NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME"

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NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME"

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME"

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NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 10:10:06 PM

Auchinleck

Posts: 15
Joined: 2/9/2006
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Actually, a fun and interesting game! Am I entitled to flip flop here? lam (laughing at myself

). I restarted the Grand Campaign, and after being cautious for the first week of the war, and even though the Nagumo's carrier strike force sank, and damaged, a higher number of ships at Pearl Harbor than they did historically, I began to appreciate the randomness of the possible outcomes. I was going to change to a bolder strategy, and try and reinforce Wake Island, but it fell to the Japanese before my transport task forces could arrive there. So I diverted them to reinforce Midway instead.

I've had a number of successes sinking Jap transports that have begun to invade the Phillipines, by massing submarine forces, and with many surface attacks by the subs (since most torpedo hits are not exploding, nice historical accuracy there). But also a considerable amount of my subs are taking heavy damage, as a result of attacking in shallow waters close to the PI, and not being able to dive deep enough to elude IJN depth charges.

Meanwhile, getting back to Midway. A small Japanese carrier task force moved into Midway waters, and one of my Pearl based subs reported it spotted a tf of tankers. Even though I was reluctant to, because of the possibility of a KB ambush, I committed the Lexington, Saratoga, and Enterprise to defend my transports reinforcing the Midway garrison. The IJN light carrier force heavily damaged a couple of my transports at Midway, but the next day my carriers were in range, and spotted their carrier task force, which only contained the CVL Zuiho, along with several CA's and DD's. We swooped in from the Southeast in the morning, seemingly having spotted them first, with about 50+ & 60+ SBD's in two groups along with 45 TBD's and only a handful of F4F escorts (the rest I was saving for CAP to protect the carriers). I sank the Zuiho with 13 bomb hits, the CA's Suzaya, Haguro, and Mikuma were all set ablaze, along with several DD's, and that afternoon my luck held, when US planes spotted the Jap tanker task force and set at least 7 of those ships with fuel cargo exploding below decks leaving heavy damage, and heavy fires burning!

I have Admiral Ray Spruance in command of my carrier group, and as good as he is (was), and despite the fact that I feel I have been lucky so far, I'm high tailing it back to the safety of Pearl with the carriers. I sense an angry Yamamoto will soon be sending the entire KB towards Midway looking for revenge. Kudos to the Butai (sorry) for not having shown up in force so far, after their suprise attack on Pearl. All this has happened, and it's only late December 1941! Stay tuned for more excitement!

Post #: 1

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 11:01:01 PM

Onime No Kyo

Posts: 16568
Joined: 4/28/2004
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Oh look, he does have a sense of humor!

Now that youre in better countenance I'd like to officially welcome you to the forums.

Sounds like youre catching "the bug" properly. In my experience, Wake is pretty random. In some starts the Marines will stop the Japanese cold and sink a DD or two in the process with no outside intervention. Other times, the same forces will take the island for Japan with no more injury than a stubbed toe. Its all about the die rolls. Which is what makes this game so awesome and so unique.

Now, you'll want to learn several phrases:

-Brave Sir Robin
-Fortress Palembang
-The Mersing Gambit
-(suggestions welcome)

And thats just the defensive phase. About a year later in gametime, you might start running offensive ops. That will be a whole different dynamic.

And for an entirely new level of immersion, play as Japan. The one huge difference is that while the Allies get to sit and wait for stuff to arrive, Japan gets to manipulate their production of planes and to some extent even ships. There are some Excel wizards here whose explanations of Japanese production make my eyes glaze over.

Good luck.

< Message edited by Onime No Kyo -- 7/5/2012 11:02:27 PM >

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Post #: 2

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 11:07:44 PM

ilovestrategy

Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
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I always hear people talking about the Mersing Gambit but I still have no clue what that means! Yeah, I use Sir Robin in Storm over the Pacific.

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Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

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Post #: 3

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 11:23:38 PM

n01487477

Posts: 4551
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy

I always hear people talking about the Mersing Gambit but I still have no clue what that means! Yeah, I use Sir Robin in Storm over the Pacific.

Japanese launch an invasion on Mersing to capture Singapore quickly by cutting off retreating troops. I did this not in the traditional wave but by leap frogging down. Dec 28 captured Johore Bahru.

[edit] This can be done much earlier by launching an invasion of Dec 8-10, but as he British BB's weren't sunk - I did this cautiously.

Floyd's come back at me by trying Fortress Palembang - but this is a modded game and he doesn't get Oil Ref supplies.

He's also trying a Singora Sling (move from Alor to Singora) - as I pushed deep into Malaya.

[edit] This is JWE's version of the grand campaign, with my economic mod on top...

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by n01487477 -- 7/5/2012 11:28:54 PM >

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EconDoc
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Post #: 4

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 11:27:44 PM

ilovestrategy

Posts: 3628
Joined: 6/11/2005
From: San Diego
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I get it! Thanks for the info. The map helped tons, I probably would have not understood without it. Thanks again!

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After 16 years, Civ II still has me in it's clutches LOL!!!
Now CIV IV has me in it's evil clutches!

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Post #: 5

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/5/2012 11:27:56 PM

Gary Childress

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Good for you Auchinleck! I think most of us have thrown up our arms in frustration now and again when something didn't go our way. It takes a big man to admit when he was wrong about something. Hang in there! There will be many more joys and frustrations ahead as you learn this incredible game! It comes with the territory.

(in reply to n01487477)

Post #: 6

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 12:03:34 AM

Gr�fin Zeppelin

Posts: 1096
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: online

Welcome to the feeding grounds.

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Post #: 7

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 12:53:42 AM

fbs

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Auchinleck

I sank the Zuiho with 13 bomb hits, the CA's Suzaya, Haguro, and Mikuma were all set ablaze, along with several DD's

Now the AI is finding this to be a terribly unfunny game.. :-(

(in reply to Auchinleck)

Post #: 8

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 3:39:25 AM

geofflambert

Posts: 2112
Joined: 12/23/2010
From: St. Louis
Status: online

I have no experience playing the dark side, but I would wager that among us lurk personages who would be happy to (as the Japanese) cut your heart out, stomp up and down on it, then feed it to you for supper. Should you decide to venture into the dark back alley of PBEM games, all I can suggest is to specify that your opponent must be a vegitarian.

(in reply to fbs)

Post #: 9

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 4:34:50 AM

jmalter

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Joined: 10/12/2010
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well done, Auk.

but mind you don't overstack your troops on Midway, anything more than ~10-12% over its 6,000 troop limit & you take outrageous spoilage losses to supplies, and perhaps also 'orrid fatigue increase & morale loss to the troops. 2 Marine Defense Battalions and one CB unit is about all that can safely be based there - after the SeaBees have built up the facilities, replace them w/ a USAAF baseforce. Midway is gonna be an important advance base for your subs, so plan on staffing it w/ an AS, an AR, and mebbe even that ARD that appears in Portland.

(in reply to geofflambert)

Post #: 10

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 6:20:46 AM

LoBaron

Posts: 3843
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline

Now, that sounds better.

Good luck on your war!

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S**t happens in war.

All hail the superior ones!

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Post #: 11

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 9:06:37 AM

Chris H

Posts: 2863
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Bexhill-on-Sea, E Sussex
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As you probably realise people who play this game are passionate about it and not to say extremely knowledgeable. Enjoy but don't spend too many long nights.

(in reply to LoBaron)

Post #: 12

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 9:09:27 AM

JocMeister

Posts: 1791
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From: Sweden
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Good luck Auchinleck!

(in reply to Chris H)

Post #: 13

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 11:05:30 AM

HansBolter

Posts: 3148
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: St. Petersburg, Florida, USA
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The AI follows scripts and will never be as challenging as an opponent with a brain.

In fact, once you get a grasp of the games mechanics and some experience with operations you will find yourself trashing the AI so heavily you will have to restrain yourself.

If you don't have the time to commit or the inclination to play PBEM there are a few ways to make play against the AI more sustainable.

Consider the Iron Man Japan scenario. It gives the AI a plethora of additional ahistorical units to lose. Also consider ramping up your difficulty setting to at least hard. It gives the AI a bunch of advantages that it desperately needs.

Also consider playing very, very passively during the first six months, other wise you can end up trashing the AI and skewing the game so heavily in your favor that it won't seem worth playing on into '43.

Good luck and have fun!

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Post #: 14

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 9:14:38 PM

fbs

Posts: 957
Joined: 12/25/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

In fact, once you get a grasp of the games mechanics and some experience with operations you will find yourself trashing the AI so heavily you will have to restrain yourself.

The way I found to have fun with the AI is by restricting how many commands I issue at any turn; for example, I don't give myself more than 2 commands per turn for naval asiatic forces - so it takes some 16 turns just to get all the subs moving out of Manila. And no more than 3 commands for central pacific naval forces (including commands to naval air units). And so forth.

Once I get my forces starved of commands, I had to think very carefully on how to use them. I guess some people would find that terribly unfunny, but it really gets it challenging for me.

(in reply to HansBolter)

Post #: 15

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 10:21:06 PM

Hanzberger

Posts: 739
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: SE Pennsylvania
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

-Brave Sir Robin
-Fortress Palembang
-The Mersing Gambit
-(suggestions welcome)

Good luck.

May I dare to say that the majority feels the above is gamey. Just make sure you discuss before playing a human....or one of us..

Welcome aboard and good luck. Now, young Skywalker, come over to the dark side.....

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Post #: 16

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 10:34:43 PM

Onime No Kyo

Posts: 16568
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hanzberger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

-Brave Sir Robin
-Fortress Palembang
-The Mersing Gambit
-(suggestions welcome)

Good luck.

May I dare to say that the majority feels the above is gamey. Just make sure you discuss before playing a human....or one of us..
Welcome aboard and good luck. Now, young Skywalker, come over to the dark side.....

Which one is gamey?

_____________________________

"Mighty is the Thread! Great are its works and insane are its inhabitants!" -Brother Mynok

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Post #: 17

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 10:38:42 PM

AW1Steve

Posts: 12007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hanzberger

quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

-Brave Sir Robin
-Fortress Palembang
-The Mersing Gambit
-(suggestions welcome)

Good luck.

May I dare to say that the majority feels the above is gamey. Just make sure you discuss before playing a human....or one of us..
Welcome aboard and good luck. Now, young Skywalker, come over to the dark side.....

There are many JFB's that feel to do anything but lay on your back and piddle on yourself like a frightened poodle is gamey......

ANYTHING YOU DO IS GAMEY....because it's frickkin' GAME!!!!

< Message edited by AW1Steve -- 7/6/2012 10:39:40 PM >

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Post #: 18

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/6/2012 11:37:27 PM

LoBaron

Posts: 3843
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve
There are many JFB's that feel to do anything but lay on your back and piddle on yourself like a frightened poodle is gamey......

Not entirely correct. In Scen#1 to piddle on yourself is gamey as well because the IJ paras might slip on the wet ground when landing and hurt their ankles...

_____________________________

S**t happens in war.

All hail the superior ones!

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Post #: 19

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 12:55:40 AM

Onime No Kyo

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Dastardly Yankee dogs.

That gives me an idea for a mod. Ice rink DEI.....

< Message edited by Onime No Kyo -- 7/7/2012 12:56:01 AM >

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Post #: 20

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 1:35:24 AM

AW1Steve

Posts: 12007
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I'm importing bannana skins!

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Post #: 21

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 5:37:19 AM

rockmedic109

Posts: 1886
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From: Citrus Heights, CA
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"Hey Sarge!. What the devil? I just changed the oil in all those jeeps. Why do I have to go drain the oil outa them."

"Shaddap Corporal. Or I'll promote your rump to senior NCO in charge of counting bears on Kodiak Island!" As the sergeant gazes upwards with just a hint of fear.

(in reply to AW1Steve)

Post #: 22

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 6:08:17 AM

DivePac88

Posts: 3114
Joined: 10/9/2008
From: Somewhere in the South Pacific.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ilovestrategy

I always hear people talking about the Mersing Gambit but I still have no clue what that means! Yeah, I use Sir Robin in Storm over the Pacific.

In my experience an early Mersing gambit is a waste of good troop-carrying shipping, as those British units you are cutting, are only going to die in the north instead of Singapore.

If you move on Mersing early, you'll not have suppressed Singapore's air power yet. Then there is Force Z, as any good Allied player will have it sitting in Java, just for an opportunity like this.

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You understand now, Why you came this way

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Post #: 23

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 12:16:33 PM

JohnDillworth

Posts: 1714
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: online

Now it's time to get your tankers and AO's safe. You don't have enough. Protect them all. Get them out of the DEI, set up you tanker route, ALWAYS escort tankers, make sure you convoys match the port size you are delivering to, understand that xAK's can also carry fuel. Start building bases. units can't fight or build if they are in strategic mode. Oh, start training pilots. You need to do that for the whole game. Did I mention keep your tankers safe?

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Post #: 24

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 2:52:20 PM

The Gnome

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From: Philadelphia, PA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I'm importing bannana skins!

Do banana skins get shipped on a transport or amphib convoy? Or do they come out of supply points? If so there is a massive banana skin gap between the allies and japan.

(in reply to AW1Steve)

Post #: 25

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 3:28:51 PM

PaxMondo

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve
There are many JFB's that feel to do anything but lay on your back and piddle on yourself like a frightened poodle is gamey......

Not entirely correct. In Scen#1 to piddle on yourself is gamey as well because the IJ paras might slip on the wet ground when landing and hurt their ankles...

Too true

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Pax

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Post #: 26

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 4:25:57 PM

Onime No Kyo

Posts: 16568
Joined: 4/28/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Gnome

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I'm importing bannana skins!

Do banana skins get shipped on a transport or amphib convoy? Or do they come out of supply points? If so there is a massive banana skin gap between the allies and japan.

Of course there is. The Japanese wernt smart enough to develop a proper banana peel prior to the war like the allies did. Instead they decided to field that ersatz wet seaweed which cant be compared to proper banana peels. Why, if I had been the entire Japanese high command I would have....and thats why the allies are great and the Japanese are stoopid. Thank you.

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Post #: 27

RE: NOT A "TERRIBLY DISCOURAGING GAME" - 7/7/2012 7:44:24 PM

Chickenboy

Posts: 14836
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From: Twin Cities, MN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Gnome

quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

I'm importing bannana skins!

Do banana skins get shipped on a transport or amphib convoy? Or do they come out of supply points? If so there is a massive banana skin gap between the allies and japan.

Of course there is. The Japanese wernt smart enough to develop a proper banana peel prior to the war like the allies did. Instead they decided to field that ersatz wet seaweed which cant be compared to proper banana peels. Why, if I had been the entire Japanese high command I would have....and thats why the allies are great and the Japanese are stoopid. Thank you.

Yes. A little known fact that the Emily could use banana skins, coconut husks, squid heads and captured SPAM rations for fuel. If only the Japanese weren't stoopid in the war, they could have build 1000s of torpedo-equipped Emilys, based them all on small atolls and sunk dozens of Essex-class carriers.

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