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WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE!

 
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WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/7/2012 9:25:52 PM   
wg335910


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EVERY THING IS AGAINST YOU. YOUR UNITS ARE UNDERSTRENGTH AND WHEN YOU FINALLY ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF DEFENSIVE LINE PUFF YOUR UNITS EITHER DISAPPEAR OR ARE DOWN GRADED. IF THEIR ARE ANY DEDICATED SOVIET PLAYERS OUT THERE. I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM YOU. THANKS.
Post #: 1
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/7/2012 10:44:43 PM   
Aurelian

 

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So, ah, why all the caps?

(in reply to wg335910)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 4:47:42 AM   
AFV


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The first 17 turns are a challenge. Then you have about 17 turns to get your act together- damage the German army so that the next summer is not as painful as the first one.

I assume you're talking about the NKVD and mechanized divisions disappearing- just one of those things you need to know. Personally, I like the Soviet side because there are so many more things you get to do with your army than with the Axis side.

The caps are really not needed.

(in reply to Aurelian)
Post #: 3
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 6:08:45 PM   
Baron von Beer

 

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Stalin's mustache says I'm running the show!. Adolf's says "Well Stanley, here's another nice mess you've gotten me into". Isn't that reason enough?

In all seriousness, regarding units auto-disbanding, just a question of learning the rules. And there's lots. I still keep the manual & update changelogs open while playing, and am frequently alt-tabbing back and forth. :)

< Message edited by Baron von Beer -- 4/8/2012 6:10:10 PM >

(in reply to AFV)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 6:12:11 PM   
parusski


Posts: 4684
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: wg335910

EVERY THING IS AGAINST YOU. YOUR UNITS ARE UNDERSTRENGTH AND WHEN YOU FINALLY ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF DEFENSIVE LINE PUFF YOUR UNITS EITHER DISAPPEAR OR ARE DOWN GRADED. IF THEIR ARE ANY DEDICATED SOVIET PLAYERS OUT THERE. I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM YOU. THANKS.



ME. I ENJOY PLAYING AS RUSSA. I TOO ENJOY ALL CAPS BECAUSE PEOPLE GET SO BENT. IT MAKES NO SINCE THAT FOLKS GET OFFENDED BY ALL CAPS. WHAT, DO YOU REALLY GET YOUR FEELINGS HURT BY BIG LETTERS.

I HAVE A FRIEND WHO JUST CAN'T SEE SO WELL AND HE TYPES EVERYTHING IN CAPS. BUT WHO CARES??????



LOL

< Message edited by parusski -- 4/8/2012 6:13:17 PM >


_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to wg335910)
Post #: 5
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 6:56:46 PM   
wg335910


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The caps were childish fustration of constantly getting run over by German units.

(in reply to parusski)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 7:02:40 PM   
parusski


Posts: 4684
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From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wg335910

The caps were childish fustration of constantly getting run over by German units.


I know. BUT THEY seem to bother SOME people inordinately.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to wg335910)
Post #: 7
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 7:04:55 PM   
AFV


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LOL.

Oops, caps.

(in reply to parusski)
Post #: 8
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 7:14:23 PM   
parusski


Posts: 4684
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AFV

LOL.

Oops, caps.


Good one.


But I digress. wg335910, I am not the one to answer your initial question, since I almost always play the German side. I only left my comment out of annoyance.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to AFV)
Post #: 9
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 9:31:45 PM   
Disciple

 

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The Germans and the Soviets present very different challenges. To enjoy either you must accept those differences. From the Russian 1941 perspective you should accept your army is very poor and the German army is the best in the world. It's a no brainer that the Russians will take a severe beating and lose vast areas of territory, no matter how well you play. BUT, time and space are the allies of the Soviets. They have plenty of territory they can afford to lose. They have seemingly limitless manpower and will slowly learn how best to use it. And they have an industrial capacity which in 1941 may be inadequate for their need, but will grow to the point that the Soviet Union becomes a military colossus by '43/'44. The point being, that when playing the Soviets from 1941, you shouldn't become attached to or focused on ANYTHING. If you have a favourite army or unit, chances are the Germans will trash it. Have a city you want to defend, chances are the Germans will take it. Caring about the fate of armies, cities and defence lines is a sure way to disappointment and frustration. Accept that in 1941 and 1942 you'll lose almost constantly. Don't worry about it. Your goal is to hold enough of the Soviet Union together that come late '42/'43 the tide turns decisively in your favour. You can then enjoy 1943-5 doing to the Germans what they did to you in the first 2 years of the conflict. Which is another point - if you're going to play the 1941-45 campaign it doesn't matter whether you play as the Soviets or the Germans - in any normal game both sides will have to play through periods of desperate (and it feels like, hopeless) defence. For the Soviets it starts that way, for the Germans it goes that way. If you don't enjoy that type of challenge you won't enjoy the GC from either sides perspective.

On one last note, the disappearing units are actually less painful for the Soviets. The NKVD border troops are weak and shouldn't be missed. The tank divisions come back (as brigades) and anyway are so prone to routing and shattering regardless of CV you'll learn never to rely on them. The Germans however have many units withdrawn during the game, and given they don't have enough units to man the line in depth, having one or more taken away (unexpectedly unless you are paying really close attention) can really hurt.

(in reply to parusski)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/8/2012 9:56:20 PM   
Ramses


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Disciple

The Germans and the Soviets present very different challenges. To enjoy either you must accept those differences. From the Russian 1941 perspective you should accept your army is very poor and the German army is the best in the world. It's a no brainer that the Russians will take a severe beating and lose vast areas of territory, no matter how well you play. BUT, time and space are the allies of the Soviets. They have plenty of territory they can afford to lose. They have seemingly limitless manpower and will slowly learn how best to use it. And they have an industrial capacity which in 1941 may be inadequate for their need, but will grow to the point that the Soviet Union becomes a military colossus by '43/'44.

Sounds pretty historical to me; if the aim of the game is to reflect what actually happened, this is what should be expected.

(in reply to Disciple)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 8:25:29 AM   
sillyflower


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wg335910

EVERY THING IS AGAINST YOU. YOUR UNITS ARE UNDERSTRENGTH AND WHEN YOU FINALLY ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF DEFENSIVE LINE PUFF YOUR UNITS EITHER DISAPPEAR OR ARE DOWN GRADED. IF THEIR ARE ANY DEDICATED SOVIET PLAYERS OUT THERE. I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM YOU. THANKS.


Me. German may be more fun at the start, but the long haul is more fun to be the Russian. Russians can alos sometimes be more fun even in the summer of '41 as can be seen in my, now concluded, AAR vs Carnage

Masochists please ignore this post.


_____________________________

web exchange

Post: I am always fearful that when I put this game down on the table and people see the box-art they will think I am some kind of neo-Nazi

Reply: They already know you're a gamer. What other shame can possibly compare?

(in reply to wg335910)
Post #: 12
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 11:39:40 AM   
gids

 

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with te latest patches it isnt tbh,i played a game now against the AI and yes there it is like it should be ,a good dam game ,but against a german  human ,wel get  yourself ready to get the whipping of your life
i played against some superb opponent i have to say though
1st 1 was tarhunnas you can read the AAR :) beating of a lifetime ,i played very offensive which costed me in the end 15 million casualties,then i tried a game against a michael   some month ago well lets say i gave up he took leningrad moscou and was a good chunk onwards to stalingrad  ,pretty amazing that game  ,i think he found a way to handle the supply  like modern times and then i played anorak ,that game started out ok but after a while i noticed i never was in a position i could hurt him ever,maybe sometimes cut a unit of yes
i decided to play defensive against him....so retreating when i was in danger losing tons of lives,trying to use rivers as defensive lines ,a mix of carpet and  line defense that went ok till the blizzard i still lost leningrad and moscou though .....just like glaca in his last game and i think hes defense was even better planned then mines with more thought to  the units,he should never have lost moscou ,but i was ok ..lets play on maybe i gave up ground to fast(which i still find ridiculous,playing  smart being punished),then blizzard came and i couldnt do as much damage as i wanted tbh ,german players already know they will get hurt so they just retreat every turn 1 to 2 hexes (pretty much calculated) and you dont get through  and they survive the blizzard without to much problems ,but ok thats a tactic  and still have np with it
then i made defense some turns  before blizzard ended ,because from my game against tarhunnas ,i know the germans in 42 are still damass strong,so i knew he  would hit in the south(leningrad moscou taken,dont need rocketscience degree  to figure that 1 out) and i made 1 a 3 to 4 layer defense line all over strengthened with forts  on keypoints ...lol he went through it like the re was  nothing,units in reserve nothing helped ,y i had some small succeses but once the german player gets through....well youre in for a treat its 41 all over ,he kept going and going i piled up army after army in front of him (as russian you are not allowed to be smart,you need to play like the  russians in their time)till he reached stalingrad  then he decided to go for baku and he reached it alright
he did tons of supply through air ,your airforce wont intercept em even close, because the airmodel in the game is ....special,your AA units dont seem to fire very good (il be nice ) ,the supply system has never been worse for the soviets ,because apparently the german players have systems now to let it peak and maximize it till over 100%,you as a soviet you will be hindered by your 1-1 counters Thousands of units which rarely will have enough of anything til 43,and dont get me started about the Command cap that changes from 24 to 18 after a year or something so your forced to make HQ and spand AP on a whole reorganization of the front ,(ofc you can avoid that by using immediatly 18 cap ,but you still wont have enough HQ then)
but anyhow i decided to build 2 tankarmies and try to puncture through the sides ,waiting for level 10 freeze weather  ,and made guardcorps units with tons of arty to get through it ,wel lets say after that i saw the results i decided to give up,
and yes i put half my units in static mode and yes i put the units that needed it in refit and maximized the supply
a good german player will now go for leningrad and moscou before the blizzard(which in 95% he will reach),and after the blizzard he will put everything in the south ALL his panzers all his SU (something that didnt really happen in real,but in the game they can pull it off because your units in the north and center wont be strong enough to push through ,so he will screen em and all reserves south,you wont stop that train i promise you

conclusion if you want to play a good fun game as the soviets you have 2 options
A play the ai ,it does a good job and still will prove a challenge ,but not as satisfying as playing against a human(although never had much satisfaction tbh) :p
B play a retarded human germ player who drools and never heared of WItE and is its first game so you have a chance :p.
this is not critisism tbh it is just like it is ,not ment to play against a human german opponent ,if you try it against anyone  like some famous german names here in the forum get prepared to be very dissapointed :),ofc still give it a go by al means
PS this all my personal  opinion,i still have dam big fun playing the scenarios and the AI ,i just hope they will rework some things in time,i read in WiTW about supply depots , that sounds like a dam great idea,even if your units are trapped you still can draw some supply  from that depot  and have a chance to free your units ,where it is now zero chance or maybe 3%

< Message edited by gids -- 4/9/2012 11:46:57 AM >

(in reply to sillyflower)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 12:02:40 PM   
76mm


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gids
conclusion if you want to play a good fun game as the soviets you have 2 options
A play the ai ,it does a good job and still will prove a challenge ,but not as satisfying as playing against a human(although never had much satisfaction tbh) :p
B play a retarded human germ player who drools and never heared of WItE and is its first game so you have a chance :p.
this is not critisism tbh it is just like it is


gids, you're not making me happy; I've just started another campaign game against a human, what was I thinking?

I like playing the AI until the spring of 1942 when, in my experience, the AI competely falls apart.

You've certainly played some good opponents, but I'm curious to see if the game is as tilted as your experience suggets. There are certainly at least a few on this forum who hold completely different views as to which side is favored, it is really rather interesting...

< Message edited by 76mm -- 4/9/2012 12:03:36 PM >

(in reply to gids)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 12:26:32 PM   
gids

 

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thats why i said its my"personal opinion" :)

(in reply to 76mm)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 12:53:20 PM   
Tarhunnas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gids

thats why i said its my"personal opinion" :)


Note gids with a rather long post using only lower case letters.

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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 1:15:24 PM   
gids

 

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meh writing here in the forum  is like tip toeing in a minefield,i tried to combine my expirience from several games as a russian player ,without being offensive or push my opinion into peoples throat ,just want to share my feelings
i can be right ,i can be wrong ,in the end i still wouldnt like to be without the game ... ;)

(in reply to Tarhunnas)
Post #: 17
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 1:49:46 PM   
76mm


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gids

meh writing here in the forum  is like tip toeing in a minefield,i tried to combine my expirience from several games as a russian player ,without being offensive or push my opinion into peoples throat...


er, I hope my comments didn't trigger this response. I'm certainly interested to hear your experience, but just find it interesting that some others seem to think completely differently about game balance. I think that the wild swings in game balance caused by the numerous major patches has caused these differing perceptions.

(in reply to gids)
Post #: 18
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 2:05:39 PM   
gids

 

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nah noworries 76 were still very good friends ;)

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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 3:04:08 PM   
Tarhunnas


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gids

meh writing here in the forum  is like tip toeing in a minefield


And sure hope it wasn't me triggering it, I was only joking because the OP was writing in all capital letters.

(in reply to gids)
Post #: 20
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 3:18:46 PM   
gids

 

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yea ofcourse tarhunnas ,youre the most "offensive"guy i met ,on a serious note i was just speaking in general

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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/9/2012 8:45:12 PM   
IvanShuski

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wg335910
EVERY THING IS AGAINST YOU. YOUR UNITS ARE UNDERSTRENGTH AND WHEN YOU FINALLY ESTABLISH SOME KIND OF DEFENSIVE LINE PUFF YOUR UNITS EITHER DISAPPEAR OR ARE DOWN GRADED. IF THEIR ARE ANY DEDICATED SOVIET PLAYERS OUT THERE. I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM YOU. THANKS.


Well, you've basically nailed all the great things of playing as the soviets. Think about the challenge.

First thing to enjoy the soviets is to accept that, in 1941, your units are there to be burnt, and your ground is there to be lost. Your role basically consists on make the germans pay as much as possible (in men, material, and specially time) for every city they take and every soviet division they destroy. If you can do this, eventually the Axis War Machine will wear down, you'll be allowed to hold your ground, groom your units, and finally to smack the Axis back to Berlin.

(in reply to wg335910)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/10/2012 3:47:42 AM   
Scook_99

 

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Random weather should be the standard now. It doesn't guarantee anything....but, I play German, I get mud every game. I take Leningrad about turn 15, get next to Moscow, and don't own the whole Donbas. My friend plays German, gets 17 clear weather turns, romps over me and says it's easy being field grey

Play random weather, it's only fair.

(in reply to IvanShuski)
Post #: 23
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/10/2012 3:09:45 PM   
gids

 

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tbh i dont play anymore without :),its 1 of the good things ,it gives just like historical an element of surprise and nastyness ,it can turn out good or bad

(in reply to Scook_99)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/11/2012 12:07:08 AM   
Farfarer

 

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The Soviets only seem weak as they are surprised and weak in 1941. They get hugely powerful and can be sculpted into exactly the force you want.

(in reply to gids)
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RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/11/2012 3:11:46 PM   
gids

 

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lol...i could have a huge discussion about that but try playing anorak michael and some others :)let me know how it goes with "sculpting" your force :)
then theres no discussion needed

< Message edited by gids -- 4/11/2012 3:12:28 PM >

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Post #: 26
RE: WHO IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WANT TO PLAY THE RUSSIAN SIDE! - 4/11/2012 6:37:46 PM   
Aurelian

 

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.....sculpted into exactly the force you want.

Not exactly true.

For example, I want a 24CP Tank army of 3 Tank 2 Mech Corps plus a Breakthrough Artillery division or two. Without any penalty.

So, just how can I sculpt a 15CP Tank army into that?

I want the 24CP at start CCA in 1942. Same lack of penalty. How?

(in reply to gids)
Post #: 27
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