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RE: September Days

 
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RE: September Days - 5/1/2013 4:22:27 AM   
Elladan

 

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The one quite obvious problem you have with those sweeps is a quantitative disparity. It's never a good thing to fight against an overwhelming odds, so unless you can build up your numbers to match your opponents (or even better bring more own fighters than his to the party) there is not much point sweeping at all. What are you really gaining by performing them? Perhaps you should focus more on achieving air superiority directly in front of your bombers than in a whole theatre in general.

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Post #: 571
RE: September Days - 5/1/2013 7:27:22 AM   
JeffK


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Do you have to win the war in Burma?? Will your New Guinea line of attack force him to take some strength out of Burma??

What can you do in the face of 200+ modern fighters without concentrating ALL of your fighters against Burma, which would strip the rest of your forces of air cover. The ability to make these modern fighters out of thin air might keep JFB happy but is so ahistorical...........

The JFB has one natural advantage, interior lines and generally good range to allow quick relocation of forces, the AFB has the outside of the circle and cant transfer between SEAC and OZ and long ranges required to get to the SOPAC or NORPAC theatres.

So is the answer in using other forces or directions of attack to minimize the advantage GJ has??

Fighters dont win by themselves, has he enough bombers to hurt your forces, these can be damaged/destroyed by AAA. Have you built up your base AAA strength?
Maybe you could force him to take bombers off ASW work and make life easier for your subs.
Or could a sub offensive force the opposite.

Probing into other areas such as the Aleutians, clearing out OZ etc might see a reaction, or easy victories.

Go back through your history and see what has worked, and what failed.
Repeat the success, though not neccesarily in the same region and avoid the failures, you often post about forgot this, didnt change that, avoid these "avoidable" losses.

I think you are going OK for the IRL timeline, dont push it too hard though, the time of the AFB isnt there quite yet.

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RE: September Days - 5/1/2013 8:23:53 AM   
JocMeister

 

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Q-ball,

Me and my opponent is considering to start using the BETA to avoid some of the pitfalls related to the late game seen in the GJ/rader game (alabative escorts/massed LBA and so on).

I´m quite worried about updating considering the massive change to air coordination and how that affects everything. You have been playing for quite some time now with the BETA. What is your opinion on the BETA? Do you foresee any problems later on? I´m especially worried about:

-Ground/AF/Strategic bombing being affected/lowered by less coordination
-Allied bomber losses rising dramatically

Thankful for any input!



< Message edited by JocMeister -- 5/1/2013 8:25:10 AM >

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Post #: 573
RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 4:38:51 AM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Q-ball,

Me and my opponent is considering to start using the BETA to avoid some of the pitfalls related to the late game seen in the GJ/rader game (alabative escorts/massed LBA and so on).

I´m quite worried about updating considering the massive change to air coordination and how that affects everything. You have been playing for quite some time now with the BETA. What is your opinion on the BETA? Do you foresee any problems later on? I´m especially worried about:

-Ground/AF/Strategic bombing being affected/lowered by less coordination
-Allied bomber losses rising dramatically

Thankful for any input!




Not sure...coordination is dissapated, every strike has a first large group, then dribs and drabs afterward who usually get chewed-up. So yes, losses will increase. But it's a fair trade off, and probably realistic.....really tough to coordinate airgroups like that.

Sept 30, 1943:

Lots of action around Molu

I promised myself I wouldn't lose more cruisers. PROMISE BROKEN! I lost CL St Louis, which now leaves only 1 Brooklyn-class left, Honolulu. That's bad! At least I have alot of DDs.

Speaking of which, Greyjoy's losses are well over 50, including 2 more this turn, 1 to mines and 1 to sub. He's lost at least 5-6 to mines off Molu, including CL KUMA this turn. I don't have anywhere else to put them, so I have been dumping alot of mines at Molu....

Solomons:

Manus falls easily to the 2nd attack. Rabaul is completely surrounded now, and we will land troops to take it in a couple weeks. I just want the port and airbase at this point, very handy for future ops.




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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 4:37:13 PM   
Q-Ball


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9-30-43:

On the above map, Greyjoy re-occupied Taberfane with aircraft, and sent alot of LBA toward my CVs, which are covering the retreat of the heavily damaged cruiser COLOMBIA (which will make it).

Waves of A6M2, Ki-43, and D4Y1 attacked the CVs, but I had over 150 planes on CAP, and it was a slaughter; over 220 IJN planes were shot down, pretty much everyone who flew that mission. It may as well have been a Kamikaze mission.

While satisfying, I am certain he won't miss the planes (A6M2? He must have spares in the pool). And I am certain the fighter pilots were rookies. The LBA DB units have been slaughtered so many times they are probably all just fresh trainees by now.

Next few Days:

I have several CVs undergoing repairs, plus there is a major flak upgrade for most USN CVs 10/43. I'll probably stand everyone down to repair and upgrade everyone, and get ready for the next battle.

I hope to engage KB toe to toe next time, and I think I'll have the CVs to do it now.

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Post #: 575
RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 4:47:58 PM   
paullus99


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Q - best bet at this point will be a knife fight at close range. Jap players seem to love to dance around with that 8-Hex advantage.....you only need to get lucky once & you can put a huge dent in his decks.

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 4:57:58 PM   
Chickenboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

Q - best bet at this point will be a knife fight at close range. Jap players seem to love to dance around with that 8-Hex advantage.....you only need to get lucky once & you can put a huge dent in his decks.


Disagree. Q-ball just had several CVs damaged. The best bet at this point for Q-ball is to repair those decks and then seek combat. Maybe the Gods of war will allow a 7 hex exchange then, but the best bet at this point is not to throw oneself at the enemy, particularly since the enemy has a numerical advantage right now in serviceable flight decks.

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 5:16:27 PM   
paullus99


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@CB - I didn't intend to mean "now" - just when the time comes, don't let the 8-Hex advantage come into play.....

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 5:21:50 PM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

Q - best bet at this point will be a knife fight at close range. Jap players seem to love to dance around with that 8-Hex advantage.....you only need to get lucky once & you can put a huge dent in his decks.


Disagree. Q-ball just had several CVs damaged. The best bet at this point for Q-ball is to repair those decks and then seek combat. Maybe the Gods of war will allow a 7 hex exchange then, but the best bet at this point is not to throw oneself at the enemy, particularly since the enemy has a numerical advantage right now in serviceable flight decks.


Chicken is right, I need to be patient, but the IJN range advantage is about to disappear. In fact, it's about to flip-over to the Allies.

The D4Y2 has a range of 6/7; at 8 hexes or more, he loses all his DBs in strike packages
(Jill is good out to 10 hexes, and Zero of course can make it)

Using drop tanks, the 11/43 upgrade of the Avenger increases the Torp range from 6 to 8.
The Helldiver already has a range of 8, with tanks, and a big payload
Hellcat with tanks can escort everyone out that far

So, once Dec/Jan rolls around, I'll have a full strike package out to 8 hexes, and can stretch out to 10 hexes with reduced package

At 10 hexes, he'll have Jills, but not DBs

So, I think the range advantage is about to change

I have alot of damaged CVs, but only ENTERPRISE has been lost. Everyone else will be repaired with a max time of 60 days (HORNET and WASP are complete; SARA/LEX are at Pearl, and YORKTOWN is just pulling into Bremerton NSY). Plus, there is a steady stream of ESSEX and CVLs coming. My fighter pilots are all elite from shooting down 100s of LBA, and his elite pilots are diluted by now. The latest flak upgrades make every escort, even DDs, with lots of 40mm guns. Next encounter will be a victory, if I can wait patiently......

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 5:46:41 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Q-ball,

I was told a short while ago in my AAR that the strike range from CVs are hardcoded. Max 8 for Jap and max 7 for allies. Regardless of the max range of the planes stationed on the CVs. Pretty silly but so it works apparently.

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 11:05:53 PM   
JeffK


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

Q - best bet at this point will be a knife fight at close range. Jap players seem to love to dance around with that 8-Hex advantage.....you only need to get lucky once & you can put a huge dent in his decks.


Disagree. Q-ball just had several CVs damaged. The best bet at this point for Q-ball is to repair those decks and then seek combat. Maybe the Gods of war will allow a 7 hex exchange then, but the best bet at this point is not to throw oneself at the enemy, particularly since the enemy has a numerical advantage right now in serviceable flight decks.

I agree with Chickenboy's disagree.

If you can tiptoe around the CV at max range and draw his attacks at max range you might be able to put a large dent in his forces, as the last exchange shows. Plus if you can keep near your bases you may get some LBA CAP help as well.

As for you only having to get lucky once, the opposite could see you waiting for mid44 to make any significant push.

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RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 11:27:48 PM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Q-ball,

I was told a short while ago in my AAR that the strike range from CVs are hardcoded. Max 8 for Jap and max 7 for allies. Regardless of the max range of the planes stationed on the CVs. Pretty silly but so it works apparently.


Can anyone else confirm that this is true? If so, that's very interesting, and I didn't know that!

That's where the magic 8 comes from I guess

10-1-43:

Bhamo:

We have taken Bhamo; a Chinese unit came over the mountains, and we then para-dropped an LRP Brigade right at Bhamo.

The Chinese have engineers; I am going to build a small airstrip, and start flying in more units. The Allies have tons of air transport in Burma, so I can make this base work.

Immediately after that move, I see units moving south from Myiktinya; he may be abandoning Northern Burma, but he's going to have to pretty soon after this para drop (because I can easily drop more paras)

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Post #: 582
RE: September Days - 5/2/2013 11:28:54 PM   
obvert


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It is true

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 3:23:23 AM   
PaxMondo


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Yeah, I found the original discussion between C&G and Michael. I thought it had been "fixed", but no. It is original Gary code.

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 3:24:49 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

While satisfying, I am certain he won't miss the planes (A6M2? He must have spares in the pool). And I am certain the fighter pilots were rookies.

Yeah, but great exp gains for your pilots.

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 3:58:19 AM   
crsutton


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Nope it is code, and always has and will be code. It is AE 101 and four years into the game everybody should know it by heart.... You can search and LRCAP at max distances from a carrier but your offensive strikes are limited.

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 4:48:03 AM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

While satisfying, I am certain he won't miss the planes (A6M2? He must have spares in the pool). And I am certain the fighter pilots were rookies.

Yeah, but great exp gains for your pilots.


No question. My CV fighters are mostly crack pilots by now, with multiple aces in each unit. Several have average Exp above 80. They are much better than the ones that I suspect are in KB these days, after a couple rounds of bad missions. Plus, his KB pilots haven't had any easy kills.




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< Message edited by Q-Ball -- 5/3/2013 6:51:05 PM >

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 5:23:13 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Nope it is code, and always has and will be code. It is AE 101 and four years into the game everybody should know it by heart.... You can search and LRCAP at max distances from a carrier but your offensive strikes are limited.

And one of the very, very few (I'm trying to think of another and I can't right now, but there prolly is another one somewhere) I disagree with that cannot be 'fixed' via house rule. Oh well. In the grand scheme of things, it ain't a biggie.

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RE: September Days - 5/3/2013 6:32:57 AM   
JeffK


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I see the 8 hex limit as a point where the possibility of a succesful, co-ordinated attack to be almost very hard.

Just imagine the problems of getting any sort of numbers into the air, make formation and succesfully navigate over 320nm of ocean then search for the target which has moved 20-40nm in the same period..

Is there any "die roll modifier" dependent on the range of the attack, I often see players comment when their max range raids dont fly, maybe this is the game saying that they are expecting too much.

QBall, you can get GreyJoy into a quandry about where to defend and where to abandon, while he can probably afford 1-2 losses like the recent attack, when he has to toss a coin about fighting to the death over some small tropical atoll (which you can build to a L6 base in double quick time) make sure that its always on your terms.

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RE: September Days - 5/4/2013 3:00:27 PM   
Q-Ball


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10-7-43:

Solomons:

I landed at Rabaul. My original plan was to bypass it, but I had the troops prepped, and wanted the port for future ops. Now, I'm not so sure. We'll see; Manus is also a good port, problem with it is that Greyjoy can observe it more easily via recon from Truk or Woleai.

I might just pick the guys up and move along, since there is a mess of units there, though mostly Nav Gd and whatnot.

Otherwise, Dagua is already a size-3 base, and we should reach Aitape and take that soon. Once that happens, I have a decision to make on Hollandia.

Hollandia is garrisoned to the max, 35,000 or so IJA troops. No doubt the forts are 4 or 5. It's jungle. This is a very tough nut.

On the other hand, I have the troops prepped already. That's not enough, but I've been bombing it for a month, and there isn't any way for him to get more supplies there. It will starve eventually.

If it was later in 1944, I would definitely bypass, but without CV superiority at the moment, I am thinking I may as well land. I can't make a bigger move up there at the moment, so why not. The alternative is to sit.

Burma:

Finally, big happenings in Burma.

We finally found a weak spot at Bhamo. Greyjoy has done a really good job taking advantage of stacking limits and terrain to build a defensive wall; other players with stacking limits should copy that approach.

Bhamo was garrisoned by a Thai Bde only; we marched a Chinese Division from the hills, and simulataneously dropped a LRP Bde. That was enough to get a 3-1 and rout the Thais.

The Chinese are staying behind to slowly build an airstrip, while the Chindits are moving down the Irriwaddy toward Shwebo. I am about to drop another Bde, and once I have airstrip, I'll start flying in lots of units

This move immediately precipitated a major withdrawl; it looks like Greyjoy is abandoning Northern Burma (which is probably now untenable). He is also abandoning Akyab. Warazup has already been abandoned. Myiktinya is likely next.

I think I can flank him out of Lashio, and if I can get close to Tauyng Gyi on a wide front, should be able to flank him out of the plains, and on to Rangoon.




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Next Steps - 5/6/2013 6:59:31 PM   
Q-Ball


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10-8-43 to 10-13-43:

Burma:

Greyjoy successfully evacuated Myiktinya, and is probably falling back as far as Katha. He also is pulling out of Akyab, and that should be successfully completed. At that point, he'll be able to easily re-establish a forest-based perimeter.

We have a couple ideas that don't involve head-on attacks into the jungle. At any rate, our supply situation in Burma proper is not particularly good. So, we'll work around that.

In the meantime, Greyjoy successfully swept some of my leaky CAP over Warazup; they were LRCAP to sweep him over Myikitinya, which we did 3 days ago shooting down over 50 fighters, losing maybe 15. But that's been evened out by these leakers.

I have some P-47s arriving soon, so I think we can take another crack at the 400+ fighters at Mandalay soon

Elsewhere:

Aitape falls easily, but at this point I am pretty limited strategically.

The reason is all my CVs are undergoing repair/upgrade. The longest repair is 40 days, so by then I'll have every CV in the Pacific other than ENTERPRISE, basically....plenty to take him on. But until then, I can only operate within easy range of LBA.

At the moment, this means cosolidation and clean-up. I will establish a forward base at Aitape, take Kaveing, and build Hansa Bay to size-9. I am probably going to pull the Rabaul units though, but no harm done; we didn't have a better purpose anyway.

So, should be quiet for a month or so, as I do some minor moves to set the stage for later.

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RE: Next Steps - 5/6/2013 7:07:40 PM   
koniu

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
The reason is all my CVs are undergoing repair/upgrade. The longest repair is 40 days, so by then I'll have every CV in the Pacific other than ENTERPRISE, basically....plenty to take him on. But until then, I can only operate within easy range of LBA.


Big E have that strange habit to be only CV available for allies


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RE: Next Steps - 5/6/2013 7:23:22 PM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: koniu


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
The reason is all my CVs are undergoing repair/upgrade. The longest repair is 40 days, so by then I'll have every CV in the Pacific other than ENTERPRISE, basically....plenty to take him on. But until then, I can only operate within easy range of LBA.


Big E have that strange habit to be only CV available for allies



Actually, i should have been clearer; ENTERPRISE is the only sunk CV. All the rest are floating, but some under repair, many under AA upgrade, but all available within 40 days or less. So that includes 4 Essex, plus 5 pre-war CVs, and the CVLs of course.

I did name one of the ESSEX-class ENTERPRISE; she will be available in a couple months. That may confuse Greyjoy a bit, but hey...that's what the USN did with name!

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RE: Next Steps - 5/9/2013 5:19:29 AM   
Q-Ball


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10-17-43

Colombo Raid:

Greyjoy e-mailed me this when he sent the turn:


"The turn?...well... can't say i'm happy. Weather, once more, ****ed my plans. It could have been a perfect "perl harbour"...while it ended up just in another wasting fuel voyage :-(

Just hope the Gods of weather will start to smile back on me in the future:"

This is interesting, because while his planes didn't launch at Colombo, there was nothing there other than Motor Launches, AMs, and a few AKLs. Garbage basically. Why? I spotted CVs off Sabang the turn before, and moved the small cruiser group I had there. He must not have known that!

Doesn't matter, because I sent HERMES to Ceylon to start forming a TF for another operation, and she was torpedoed in the middle of the Indian Ocean! Ouch! She will sink. Not a huge loss since she isn't even as good as a USN CVE, but every flight deck helps.

Next Steps:

With KB way off in the Indian Ocean, we have another plan we are hatching immediately......




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Post #: 594
RE: Next Steps - 5/9/2013 9:51:43 AM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

This is interesting, because while his planes didn't launch at Colombo, there was nothing there other than Motor Launches, AMs, and a few AKLs.

IJ intel and recon sucks so bad he must have thought there was a lot there. I can't even count how many times I've seen CVE CVE CV CV BB BB BB and it turned out to be 3xMTB and 2xACM! How an MTB looks like a BB I really want to know!


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
With KB way off in the Indian Ocean, we have another plan we are hatching immediately......

Prolly what upset him the most ... he's really pretty good at keeping the KB hidden from you.

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Post #: 595
RE: Next Steps - 5/10/2013 1:38:06 AM   
Q-Ball


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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

This is interesting, because while his planes didn't launch at Colombo, there was nothing there other than Motor Launches, AMs, and a few AKLs.

IJ intel and recon sucks so bad he must have thought there was a lot there. I can't even count how many times I've seen CVE CVE CV CV BB BB BB and it turned out to be 3xMTB and 2xACM! How an MTB looks like a BB I really want to know!


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball
With KB way off in the Indian Ocean, we have another plan we are hatching immediately......

Prolly what upset him the most ... he's really pretty good at keeping the KB hidden from you.


Actually, I did have real shipping there until recently, but I also spotted these guys coming. I wasn't sure it was CVs, but I spotted some sort of warship TF steaming NW about 4 hexes off Sabang....not difficult to figure that out, particularly since I don't have fighters at Colombo.


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RE: Next Steps - 5/10/2013 2:18:37 AM   
PaxMondo


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Yeah, after about 3 months of game time, allied NavSearch seems to get a boost while IJ NavSearch stays pretty lousy the whole game. TF ID for me is always a lotta guessing. I prolly should sandbox it a bit to see if it is just related to Skill/Exp. As IJ, take a lot to have patrol pilots with NavSearch above 60 and exp=60. Sure, theorectical limit is 70 with training. I've never seen a patrol pilot gain NavSearch skill while on patrol ... so you tend to just have 60/60 out there. Sorry for digression ...

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RE: Next Steps - 5/10/2013 3:56:46 PM   
Q-Ball


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10-19-43

DEI:

In front of Darwin, I have several TF's loaded, and moving toward Samlauki, and Kai Island. Molu is packed with fighters, and tomorrow I start unloading some supplies for the base.

There is a BB TF at Ambon; problem is there is also a TF of small ships at Boela, so if I pack Molu with DBs, they will probably impale themselves on Boela instead of attacking the BBs. So it goes. That's probably why those ships are at Boela.

Rabaul:

I've decided to move on; I'm picking-up all the forces at Rabaul, and I will let the base rot. I wanted the port, but I have another idea there anyway.

No harm done, those units will just prep for something else; I have enough divisions that I really have more units right now than targets I can get to with CV support

HMS HERMES:

I wrote HERMES off after taking 3 torp hits, but I guess you never know....the flooding is not increasing. I still think she is a goner, but let's see....

Of course, Cocos Is isn't exactly Bremerton NSY, so she would probably be stuck for awhile anyway




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(in reply to PaxMondo)
Post #: 598
RE: Next Steps - 5/11/2013 12:13:56 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 5913
Joined: 6/6/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

I wrote HERMES off after taking 3 torp hits, but I guess you never know....the flooding is not increasing. I still think she is a goner, but let's see....

Of course, Cocos Is isn't exactly Bremerton NSY, so she would probably be stuck for awhile anyway


Wow! If she makes it, I would have a little celebration.



Of course, I like to celebrate!

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Pax

(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 599
RE: Next Steps - 5/11/2013 12:14:50 AM   
paullus99


Posts: 1622
Joined: 1/23/2002
Status: online
Beer good, fire pretty!

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Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon...

(in reply to PaxMondo)
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