Matrix Games Forums

Command Rommels Panzers in Battle Academy!Servers UpdateThe Deal goes Fourth!Command Ops gets a Massive Update!Lost Battles AAR: Smolensk 41War in the East: Lost Battles is here!Conflict of Heroes: Awakening the Bear! Let's Play videoLost Battles Scenario Manual excerpts available!A sneak peek from Allied Corps!Harpoon 3 ANWs Free Ultimate Update!		 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Hiryu sunk!

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Hiryu sunk! Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:13:21 PM   
barkorn45

 

Posts: 228
Joined: 1/17/2010
Status: offline 		Started a dbb lite quiet china scen and after second turn checked intel and under ships sunk found that I had sunk the hiryu near ph with 21 inch torpedo.
The problem is I did'nt have any subs in the area and the sinking was'nt reported in combatreporter?Is it or is it not sunk?Fow?
Post #: 1
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:19:08 PM   
treespider


Posts: 9735
Joined: 1/30/2005
From: Knoxville
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: barkorn45

Started a dbb lite quiet china scen and after second turn checked intel and under ships sunk found that I had sunk the hiryu near ph with 21 inch torpedo.
The problem is I did'nt have any subs in the area and the sinking was'nt reported in combatreporter?Is it or is it not sunk?Fow?



C'mon man...you have a brain...what does your brain tell you?

_____________________________

Here's a link to:
Treespider's Grand Campaign of DBB

"It is not the critic who counts, .... The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..." T. Roosevelt, Paris, 1910

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 2
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:29:10 PM   
barkorn45

 

Posts: 228
Joined: 1/17/2010
Status: offline 		I hope she's sunk would sort of make up for the battering battleship row took, but can't figure out where torpedo came from?

(in reply to treespider)
Post #: 3
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:37:06 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 6161
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: barkorn45

I hope she's sunk would sort of make up for the battering battleship row took, but can't figure out where torpedo came from?


Wow.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 4
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:37:21 PM   
wdolson

 

Posts: 7032
Joined: 6/28/2006
From: Near Portland, OR
Status: offline 		Do you have fog of war turned on? If you do, it will probably disappear from the list after a while.

Bill

_____________________________

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 5
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:47:47 PM   
barkorn45

 

Posts: 228
Joined: 1/17/2010
Status: offline 		Yes fow is on,does this mean it was'nt sunk?Was "supposedly"sunk by mk14 torp.but did'nt have subs deployed in the area.

(in reply to wdolson)
Post #: 6
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:48:52 PM   
Gräfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1096
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline 		I once had a Dinah attacking a submarine and it was then reported sunk. I had the vague suspicion that the pilot was lying tho.

_____________________________



(in reply to wdolson)
Post #: 7
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 1:59:13 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 6161
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: barkorn45

Yes fow is on,does this mean it was'nt sunk?Was "supposedly"sunk by mk14 torp.but did'nt have subs deployed in the area.


If FOW was on it's not sunk. Take it to the bank. As you play you're going to get thousands of FOWed messages which you will need to decide to believe or not. Often you will have one of your own ships sunk where you know with 100% certainty which ship it is, and the game will report an incorrect name from the same ship class. It's the way it's designed. It all shakes out correctly over the following weeks and months in the Ships Sunk report.

I've "sunk" the Akagi four times in one game.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 8
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 2:04:22 PM   
barkorn45

 

Posts: 228
Joined: 1/17/2010
Status: offline 		10-4 thx figured since combatreporter did'nt show it was to good to be true,oh well hope springs eternal.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 9
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 2:11:59 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 6161
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: barkorn45

10-4 thx figured since combatreporter did'nt show it was to good to be true,oh well hope springs eternal.


With carriers (and sometimes cruiser/BB float planes) there's a "trick" some people use (I don't personally) to verify a sinking immediately. Look at the lost planes report for the turn where the game reported a CV sunk. The entire air group might show up here, and if it does it should be "fact." Sometimes planes in the air can re-base to another CV or a nearby land base and thus this won't work, but if the CV is surprised by a sub attack, or is alone, or for some reason has only a few planes in the air when attacked you can get some free intel. If you want to.

_____________________________

The Moose

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 10
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 2:20:48 PM   
janh

 

Posts: 1140
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin
I once had a Dinah attacking a submarine and it was then reported sunk. I had the vague suspicion that the pilot was lying tho.


This is a good one. Never seen a recon plane without bombs claim to have sunk anything. What was the sinking device on the losses screen, pineapples?

Dinah is a good plane, nimble but quite fast. I have been wondering for a while why it can't carry any ordnance. Does anyone know?

(in reply to Gräfin Zeppelin)
Post #: 11
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 3:05:13 PM   
Puhis


Posts: 1627
Joined: 11/30/2008
From: Finland
Status: offline 		Dinah was light, fast recon plane with very good range. It was not designed to carry any ordnance.

(in reply to janh)
Post #: 12
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 5:47:43 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
Dinah carried a giant drop tank, and could have carried a small load perhaps up to 1 ton

it was a small plane (when you stand next to one, you see how tiny it is, about the same as a kate ) and it probably would fit aboard the japanese carriers (11 meters length),

the Dinah III had powerful small-diameter engines (the Ha-33-62) and that combined with small weight gave it a high speed

basically there is nowhere to put any ordnance except the centerline,
but it could probably have carried 1 x 800kg under the fuselage or 1 x torpedo

Was basically the japanese equivalent of the mosquito



< Message edited by Commander Stormwolf -- 5/30/2012 5:48:01 PM >

_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 13
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 5:56:06 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
Now you ask why wasn't it used that way?

Why did the japanese use the Toryu (Nick) as an escort?

Why did they use the Saiun (Myrt) to take photos of the essex carriers instead of torpedoes?

Why did they use the Reisen (Zero) to attack B-24 and B-17 formations and carry small 60kg ordnance on strafing runs against heavy flak?

Why did they use Seiku (Emily) as transports instead of heavy ordnance or torpedoes?

Why did they build Gekko (Irving) when the Dinah was vastly superior?

Why did they wait so long to put the Ha-33-62 on the zero?


... probably because hindsight gives all the right decisions..

but also they were not very smart.. and didn't have a clear understanding
of how to co-ordinate their air forces and use the assets available in a way
of a clearly defined weapon system (like 8th Air Force for example)



_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to Commander Stormwolf)
Post #: 14
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 5:59:21 PM   
Justus2


Posts: 251
Joined: 11/12/2011
Status: offline 		Sub Commander: Comms- Please send Radio message to CINCPAC - "Scratch one Flattop! IJN Hiryu sunk off Pearl Harbor!!"
XO: "Umm, sir... we haven't left port yet, are you sure you didn't have too much to drink last night??"
Comms officer: "Message sent sir, did you want to file a follow-up?"
Commander: "Uh, lets wait a week or two..."



_____________________________

Currently Playing:
War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition (learning, not really playing ;) )
LST 325 Fanboy!

(in reply to Commander Stormwolf)
Post #: 15
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 6:00:37 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline

Read some newspapers from Dec 7, 1941

they claim "2 japanese carriers sunk in battle of Hawaii"

_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to Justus2)
Post #: 16
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 6:02:23 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
Also Colin Kelly sank the Battleship Haruna on December 10, 1941

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Colin_Kelly

_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to Commander Stormwolf)
Post #: 17
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 11:16:24 PM   
Gräfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1096
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: janh

quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin
I once had a Dinah attacking a submarine and it was then reported sunk. I had the vague suspicion that the pilot was lying tho.


This is a good one. Never seen a recon plane without bombs claim to have sunk anything. What was the sinking device on the losses screen, pineapples?

Dinah is a good plane, nimble but quite fast. I have been wondering for a while why it can't carry any ordnance. Does anyone know?

If I remember right the sinking reason was unknown. Weeeell maybe the whole crew was on deck and *bang bang bang* killed them all with his pistol and the ship slipped beneath the waves.........

_____________________________



(in reply to janh)
Post #: 18
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 11:37:56 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
Dinah pilot believes submarine captain left the hatches open

since the submarine dove on sight of the Dinah,
and Dinah circled for about 1 hour,
and submarine did not surface

submarine is presumed sunk

techically there is a dice roll that a ship will sink for no reason

(sort of like Mutsu exploded in harbor for example)

_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 19
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 11:40:53 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 39894
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: online 		Except in no way whatsoever.

_____________________________

There is no version of this where you come out on top - Tony Stark


(in reply to Commander Stormwolf)
Post #: 20
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 11:45:43 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
not likely to have sunk in that particular game

but ships do sink for no reason in AE, real small chance programmed in

(or it is just a bug)


_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 21
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/30/2012 11:47:54 PM   
Gräfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1096
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Stormwolf


not likely to have sunk in that particular game

but ships do sink for no reason in AE, real small chance programmed in

(or it is just a bug)


No you are right here. I just had recently an AK exploding and sinking while unloading supplies.

_____________________________



(in reply to Commander Stormwolf)
Post #: 22
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 5:39:40 AM   
LoBaron


Posts: 3836
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Vienna, Austria
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin


quote:

ORIGINAL: Commander Stormwolf


not likely to have sunk in that particular game

but ships do sink for no reason in AE, real small chance programmed in

(or it is just a bug)


No you are right here. I just had recently an AK exploding and sinking while unloading supplies.


Probably while manhandling Giant Drop Tanks for Dinahs...

_____________________________

S**t happens in war.

All hail the superior ones!

(in reply to Gräfin Zeppelin)
Post #: 23
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 9:04:13 AM   
1275psi

 

Posts: 5753
Joined: 4/17/2005
Status: offline 		wet myself with that

(in reply to LoBaron)
Post #: 24
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 10:19:14 AM   
Gräfin Zeppelin


Posts: 1096
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LoBaron


Probably while manhandling Giant Drop Tanks for Dinahs...


Hahaha


_____________________________



(in reply to LoBaron)
Post #: 25
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 2:40:17 PM   
barkorn45

 

Posts: 228
Joined: 1/17/2010
Status: offline 		The ki-46 was also used as a night fighter.

(in reply to Gräfin Zeppelin)
Post #: 26
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 4:08:19 PM   
janh

 

Posts: 1140
Joined: 6/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: barkorn45
The ki-46 was also used as a night fighter.


Yip, out of curiosity I did some research on this bird now. It reminds indeed a bit of the 110s, Beaufighters or the faster Mosquitos, but it is substantially smaller and lighter.
It seems the Japanese did test a light bomber version, but obviously the airframe does not support heavy external loads and the version was dropped. Since it was designed as a light, fast long-range recon aircraft that's probably not a surprise. It probably also suffered from a lack of armor.

The later Dinah types in AE are not bad, but I so far never produced them. Maybe it would be worth a try against 4EB? There is the Ki-46 III KAI and Ki-46 III KAII fighter versions, which have a comparably "very high" speed and maneuver bands and range exceeding those of the Ki-45 Ic and Id Nicks. They are armed worse than the d-Nick, but not much worse than the c version I would say (2x 20mm, acc. 56 or 58, don't remember exactly, range 500; plus a 37mm with acc. 6). The only big catch I can see is that the Dinahs are not armored, and the 4EB do already take some armored fighters for breakfast.

So maybe the Dinahs are just not worth it compared to the later Nicks. Has somebody used the Dinah as fighters in AE? Can you equip recon datai with the fighter versions later?

< Message edited by janh -- 5/31/2012 4:09:31 PM >

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 27
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 4:20:01 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline

japanese "destroyers" were totally ineffective, and not configured a lot different than the standard versions

they had little impact defending New Guinea bases like Wewak

Toryu (Nick) was supposed to look like this..







Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to janh)
Post #: 28
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 4:25:48 PM   
Puhis


Posts: 1627
Joined: 11/30/2008
From: Finland
Status: offline 		Just check climb rate of Dinah, not worth as a fighter.

(in reply to janh)
Post #: 29
RE: Hiryu sunk! - 5/31/2012 6:43:36 PM   
Commander Stormwolf

 

Posts: 1531
Joined: 2/19/2008
Status: offline
Yep Dinah was not well suited to be a fighter.. unless they went drastic
and reduced the fuel load to the absolute minimum, making it a point-defence
desteroyer, and even then.. would have been fast but not climb well

also on the Dinah III there are not many places to put armamament.
The pilot basically sits in the nose itself.

If you removed the second crew member you could probably fit a 37mm cannon
(like they did) and they changed the airframe back to a Dinah II style
for the Dinah-III Kai interceptor.

Both of these caused bad aerodynamics and mitigated the advantages of the Dinah-III airframe.

These lessons were learned by Tomio Kubo and the Mitsubishi team when the Ki-83 was made.
An overall streamlining and more space in the nose to house a battery of 4 guns.

Though if the war progressed, few Ki-83 would have been built as it took two Ha-43 engines whereas a Shinden used 1xHa-43 and was faster and had the same firepower as the Ki-83.


_____________________________

"No Enemy Survives Contact with the Plan" - Commander Stormwolf

(in reply to barkorn45)
Post #: 30
Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> Hiryu sunk! Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

1.098