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RE: Operation Gymir

 
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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/20/2013 9:11:00 PM   
JocMeister

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: paullus99

That's not a crippling blow, by any stretch....


I dont think it was the air losses that caused him to withdraw but rather the 50 or so Fletchers just 2 hexes away!

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/20/2013 9:22:31 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Operation Gymir Day 2

I just seen the replay but the landing itself was flawless! I actually managed to get a really good LRCAP up with around 100 Fighters appearing over the invasion. There were some small scattered strikes coming in but none penetrated the CAP!

quote:

Morning Air attack on TF, near Sarmi at 91,114

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 76 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 25 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B6N1 Jill x 16



Allied aircraft
P-38G Lightning x 8
P-38H Lightning x 52
P-38J Lightning x 30
F4U-1 Corsair x 10
F4U-1A Corsair x 10



Japanese aircraft losses
B6N1 Jill: 11 destroyed

No Allied losses



There were 3-4 similar raids coming in. All without fighter protection. Sarmi will be in allied hand on D3!

quote:

Ground combat at Sarmi (91,114)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 1468 troops, 12 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 72

Defending force 21213 troops, 439 guns, 493 vehicles, Assault Value = 761

Japanese ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled




Assaulting units:
14th Naval Guard Unit
22nd Field AF Construction Battalion
10th JAAF Base Force


Defending units:
93rd Infantry Division
40th Infantry Division



They will probably be on their own for a week or so before I can organize BFs to move in. But in these kind of landings Im usually able to drop around 20k of supply with the troops so they should be fine for a while. I will fly in some AS to get a small CAP and some naval search up ASAP.

I wont call this a complete success until the BB reach safe waters and the assault ships are safely under CAP again. But I certainly will sleep well tonight!

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/20/2013 9:43:55 PM   
paullus99


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Actually, I meant for you - his losses were severe enough to get him to run away (it seems like) and certainly not worth a successful landing on your part.....his luck was terrible here.

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Post #: 843
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/20/2013 9:46:30 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Ah, yes my losses were very light. If I manage to save both BBs they were insignificant in fact. When I saw the first KB strike I was sure I would loose the whole invasion fleet. I was very, very lucky!

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Post #: 844
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 9:03:27 AM   
JocMeister

 

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27th-30th March -44

New Guinea

Last day of operation Gymir. Time to get the hell out of Dodge. KB intervention is highly unlikely as I think Erik has to refuel after two full speed runs. A night surface action is more of a danger though. Ive set up several Fletcher TFs to screen the amphibious TF. I also moved some DBs forward to possible catch any surface TFs stuck to close when day breaks. Subs are also swarming the wake to the Amphib TF.

I ordered the first assault on Sarmi. With 10 times more AV there is a good chance the base will fall in the first attack. 4Es will lend a hand.

Future of New Guinea

I need to rest up and wait for preparation. Ive decided to completely bypass Hollandia/Vanimo. An invasion here will only allow Erik to suicide his troops and buy them back. Manus will be built up to level 7 Port and Hansa built up to level 9 AF. These two bases will form the backbone of future operations. While the New Jersey and Iowa will have to return to the West Coast I still have 3 fast BBs, 4 modern and 4 old CAs, 5 Clevelands and some 80 DDs here. Most of this will temporarily shift to the Darwin operation. Next phase will begin in a few weeks.

Ive stared mopping up all the abandoned bases using Paratroops. Hopefully this works. I have a battalion together with flying boats set to do this.

OZ/Darwin

Its time to secure Darwin from air and naval attacks. Erik has the two Yamatos here plus more BBs. If the Iowas was in shape I would have taken the chance. Not now though. This whole operation will be low risk one. That means PTs and Fletchers. Erik has a profound respect for the Fletchers and having some 20-30 covering Darwin might be enough to deter him. I need to bring supply in to get the AF up to 9 and put pressure on Timor.

CENTPAC

Training and preparing for Wake. The last few turns convinced me that Erik wont risk the KB in direct confrontation. Not for wake. This suits me fine as I will be even stronger when its time for Eniwetok. The Wake invasion will take off in about 2 weeks.

Burma

On the 28th Erik tried another Sweep over Ramree. I boosted the defense with some 50 Spit VII. It wasnt pretty for Erik and he lost some 30 Franks for 3 P40s and no Spits.

Im still moving around here. Once the Superstack is joined I will have to rest for a bit. Then try and cross the river were resistance seems easiest. At the moment Im content here as I have most of the IJA tied up here. Once he collapses here it will go downhill fast for him.

End of Month assessment

Im happy with my progress in New Guinea. Im itching to get going in the DEI and CENTPAC to add pressure on Erik. Burma is what it is but having all his unrestricted divisions here except two is a strategical victory in itself. The NG campaign have clearly shown that Erik is very weak in at least some places. At Sarmi he had only 72 AV. He now also have some 100.000 troops cut off around NG. Soon he will have to start finding forces to garrison the Philippines too. Im at least slightly positive for the future. My feeling that Erik made a big strategic blunder having all those divisions in Burma is still strong.

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 2:56:43 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Burma Map

Here is a screen of Burma. This area is really in a massive stalemate. I still have that hunch that it might be a house of cards. One bad day for Erik and I think it will come crashing down quickly.

I have allowed his Air force to stay in Rangoon. I rather have them here were I know I can shut them down whenever I choose too then somewhere else. He has some 700 Fighters at Rangoon. Surrounding AFs are mostly empty.





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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 3:31:10 PM   
ny59giants


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I still vote for Prome. You should have an Command HQ and Corp HQ 100% prepped right now. He gets the advantage on the forts for right now, but I would hit the AF with B-24s and other 4e bombers, the troops with 2e bombers. Then, your B-29s can start to hit Bangkok and beyond to force him to spread his fighters out, especially the George. I would go for Oil first followed by Heavy Industry.

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 4:50:31 PM   
Speedy

 

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My advice would also be to go for Prome as he won't get the Jungle AV multiplier. A word of caution though from my recent experience. IF you allow him to entrench in the jungle hexes he can stall a force 3x as strong north of Rangoon due to Jungle defence multiplier......

< Message edited by Speedy -- 3/21/2013 4:51:02 PM >


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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 7:00:13 PM   
JocMeister

 

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Im leaning towards this too (Prome) Its a good stepping stone. I need to deceive Erik a bit though so he doesnt start to pile up there. He already have 40k troops in place. But it would be nice to cut him off from Rangoons supply. That would probably cause him to run out fairly quickly. He do have some 3-400.000 men in Burma.

< Message edited by JocMeister -- 3/21/2013 7:02:05 PM >

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/21/2013 9:01:08 PM   
JocMeister

 

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31st March -44

New Guinea

Unexpected action take place as the KB returns. At least parts of the KB... For the first time in this game the allies annihilate a CV strike. Very pleased with the results as no strike planes make it through CAP. Erik Zeroes really suffers today against my LBA and 56 Zeroes are shot down. I can only assume most of the pilots are lost. Im a bit nervous for the next turn as Erik has another CV TF just North. If they combine and go for Hansa Bay the 300 plane CAP might not be enough. Most of my squadrons are really burned out after providing LRCAP for 3 days of very long distances.

Erik also put up a sub screen south of Hansa. This prompted me to send the damaged BBs into Hansa Bay risking a possible KB strike. I do feel its a bit unlikely so I chose the lesser evil. 5-6 ASW TFs are sent out to try and deal with the subs.

Overall Im pleased with the results of the day shooting down 141 planes for only 19 allied. As an added bonus:

quote:

Ground combat at Sarmi (91,114)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 21305 troops, 439 guns, 493 vehicles, Assault Value = 771

Defending force 3688 troops, 24 guns, 96 vehicles, Assault Value = 68

Allied adjusted assault: 385

Japanese adjusted defense: 17

Allied assault odds: 22 to 1 (fort level 3)

Allied forces CAPTURE Sarmi !!!

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
J2M3 Jack: 2 destroyed

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), disruption(-), preparation(-)
fatigue(-), experience(-)

Attacker: fatigue(-)

Japanese ground losses:
1580 casualties reported
Squads: 49 destroyed, 18 disabled
Non Combat: 86 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 20 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 11 (3 destroyed, 8 disabled)
Vehicles lost 81 (81 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 3



Allied ground losses:
33 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)



Assaulting units:
93rd Infantry Division
40th Infantry Division


Defending units:
14th Naval Guard Unit
22nd Field AF Construction Battalion
10th JAAF Base Force


Erik failed to realize what a key base this is for me. Im very happy the gamble payed off. Biak/Noemfoor next. I will go in very heavy here too. I cant risk stalling. This will be the biggest landing yet.

CENTPAC
The two CV TFs has left the Canal and are steaming for PH. No signs of the subs spotted earlier. I guess Erik got whatever intel he wanted. PH listed a 1/2 DL yesterday. Is that enough for him to "see" what is disbanded in port?

OZ
Supply just dropped under 10k. Drat. Stopped the expansion of the AF. Cant bring in more without a large naval presence. They are all tied up in New Guinea and most ships badly need to repair wear and tear.

Exmouth is secured. Another avenue for Erik to watch.

Burma
Last two B29 squadrons are 5 days from arrival.

Training squadrons

Gah, a huge chunk of my USA Fighter training capabilities were just sent off to Europe. All in all some 8 squadrons are withdrawn. That is 250 pilots less training. I do have 2200 pilots in the pool but I have no clue if that will be enough? I still have five 25 plane squadrons devoted to training. Do I need to pull some combat squadrons off line and use for training?






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< Message edited by JocMeister -- 3/21/2013 9:05:15 PM >

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/22/2013 8:48:56 AM   
JocMeister

 

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1st April -44

Very quiet turn. I foresee a lot of these in the coming weeks. Poor planning on my part has led to this. I dont like it as it will give Erik time to shift forces, build forts and better prepare. I have 5 different operations planned but none are ready to go.

NOPAC - Lack assault ships and air cover
CENTPAC - Wake invasion. Waiting for CV/CVL/CVEs to arrive at PH
New Guinea - Have to rest and recover air groups. Repair ships and wait for prep.
Darwin - Waiting for ships to be released from New Guinea
Burma - Waiting for troops to arrive at destination.

I could easily have started the NOPAC operation at this stage. This could have forced Erik to divert his attention elsewhere for a week or two. It would have been perfect. But I lack transports, combat ships and proper airframes here. Poor planning on my part.

So at least 2 weeks of very quiet coming up as I repair, rest and shift for the next push. Hopefully Eriks moral wont have time to recover after the KB debacle. I need for him to shift KB around as much as possible burning fuel, causing SYS and creating OP losses. I will try and sync so that at least two of my operations will happen on at the same time. This will force Erik to chose which one to oppose with the KB. I think he will choose the DEI one. He kind of has to. Having two level 9 AF on Timor is bad mojo.

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/23/2013 10:46:00 AM   
JocMeister

 

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2nd-4th April -44

As predicted things have been pretty slow as we both heal up and gather mass for the next clash.

Submarine warfare

It is time to withdraw the subs to port. I have lost 18 subs during the last 3 months. 80% of them to ASW air. Its a tough decision to make but my subs have had virtually no impact during the war. While I have sunk over 50 ships its mostly PBs and Es. Looking at my own sub losses I have lost 74 subs . That is less then a useless ship for each sub lost. Its time to call it a day and give up on any strategic submarine warfare campaign. Sadly I feel I have tried to use the subs in a historical manner and this has not worked. I will let all subs currently on patrol to remain so until they return to port to replenish. I will then disband them as the arrive to their home port.

New Guinea
Moving things forward and shifting troops. Mostly quiet. Hansa Bay goes to level 9 AF. Erik is reinforcing Biak and Noemfoor. I will allow him to do so as the troops he is bringing forward is far from enough. As a sign of how thin Erik is Peleliu has only 600 troops. KB is spotted at Ulithi on the 3rd. On the 4th a Kongo is spotted SE of Mindanao. I guess the Kongos are with the KB?

OZ
Erik bombs Darwin. I have no supply to put a CAP up. Waiting for combat ships to repair. I will then bring a heavily escorted convoy in. I need Darwins AF to go to level 9.

CENTPAC
Fleet is assembling in the their TFs and the first have left PH! Ive decided to use a bunch of YMSs for picket duty. They have a 3 inch gun and 3500 endurance. According to Eriks reasoning this qualifies as a combat ship fit for picket duty. Fine by me. I have a gazillion of these!

Ive also decided to NOT show my CV/CVLs in the beginning. If Erik doesnt know where they are he has to be very careful of where he sends the KB. It might also lure him out if he thinks the CVEs are on their own. But I still think its very unlikely he will sortie the KB for something as unimportant as Wake. But he really does like to use his KB as demonstrated last week! I think a CV battle outside his LBA is something I should look for right now.

Burma
Moving some troops around just to mess with Erik. He has shifted some stuff to Bassein after I indicated a move there. Im also "moving" for Prome. He has yet to react to this though. I put the 4Es back to Chittagong as the AF is now repaired. I dont think he will take the bait but I put 200 P47s and SpitVII here for CAP this time instead of the crappy P40s. Hopefully he thinks its 200 P40s again!

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/23/2013 3:26:16 PM   
witpqs

 

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Regarding subs:
- What mod/scenario is this (I follow a bunch of AARs and don't remember every detail of each!)?
- How have you been using subs?
- How have most been lost (to planes operating near air bases, to planes just transiting by air bases, to escorts, to hunter-killer groups, etc.)?

Some threads/discussions on sub losses quite a while back. Babes addressed the 'super-E' issue by recalibrating all surface vessel ASW in a systematic way. AFAIK air ASW has not been addressed. I'm not sure if anything will be done about it at this point, I've tried to make the case a few times.

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/23/2013 4:36:21 PM   
JocMeister

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Regarding subs:
- What mod/scenario is this (I follow a bunch of AARs and don't remember every detail of each!)?
- How have you been using subs?
- How have most been lost (to planes operating near air bases, to planes just transiting by air bases, to escorts, to hunter-killer groups, etc.)?

Some threads/discussions on sub losses quite a while back. Babes addressed the 'super-E' issue by recalibrating all surface vessel ASW in a systematic way. AFAIK air ASW has not been addressed. I'm not sure if anything will be done about it at this point, I've tried to make the case a few times.


We are playing Stock Scenario 1!

I have been trying to use my subs in his shipping lanes. It has not worked. Erik has skirted the coast line with his convoys under a heavy air umbrella. I have been trying to get in, get out and it hasnt worked at all.
Mostly my subs arrive and either get hit and sunk by ASW air patrols. Or get hit and have to RTB. If they have avoided that fate Erik has flooded the area with ASW TFs.

Erik has also mixed in a bunch of xAKLs in each convoy and they seem to have been preferred target after the PBs.

Had I known the Subwar worked like this I wouldnt have bothered. 78 sunk subs for a few PBs/xAKs and 6 TKs

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/24/2013 9:15:33 AM   
JocMeister

 

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5th - 9th April -44

Some scary, scary days and a very good wake up call as Erik snaps me back to reality.

Burma

It all started in the 5th when I noticed some 350 bombers suddenly appearing at Rangoon. Together with the 700 Fighters I quickly decided to pull back from Ramree Island as I figured it was an effort to close the base. Lo and behold as Erik strikes at Akyab! My CAP performed absolutely HORRIBLE as only P40s can do. Im so sick of the absolute uselessness of this air frame. I loose 80 P40s for 14 Franks and Erik blast a path right through the CAP. This is no disaster really but for the fact that I had a bunch of fighters resting on the ground at Akyab. I loose 60 P47/P38/CorsairII on the ground.

Luckily none of the bombers that were stationed there were caught up in the bombing raid and are withdrawn to Calcutta. I had a hunch Erik would try again on the 6th seeing I still had over 50 fighters stuck on the ground. So I LRCAP from Chittagong. But revenge is bittersweet as I loose 19 P47s on the day. I really hope Erik lost a bunch of very good pilots. I get a tripple ace wounded and loose 12 P47 pilots. A bad blow.

This completely change the air war in Burma again. I cant stop Erik from bombing my AFs as the repeated sweeps eventually removes the CAP and lets the bombers through. I will withdraw to Calcutta for now and heal up. This will be the only base were resting is allowed from now on. I wont be caught on the ground again. Had it not been for the losses on the ground I would only have lost 80 useless P40s anyway. Lesson learned. This also showed the vulnerability of Akyab/Chittagong. If Im to station bombers there I will have to use P47/Corsairs for CAP. I must make it so painful for Erik to sweep that he wont do it.

I bought out more USMC squadrons and sent them to Aden. The P47D2 pools is almost empty loosing some 50 planes over 3 days. Im so sick of the pools constantly running dry and trying to deal with the endless shortage. If I could just get three months of Japanese production I would give away OZ in exchange.

CENTPAC

The allied fleet is assembling around Midway.

SOPAC
Moving stuff around. Captured Mussau Island and Kaiving. Rabaul is now doomed. Ive stood down the bombers. Guess what. Yes, pools are running dry. My B24J pool have been steadily dropping but I managed to keep up using older pools of B24 but as those dry out my J pools plummet. All 2E pools except the Havocs are in really poor shape too.

OZ
Erik strikes again at Darwin bombing the AF catching some Patrols on the ground. Still repairing ships to cover a convoy here. As the Yamatos are here we will rely on Fletchers/PTs and subs.

I stupidly forgot to turn off upgrades in the PoW so now she will be gone for 40 Days. Bad timing! South Dakota is leaving the dry dock at LA but it will be 3 weeks before she arrives. The Richelieu arrives in a few days and will be sent here as well. But she arrives at Aden so it will take well over a month to arrive.

RANT/VENT
Overall some bad days for the allies. The performance of the P40 in this game is just appalling. I KNOW that but still get upset every single time. Especially when Erik moans about the P47 getting a 4:1 advantage the following turn. Well, I wonder how fun he would find it if he could only use unlimited Oscars and 106 Franks per month. For me its just baffling how he can be so upset after loosing 50 Franks and 20 Georges for 20 P47. He produces 1500 top notch fighters per month! That is what I get in 6 months! People are so stuck on the 175 P47s per month. It only runs for 3 months for crying out laud! After that Im stuck with 50 38s that are now obsolete and 30 P51 for the USAAF until 11/44! And after that comes the usual "And thats not even counting the planes arriving with the squadrons". Oh you mean the 25 P47 arriving in July? Those are going to make a massive difference...

Bah, foul mood today. Its just so tiring trying to be aggressive and moving forward while handicapped by the constant "war on the pools"





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< Message edited by JocMeister -- 3/24/2013 9:18:00 AM >

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/24/2013 7:18:21 PM   
JocMeister

 

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10th - 12th April -44

New Guinea
On the 10th air search picked up 2 big SCTF hovering outside Biak. I suspected a bombardment of Sarmi and pulled out the planes there. I sent in the only available TF in the area. Arleigh Burke in command of 9 Fletchers and a Porter DD. Another humiliating defeat for the IJN!

quote:

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Apr 11, 44
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Sarmi at 90,113, Range 18,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Nagato, Shell hits 2
BB Mutsu, Shell hits 15, on fire
DD Hayashimo, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Yukikaze, Shell hits 5
DD Hamakaze, Shell hits 7, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Hatsuharu, Shell hits 6, heavy fires
DD Hatsushima, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Yugure, Shell hits 2, on fire


Allied Ships
DD Bullard, Shell hits 2, on fire
DD Capps, Shell hits 1
DD Gatling, Shell hits 1
DD Halligan
DD Marshall, Shell hits 1
DD Nicholas, Shell hits 1
DD O'Bannon
DD Stanly, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
DD Strong
DD Selfridge, Shell hits 3, and is sunk


There is also a second battle right after this one against a 2 CA TF. Only minor damage inflicted to the Japs but I loose DD Stanley (3rd Fletcher lost so far). Given the sub encounters on the following day Erik lost 5 DDs with one lagging behind that could get sunk by subs during the voyage home.

I know this frustrates the hell out of Erik. I would be too. Having 2 BBs and 2 CAs getting chased away but 10 DDs must be very frustrating. I love it! I think Erik has profound respect for the Fletcher. Had this been in nighttime there is a good chance he could have lost something bigger then a few DDs. All surviving DDs have minor damage but are sent back to Finnschafen for repairs. Another smaller 6 DD TF takes its place. A Cleveland TF is also on its way.

CENTPAC
One of Eriks pickets blow the cover of my CVs. While Im not happy about it (Erik did send a very sincere apology saying he forgot it there) I have said its fine. I will use this too. Its a shame it was on the CVs that now show a 2/2 DL. But perhaps I can confuse Erik a bit switching place with the CVEs. Im guessing Erik will steam the KB towards the Marianas until he knows where Im going. My present course takes me straight for them. We will see. Every time he moves is a small victory for me.

Its probably 3 days until the BBs close for bombardment. Erik has 5000 men on Wake. I need to really pound it before I can land. I only have a RGT and a Tank BTL prepped.

OZ
Sending and empty cargo TF towards the DEI past Merauke. Lets see if I can make Erik a bit worried while he is sending KB in the other direction!

Burma
Attacked Eriks troops outside prome. It shows promise! I think unless Erik do something here the will soon be routed

quote:

Ground combat at 60,47 (near Mandalay)

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 36029 troops, 564 guns, 230 vehicles, Assault Value = 1367

Defending force 14101 troops, 152 guns, 264 vehicles, Assault Value = 452

Allied adjusted assault: 606

Japanese adjusted defense: 658

Allied assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
719 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 128 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 19 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 15 (1 destroyed, 14 disabled)
Vehicles lost 37 (7 destroyed, 30 disabled)



Allied ground losses:
236 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 84 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 33 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 74 (43 destroyed, 31 disabled)
Vehicles lost 15 (2 destroyed, 13 disabled)



Assaulting units:
641st Towed Tank Destroyer Battalion
50th Indian Para Brigade
11th (East African) Division
3rd New Chinese Corps
85th British AT Gun Regiment


Defending units:
2nd RTA Division
8th Tank Regiment
4th Ind.Mixed Regiment
39th/A Division
2nd Army
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
3rd Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment



I have rested the troops for 2 days getting the disruption down. Another attack ordered today.




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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/24/2013 8:14:12 PM   
ny59giants


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I know this will never happen in AE, but it would be nice if there was a cap to how big an airframe factory could expand to. Something like 45 to 60 seems like a good number.

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RE: Operation Gymir - 3/24/2013 8:46:12 PM   
JocMeister

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I know this will never happen in AE, but it would be nice if there was a cap to how big an airframe factory could expand to. Something like 45 to 60 seems like a good number.


Wrong thread?

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Post #: 858
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/24/2013 11:19:23 PM   
DOCUP


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Joc: I am always late to posting here.  How were your P40 fighters layered in Burma.  Also whats the exp.  I am a few months behind you so I'm trying to pick up a few pointers here.  I have only faced Georgers and I had Corsairs with them.

(in reply to JocMeister)
Post #: 859
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 12:07:25 AM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister
Its probably 3 days until the BBs close for bombardment. Erik has 5000 men on Wake. I need to really pound it before I can land. I only have a RGT and a Tank BTL prepped.


Is this wise?

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Post #: 860
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 5:32:41 AM   
House Stark

 

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Joc, you said earlier that you were withdrawing your subs back to port. Do you mean all subs, or just those that were convoy hunting? I'm getting the feeling reading your AAR and others that against an opponent who puts a lot of resources into ASW, the only real way the Allies can use subs is the way the Japanese used them historically. Super E's and ASW aircraft become a lot less valuable when subs are partially under the umbrella of the US CV force.

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Post #: 861
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 6:40:28 AM   
JocMeister

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP
Joc: I am always late to posting here. How were your P40 fighters layered in Burma. Also whats the exp. I am a few months behind you so I'm trying to pick up a few pointers here. I have only faced Georgers and I had Corsairs with them.


I had them layered at 15k and 20k. All pilots were properly trained but not stellar. So 50-60 EXP, 70 Air, 70 Defense. Against massed Franks they are simply dead meat even when in numbers of 200.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Bullwinkle58
Is this wise?

Semi wise. Im going to need blast Wake for 1-2 weeks before actually landing. I have a second wave ready at Midway but they are low prep (60-70) so I dont want to use them if I dont have to!

quote:

ORIGINAL: House Stark

Joc, you said earlier that you were withdrawing your subs back to port. Do you mean all subs, or just those that were convoy hunting? I'm getting the feeling reading your AAR and others that against an opponent who puts a lot of resources into ASW, the only real way the Allies can use subs is the way the Japanese used them historically. Super E's and ASW aircraft become a lot less valuable when subs are partially under the umbrella of the US CV force.


Only those on convoy hunting. I will use them as you are suggesting. Raider and GJ seems to have perfected this use and I will give it a try!

I think its a shame the game fails to model the strategic sub campaign in the game. After all it could be argued this was the most important aspect of the Pacific war. To be honest the whole sub/ASW war is kind of bonkers. Air ASW is insanely overpowered. Even having air search radar my subs get hit instantly. Not after a few weeks in the area but instantly. And on those rare occasions were my subs shoot at something (1-2 times per week) they target the escort about 80% of the time.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 862
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 8:52:19 AM   
DOCUP


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So what alt are the Frank's and Georges sweeping at?

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Post #: 863
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 9:00:00 AM   
koniu

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

So what alt are the Frank's and Georges sweeping at?

George(all variants) and Frank a/b have 2nd best maneuverability at 31k ft. Frank "r" can sweep at his max celling ~40-44k ft(not remember)

Are You playing with 2nd band rule, JocMeister?

< Message edited by koniu -- 3/25/2013 9:04:55 AM >


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Post #: 864
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 9:07:21 AM   
DOCUP


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Hey Joc pump some info out of Koniu for me. How many Georges and where his CVs are located. Keep it on the download though.


Man I should be working right now.

(in reply to koniu)
Post #: 865
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 9:50:08 AM   
JocMeister

 

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konui,

Yes we are using the 2nd best MVR HR. So he goes in a 31k and my P40s are stuck at 20k. Its a really crappy HR that has pretty much ruined the air war for us both. The only thing that matters is going higher then your opponent. Dive is insanely powerful and I think its why we often see extreme number like 1:10 losses and stuff. If you are using that HR I strongly suggest you come up with something else.

In my other game we dont have a HR but we will keep it realistic (no higher then 20k for now.). I think this will make a better experience for both players.

DOCUP,

Georges arnt much of a problem vs your fighters. Its the unescorted bombers you need to worry about. A good rule of thumb for me so far is:
One lost 4E for every airborne George when unescorted. So 50 Georges means 50 4Es lost after OP losses. I dont do unescorted anymore.

(in reply to DOCUP)
Post #: 866
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 9:57:23 AM   
DOCUP


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Can you put some corsair or p47s at 31k with p40s at lower alt as bait. Instead of having all one type mix it up. That's what I have done with koniu. In Burma I have hurri 2c at 31k with p40s and p39s at lower alts. It has worked well for me. I like to have 2 sqds at 31k if I can.

(in reply to JocMeister)
Post #: 867
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 10:10:45 AM   
koniu

 

Posts: 1942
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From: Konin, Poland, European Union
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: DOCUP

Can you put some corsair or p47s at 31k with p40s at lower alt as bait. Instead of having all one type mix it up. That's what I have done with koniu. In Burma I have hurri 2c at 31k with p40s and p39s at lower alts. It has worked well for me. I like to have 2 sqds at 31k if I can.


Confirm that. Usually when i sweeping my fighters are diving on low flying fighters as prababaly pilots consider them easy targets. After few rounds F4U or other high flying planes coming to game and they start to dive on me. And when F4U is diving there is only one end fo my planes.

Also allied radar warning is playing major role. In last few sweeps when I engage enemy planes manage to climb above my sweep usually 33-35k ft and they instanly start to dive on me



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Post #: 868
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 10:41:02 AM   
JocMeister

 

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Ah, I had a nice layered CAP in place. Here is the CR.

quote:

Allied aircraft
Spitfire Vc Trop x 16 20k
Spitfire VIII x 48 31k
P-40K Warhawk x 148 15k
P-40N5 Warhawk x 100 20k
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 49 35k
P-51A Mustang x 25 25k


I think the air model just collapses when numbers are too big. Dont know.

(in reply to koniu)
Post #: 869
RE: Operation Gymir - 3/25/2013 10:42:25 AM   
JocMeister

 

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I think I just found the reason I did so poorly that day. Have to double check but I might be an idiot.

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Post #: 870
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