellow highlight denotes ships that start the game in theater and red denotes ships that will not be part of the game but which are part of the OOB of the various beligerants invovled.




Attachment (1)

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 11:01:49 PM   
Gary Childress


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Here's the conversion lineup. Basically all these ships will convert into each other so if you're running low on ARs or CVLs you can just make more! (subject to certain time restrictions: 300 days typically per conversion)





Attachment (1)

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/17/2012 11:06:44 PM   
Gary Childress


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That's it for now. I hope to have the finishing touches done in the next couple days. Just need to add the airgroups for the new carriers and delete airgroups from ships no longer existing.

Basically to sum up:

Everything will be the same as with the stock AE game, EXCEPT the new battleship lineup, carrier lineup and conversion ships lineup. Naval airgroups are being altered to fit the new carriers.

I've deleted all the original ships which are no longer in the game such as the Iowa class BBs, North Carolina class, etc. What you see in the charts above are all the BBs, all the CVs and all the conversion ships which will be present in game. I'll set up a chart for new carrier airgroups next.

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 12:54:20 AM   
JuanG


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Is the Yamato class 4x2 18" correct? The ship image seems more like 3x3, so just curious.

Also, any details on tonnages and protection for the later classes and rebuilt early ones?

< Message edited by JuanG -- 7/18/2012 12:55:16 AM >


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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 1:48:38 AM   
Gary Childress


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Woops, you're right, that's an old table. I was going to use the No.13 design of 4 x 2 18" but then decided to go with Yamato's 3 x 3 18". I posted the wrong template. I htought I had corrected that. Guess not.

For tonnages I'm using what I can find on the net and eyeballing the rest based upon existing data in the AE database. Trying to be conservative in my guestimates.

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 1:55:55 AM   
Gary Childress


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One thing to note. I will be doing a little reworking of some ofthe airgroups. I counted up all the existing airframes for both side starting on 12/7/1941 and will be using the exact same number of planes, maybe a bit more are going to be piloted and less in reserve but the number of planes will remain the same.

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 2:06:44 AM   
Gary Childress


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Here's the new battleship table. This one has the correct stats for the Yamatos.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 7/18/2012 2:08:26 AM >


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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 2:43:16 AM   
wsoxfan

 

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Hi,
This mod is off to a good start. However, I find it odd that all of the big three took a break in building battleships for thirteen years. In addition, it seems odd that the United States would build 9 battleships in one class. So for future updates I'd add some more classes of battleships (JuanG's Ultimate BBs WNT variant has some good examples), bigger crusiers (one thing that the London treaties did was that they really limited the tonnage of cruisers, so get rid of that and you could easily see 12 inch crusiers) and bigger guns (If the USN was researching main armanment during the 1920s and 1930s, they would have had at least 18"). And this might be to much to ask, but could you somehow throw in the Tillman IV proposal? The one with the fifteen 18"guns(Boise on steroids)? Finally, will there be less advanced aircraft to start with in this mod?

EDIT: If the game becomes to overbalanced, you could set an activation date for the UK so Japan can maintain it's early advantage

< Message edited by wsoxfan -- 7/18/2012 2:45:28 AM >

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RE: Plan 8-8-8 From Outerspace! - 7/18/2012 3:05:32 AM   
Gary Childress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wsoxfan

Hi,
This mod is off to a good start. However, I find it odd that all of the big three took a break in building battleships for thirteen years. In addition, it seems odd that the United States would build 9 battleships in one class. So for future updates I'd add some more classes of battleships (JuanG's Ultimate BBs WNT variant has some good examples), bigger crusiers (one thing that the London treaties did was that they really limited the tonnage of cruisers, so get rid of that and you could easily see 12 inch crusiers) and bigger guns (If the USN was researching main armanment during the 1920s and 1930s, they would have had at least 18"). And this might be to much to ask, but could you somehow throw in the Tillman IV proposal? The one with the fifteen 18"guns(Boise on steroids)? Finally, will there be less advanced aircraft to start with in this mod?

EDIT: If the game becomes to overbalanced, you could set an activation date for the UK so Japan can maintain it's early advantage


Hi wsoxfan,

Thanks for your input. You have some good points.

1. The building break: I may just stretch the dates along further for the existing ships so that their build dates are more fluid running up to 1941 and there aren't any real breaks. I don't think I want a mod with a couple hundred battleships in it. I want the IJN to stick with the 8-8-8 plan and the US and Britain to each have a few more than the Japanese.

2. The 9 battleship class: Actually it's 8 ships in the class equalling 2 battle divisions. The class is standardized to speed up wartime production. IRL the US didn't really respond to the IJN 18" BBs even though the treaties were defunkt and the US maybe could have. Instead we made the Iowas which were like improved South Dakotas I think. I could maybe split the American BBs into 2 classes of 4 ships each but I like the idea of a mass produced BB with 12 16" guns.

3. Aircraft: I'm not making any changes to either number of aircraft nor types. I will be shuffling around airgroups a little but the number of planes and types to start the mod will be the same.

Basically I got tired of flailing away at my super mod I was doing with the Germans and Italians included and decided to just do a quickie so I can play now. This mod is a modest compromise from what I had originally planned.

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More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/18/2012 6:50:19 AM   
Gary Childress


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This is sort of a bizzare idea I had regarding airgroups. Again this would be for a mod that is completely done just for fun and completely a-historical.

Basically I would put a large number of airgroups on the map. A few airgroups on the front line would be full strength with their full compliments of pilots and planes. Airgroups in the rear would have just one plane and pilot--sort of representing a token presence on the map. However, you would be able to flesh out some of the token units by requesting extra planes and pilots from the pool. Bascially you could have a large number of token airgroups but you couldn't fill them all with planes because the aircraft pool would be smaller than the number of aircraft needed to flesh out all the airgroups. As time goes by and more planes are produced by factories you would be able to flesh out more of your airgroups, unless of course you are losing a lot of planes in combat. In fact I could replace the tradition of having delayed airgroups by just placing a large number of groups on the map in the beginning but which couldn't be fleshed out but gradually over time.

Aircraft production would be historical. So for instance I count a total of 275 A6M2s on the map in the beginning of the stock Grand Campaign. Some of those would be assigned to front line groups but the remainder, say a hundred or so would be left in the pool to fill out whichever rear echelon groups you want to fill out.

What do others think of this idea? I know it's unorthodox and gamey but it might be a fun, rather than just sitting back and waiting for groups to arrive on a pre-determined schedule.

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 6:45:23 AM   
DivePac88


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Give me, give me... give me!


I too am very interested in playing this mod, as it is the most realistic BB mod I've seen.

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 5:22:35 PM   
Shark7


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Gary, any objections to us using your ship sides in our own mods?

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 6:58:01 PM   
Gary Childress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shark7

Gary, any objections to us using your ship sides in our own mods?


No objections. Anyone can use whatever art they want from my mod. Here is the ship art for it. Some of it is Big B's stuff.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 7/19/2012 6:59:08 PM >


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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 7:19:22 PM   
Shark7


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Thank you very much

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 7:53:40 PM   
derhexer


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Gary I am really looking forward to this mod!! Thanks for working on it.

It looks nice and bloody

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 7:58:28 PM   
US87891

 

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The original art for AE was made by BigB, Tom Label, and JWE. They all made their work open-source, no Copyright. Anything that uses their art is free for use.

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 9:07:00 PM   
Gary Childress


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@ DivePac88 & derhexer: You guys are in luck. I'm almost finished on what I'm calling "Plan 8-8-8 Light" (It's less filling and plays great!). You might like it. It is stock scenario 1 with only the BB lineup changed. It's basically stock scenario 1 on steriods battleship-wise. It will feature all the BBs I've listed above. It will NOT feature any of the new carriers or conversions though. So it may be a bit more realistic than "Plan 8-8-8 Deluxe" which will feature a whole new ships, airgroup and LCU lineup.

I just need to finish a couple touches and then find a site on the Internet to upload the files.

WANTED: Does anyone out there in WITP-land have a website which they would be willing to allow me to upload my scenario to? Many thanks to any volunteers.

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/19/2012 10:25:20 PM   
DivePac88


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Thanks for you're hard-work there Gary, this is just the mod I've been hanging out for.

Sorry can't help you with a download site, other than I used Dropbox once to swap large files.

< Message edited by DivePac88 -- 7/19/2012 10:26:31 PM >


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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/20/2012 12:09:56 AM   
n01487477


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

WANTED: Does anyone out there in WITP-land have a website which they would be willing to allow me to upload my scenario to? Many thanks to any volunteers.

google.sites is a free hosting service using a gmail account. There are many others. I'd be willing to tack it onto my video portal or ask the Babes team ...




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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/20/2012 12:33:46 AM   
Gary Childress


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quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

WANTED: Does anyone out there in WITP-land have a website which they would be willing to allow me to upload my scenario to? Many thanks to any volunteers.

google.sites is a free hosting service using a gmail account. There are many others. I'd be willing to tack it onto my video portal or ask the Babes team ...





Thanks! I just created a Google site. I didn't see where it said how much space I get with the website though. Hopefully it's at least 50mb.

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/20/2012 9:23:00 AM   
icepharmy

 

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For an ultra/crazy version perhaps- I had to doublecheck if I was still on combinedfleet.com
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/furamain.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/usndex_f.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/dchdex_f.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/mindex_f.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/gbndex_f.htm
http://www.combinedfleet.com/furashita/pommer_f.htm

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/20/2012 11:36:18 PM   
Gary Childress


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I'm pleased to announce "Plan 8-8-8 Light" has been posted on my new Google Website. You can find it here:

https://sites.google.com/site/garyswitpsite/

Please let me know if anyone has trouble either downloading it or playing it. It hasn't been tested for play balance so please let me know if you think anything needs tweaking.

The scenario is basically just stock scenario 1 with some battleships added.

Below is a list of all the battleships included in the game.

Yellow highlight means the ship is present in theater on 12/7/1942
Light blue highlight the ship is present off map on 12/7/1942 (based at East Coast USA and United Kingdom).
Red highlight means the ship is in the country's OOB but will not show up in the pacific at all.
No highlight means the ship will eventually arrive in the Pacific theater.





PS if anyone should do an AAR on a game using this mod please let me know so I can follow it!

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 7/20/2012 11:38:55 PM >


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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/21/2012 9:15:39 AM   
inqistor


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I find your pictures choosing highly questionable.

Not only there are NO actual planners shown, but there are also no representation of day/night dichotomy.

And NO Bela Lugosi?


Back-on-topic:
Cut effect of anti-ship weapons, and increase damage of AA weapons. That way air will be far less effective.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gary Childress

Thanks! I just created a Google site. I didn't see where it said how much space I get with the website though. Hopefully it's at least 50mb.

It is shown somewhere during editing. Not much, IIRC 25 Mb.




Attachment (1)

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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/21/2012 4:19:58 PM   
John 3rd


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Looks absolutely BLOODY to me. Good luck with the Mod and have fun with it!


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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/23/2012 12:42:56 AM   
Gary Childress


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Well, I'm now working on "Plan 8-8-8 Deluxe". The Deluxe edition will be an almost complete rewrite of the LCUs, Airgroups, Ships and AI databases. I forsee many hours of labor in my future. I also forsee myself never finishing this. But it will be fun to play around with.

Anyway, this mod will include substantial forces from Germany, Italy and France in the game.

The problem is how to make it so that German and Italian units aren't utilizing Japanese leader and pilot names. If I'm not mistaken I couild do this in one of two ways:

1. Place all Japanese forces under IJN and place all German and Italian forces under IJA.

or

2. Keep Japanese forces under IJN and IJA as normal but have certain German and Italian units mixed in with virtually unremovable default commanders. This I could do by making the PPs for their replacement as high as possible. Of course there would still be the problem of task forces which are created will probably have Japanese leaders.

Any ideas on which plan might be better?

EDIT: Second question:

I want Indochina to be in French custody. I'm wondering if that will mess up things as far as I think it may trigger Kamikazes or the early deployment of Thai militias or something.

Thanks.

< Message edited by Gary Childress -- 7/23/2012 7:52:27 AM >


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RE: More whacky ideas for a one of a kind mod - 7/23/2012 4:06:05 PM   
Shark7


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Option 2 is how I set mine up. I also named the initial French Pilots in the pilots DB (which was a lot of work) so my original pilots had at least French names...

RTAF, RTN, and RTA are a bit harder, as Thai names are hard to find (or understand how they work for that matter).

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