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A Game of Balance

 
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A Game of Balance - 4/1/2012 1:58:47 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		Fall Gelb: JLPowell(Allies) vs BattleVonWar(Axis) Full 1.01 Patch

(All Majors set to Hard)

Little piece of the game is all. For the argument of balance and what I have witnessed this far. France was very hard to take, I advanced way too far into French Territory and got my Arm Cut off. Losing some Armor/Mech. The Supply Situation and some of the stronger French Units completely caught me off guard. I was not prepared for fighting a France in this Patch. Surprisingly capable opponent. The Full Fall of France was delayed all the way into 1941 I believe. The French Navy was used skillfully along with air power to decisively stop any U-Boat Grand Smash of UK shipping. I find this aspect very irritating and I put my heart into attacking UK Shipping.

The second Knock Out Punch from this opponent came from an early DOW from the USSR. This was unexpected and certainly for a moment I thought I would have Russian Tanks in Berlin by Winter of 1940 but a quick repulse by Superior German reserves and relocated Units meant that it was a stalemate. Ultimately delaying France even further and The Russians proved they can fight a little too early for my tastes.

Onward:

April 1941:

The UK Navy must have taken a few bites, as continual sacrifices by Land Based Tac Air and what remains of the Axis Fleets have lead to a full Battle of North Africa and Mediterranean. Il Duce and Churchill have been trading recipes in the Sands of North Africa, neither stepping farther forward than the their fortified Lines in El Alemein. Dozens of Capitol Ships make a pathway from Egypt to Italy. The Battles fierce, almost as fierce as the battles in France. Though on the Seas... We truly have brought the Navy aspect into this game, by far...

With the First Collapse of the Soviet Armies just weeks ago, not much loss of readiness is seen(perhaps the Russian Door is made of steal and we'll wait and see) Thus fair the deepest penetration into the USSR is around Odessa and Panzer Korps there have managed to kill a few units other than that it's a stalemate.

Yugoslavia the only Minor aside the Low Countries and Norway to enter the fray.



Post #: 1
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/1/2012 8:39:02 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Having a very interesting game with BattleVonWar. As he stated we are playing Fall Gleb with all majors set to hard to limit PP's.

BattleVonWar is a very agressive offensive player very armor focused. This is actually similar offensive style to my own, so I focused on the things I know give me problems. I had the advangage of having played a strong defender 'rjh1971' who schooled me by killing of a couple of armor divisions which were a bit too aggressive. That battle was GC pre patch else I would have been in for serious trouble, but there is really no stopping the Germans in that scenario pre-patch.

I also had a bit of luck (& made some). Every chance I got to force a retreat where an armor had no excape I took. Most if the time I lost more than I killed and didn't force a retreat. But this was inf replacements for armor... Eventually I killed a Armor Corps by using the entire English Air Force and much of the French air then hitting from many sides. I took many air losses but killing an armor corps early in the game is pretty decisive. Overall I succeded in killing several armor units including one VERY lucky kill at 2:1. Most attacks were 3:1 German units just to strong to get much better odds. The hard setting (75% $$$) must have made replacing these losses very dificult.

Situation snap from turn 8: 1 July 1940 Germans advancing directly through Ardennes. Very narrow salient. Note key defensive placement of very strong unit at edge of Maginot line. Effectiveness on units in line is much improved in patch, but not unrealistic IMO. They should not be able to attack out with this much strength however. I stand by the assertion that a full strength inf corps in the line isn't going to be dislodged.




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< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/1/2012 9:07:16 AM >

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RE: A Game of Balance - 4/1/2012 8:57:31 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		No 'house rules' except not to 'exploit' game flaws like splitting units over tech level (Patch 1.01 fixed this)

Since the house rules were essentially a quote from Butch Cassidy ...
>>
Harvey Rules? In a knife fight? No rules! 
[Butch immediately kicks Harvey in the groin] 
Butch Well, if there aint' going to be any rules, let's get the fight started. Someone count. 1,2,3 go.
<<
I needed to take some precausions against a 'long shot' sneak attack...

It would have really made my day had he DOW on US and tried to take it but alas it never happened. The defensive units caused the US a little bit of a delay reaching $$ needed for tech upgrades.




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< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/1/2012 9:11:23 AM >

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Post #: 3
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/1/2012 11:09:58 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Now it can be told.... The French Coverup
On the first turn of the game the French high command made a HUGE mistake seeing the need for immediate reinforcements they spent all available cash on new units. Unfortunately they forgot to confer with Msr XML regarding the consesquences. Merde... upkeep costs cause budget to go negative (Very negative) Units must be destroyed to bring the budget out of 'penalty', but units are all holding the front. The new government claps lid of secrecy on this event (all existing ministers were of course sacked) The Bosch must not know of this said the new defence minster less they switch from penetration attacks to broad front attrition which we can not sustain without replacements. A brave front is made units keep to the front and in the Maginot Line.





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< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/1/2012 11:36:04 AM >

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Post #: 4
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/1/2012 11:24:06 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Now It Can Be Told Continued....
Reacting quickly Churchill sends massive reinforcements but even having consulted with Madam Xml the famous psychic they misread the code and soon trip the upkeep trigger as well. Not having to hold a line Churchill orders the destruction of units to bring upkeep back to sustainable levels. Again secrecy is paramount as the home island is left vulnerable as garrison units are destroyed.

The magic number is 'under 15 corps and under 20 divisions' says the XML division of the game rules intrepretion ministry (after examination of the critical document titled 'increasing_upkeep_cost.xml'. The ministry stated the document should have been easily found as it was filed approprately. During parlimantry Q&A the minstry official was forced to admit the document may have been difficult to find. The following exchange in the house of commons was met with howls of outrage...

" ...You hadn't exactly gone out of your way to call attention to them had you? I mean like actually telling anyone or anything.' But the plans were on display...' o n display? I eventually had to go down to the cellar to find them.' `That's the display department.' `With a torch.' `Ah, well the lights had probably gone.' `So had the stairs.' `But look you found the notice didn't you?' `Yes,' said Arthur, `yes I did. It was on display in the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying "Beware of The Leopard".' -- (Humor shamelessly stolen from - Douglas Adams)


Skyrocketing maintance costs are soon brought under control. at a cost...

One minister reviewing the document said it was a bit difficult to read. Nonsense plain as day said the minister for game rules documentation...

See>>>
<effect param1="0" param0="11622" method="Flag.SetValue"/> </effects> </option> </options> </event>
<!--Counting UK infantry - information-->
-<event oneTimeChecking="1" visibleByPlayer="1" countryID="9" eventID="11631"> <title>ZID_11631_title</title> <description>ZID_11631_desc</description> <beginDate year="1939" month="9" day="1"/> -<condition> -<and>
<!--Random check-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="100" param0="1" method="System.GetRandomNumber"/> <operator value="lessOrEqual"/> <rightOperand constValue="10"/> </expression>
<!--Country is active-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param0="9" method="Country.IsActive"/> <operator value="equals"/> <rightOperand constValue="1"/> </expression>
<!--Country is not AI controlled-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param0="9" method="Country.IsAIControlled"/> <operator value="equals"/> <rightOperand constValue="0"/> </expression> -<or> -<and>
<!--more than 20 divisions-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="0" param0="9" method="Country.GetUnitCount"/> <operator value="greater"/> <rightOperand constValue="20"/> </expression>
<!--more than 10 corps-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="1" param0="9" method="Country.GetUnitCount"/> <operator value="greater"/> <rightOperand constValue="20"/> </expression> </and>
<!--more than 50 divisions-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="0" param0="9" method="Country.GetUnitCount"/> <operator value="greater"/> <rightOperand constValue="50"/> </expression>
<!--more than 15 corps-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="1" param0="9" method="Country.GetUnitCount"/> <operator value="greater"/> <rightOperand constValue="15"/> </expression> </or>
<!--Flag not fired yet-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param0="11631" method="Flag.GetValue"/> <operator value="equals"/> <rightOperand constValue="0"/> </expression> </and> </condition> -<options> -<option chanceAI="100" optionID="1"> <description>ZID_11631_op1</description> <tooltip>ZID_11631_desc1</tooltip> -<effects>
<!--Set flag-->
<effect param1="1" param0="11631" method="Flag.SetValue"/> </effects> </option> </options> </event>
<!--Counting UK infantry - historical size-->
-<event oneTimeChecking="1" visibleByPlayer="1" countryID="9" eventID="11632"> <title>ZID_11632_title</title> <description>ZID_11632_desc</description> <beginDate year="1939" month="9" day="1"/> -<condition> -<and>
<!--Random check-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param1="100" param0="1" method="System.GetRandomNumber"/> <operator value="lessOrEqual"/> <rightOperand constValue="10"/> </expression>
<!--Country is active-->
-<expression> <leftOperand param0="9" method="Country.IsActive"/> <operator value="equals"/> <rightOperand constValue="1"/> </expression>
<!--Country is not AI controlled-->

"How much of this jibber jabber do I need to wade thru" asked the Chancellor of the Exchequer

"Only eight thousand one hundred and eighty rows of it" replied the Minister of Game Documentation, "quite a concise document if I say so my self."

"But where are the costs exactly?"

"Well they are not actually in this document."

"Then where are they?"

"Can get back to you on that sir..."





< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/2/2012 12:54:32 AM >

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Post #: 5
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/2/2012 12:00:02 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		We felt like we were fighting in China not in France to be honest! If I knew killing your units would cause such a damaging effect I would have stayed back and reinforced a little(lost less than all my Vehicles but one Corp) If it wasn't for the great shortcomings of the Luftwaffe in separating the RAF/BEF from the French Cities Sea Lion was considered in the Light of imminent defeat some time in 1941 or '42 when the Army was ready and if nothing else to raise the hair upon the PM's neck enough to force him to stop killing U-Boats that tend to float to the surface like so many Cuban Cigars for target practice ( We are U-boats we are capable of Submerging? Once? )

(The Siege of Paris lasted I believe a couple of Months, feels a little bit more reminiscent of WW1)

Meanwhile in the East, May Falls:

The Russians Fight to every Last Red is Fallen, finally the entire German Army is regrouped And the DAK is riding toward Cairo in Egypt. A Wing and Prayer and Wing and a Prayer is that how goes? I wonder if the Allies might take an armistice. They did the first time around :P

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 6
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/6/2012 6:00:20 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		This is a bit out of sequence but I thought I would post it just for fun. After enough time has passed you can tell me how inaccurate it is:

9 November 1941 USSR UK combined Intelligence estimate.
German Navy
@ 10 surface units operating in small groups all over the place.. one CV engaged.
Air units.
USSR @ 6 FTR + several from minors and perhaps Italy few Tac no STR known.
Egypt/Libya MANY air units @5 FTR 5+ TAC plus Italian ?? and at least 2 Hungarian TAC
Sitting in or having driven thru the Qattara Depression... 1 level 3 arm XXX (DAK) one level 3 arm Div one level 3 inf corps plus several Italian arm corps (all still on the right (or wrong) side of the Nile but threat is extreme {strong UK units holding at present several Inf Corps}
Switzerland - After a number of turns of unsuccessful attacks GE has assigned strong units
one level 4 arm division (this one really makes me wonder???) one level 2 Arm corps and several strong inf corps Switzerland is looking to be in serious trouble.

Other areas ??? Estimation is 3-5 additional Arm corps not sure where they will pop up
no indications of any STR bombing Ftrs and Tac in France but numbers and strength unknown.


Other news
A daring raid captured Brest which has been reinforced with a UK inf Corps (mostly this was naval base denial) expect GE will send strong units to remove this soon but at least it is a distraction. With any luck I can extract the units when uber pz show up, avoiding a Dieppe like result.
Crete has been held and is strongly reinforced by UK forces Yugoslavia and Greece have capitulated however.




I will post some AAR updates with some screen shots from the attack on France thru the fall of Paris and the USSR sneak attack during the same period when I get some time (perhaps this weekend) for now playing is more fun than documenting.

Have a nice screen shot of Brest (also showing S England) but I am informed by MI-5 that if I post it I will be shot...

Swiss have shared this information with us. Alas the RN cannot help here... Note level the 4 Pz Div with 100 exp. An alarming development




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< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/6/2012 6:07:49 AM >

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Post #: 7
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/7/2012 11:27:23 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		1942 Upon us:

Russians are fully mobilizing. The UK is fighting for every inch of Real Estate to the last man... Fighter Duels Erupt over the Channel! The United States is busy planning to sell more equipment to the combatant nations (thus far)

Germany and her Axis Partners Endeavors look bleak without a major turn of events. Egypt may fall, The RAF and Russian Air Forces run a round the hour Bombing Campaign of German Civilians...Outrage at this is why some believe that the Reich has turned on their trading partners Switzerland for more resources, soon to install an Axis Friendly Government there.

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Post #: 8
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/9/2012 2:39:37 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline
Battle,

Quick question on economics. We are playing on Hard, and from what I can see everyone has more $$ even at this level than they should (should have put Axis Minors on hard or very hard they appear to have VERY large air forces (total perhaps 10 units between them?) Do you agree?

The proportion of $$ is slowly moving to the allies, but there is so much $$$ attrition war simply will not exhaust it IMO. Pearl Harbor is 'late' so we haven't got to see US influence yet.

I did a bit of checking regarding production during the war and using 1944 as a baseline (pretty much everyone's peak production year. I see the following based on ToF and published information

Ratio: Nation: ToF 1944 PP: Published GDP(billions of 1990 USD equivalent)
0.71: Germany: 397: $559: (includes France Austria {Poland counted in Germany})
0.35: UK: 122: $346: (British Isles ONLY)
0.65: USSR: 238: $362
0.26: USA (100%): 384: $1499: Includes ETO and PTO. ETO actual allocation ranged from 70-85%
0.36: USA (70%): 384: $1049: Most sources indicate US commitment to ETO was 70-85% and varied somewhat from year to year.

Normalizing the ratios setting Germany = 1.00 indicates approximate game design Bias NOTE Germany is VERY significantly overestimated vrs UK and US only slightly overestimated vrs USSR
There is a statistically VERY high correlation between GDP and war production This game like most tends to overestimate the German economy.

Nation: Ratio: Factor
Germany: 1.00: 1.0
UK: 0.49: 2.04
USSR: 0.92: 1.09
US (100):0.37: NA
US(70): 0.51: 1.96

All things are not equal costs very etc but this is a good baseline. This indicates that the number in the factor column would need to multiplied by the ToF number to approach Historical figures (normalized on Germany) The underestimation of Allied production is very striking.

Based on ToF Gotterdammerung Scenario Start and published GDP for 1944 as this is a ratio analysis it is not subject to most equivalency errors as underling assumptions are relative not absolute.

Italy not included due to effectively knocked out of war.

My conclusion so far is normal scenario generates too much economic production and Hard is closer but appears to still overestimate economic production (likely game underestimates maintenance costs significantly) US and UK production VASTLY undervalued in ToF.

All these items are addressable in Mods, but Wasteland should attempt an accurate baseline if possible.








< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/9/2012 2:46:48 AM >

_____________________________

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Post #: 9
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/9/2012 4:51:21 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		I will be 100% honest here as well. I came into this game over confidant. TO BOOT: I never got the Russian Readiness smack. I thought that there was no way no matter what you would do you would survive this long. To be honest do you think you would have if you were down to 33% readiness for half of 1941? Really think hard on that, it's doubtful...

10 to 15 Axis Minor Air Fleets at least. Including what 2 sunken Royal Navy Ships by them? Hmmm, I doubt those antiques had the capability.

As for production, you offer up a very compelling argument. I cannot verify the exact numbers. It's staggering though what the US brought to bare on the ETO.

If this is a matter of game balance, which I think it is rather than historical production figures.

If The Russian Readiness Smack had hit you would need a MASSIVE Army to invade Germany or 10-20 A-Bombs to drop. Each on Germany's Major Production Centers plus a Huge Civil Unrest factor to go with the dropping of each bomb in order to win.

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 10
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/9/2012 7:30:43 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		How it will play out is still unknown clearly the Allies will not loose at this point. But can you hold out longer than they did historically? Pearl Harbor event just triggered so the Naval balance at least in the open Atlantic has shifted. Lost another UK CV getting bombed by Romanians and Hungarians etc ironic if Hungarians had sunk it. I am sure they must have had lots of naval combat training perhaps with the Swiss or Slovaks or some other land locked nations. (pretty sure you had 2 Hungarian Tac in N Africa along with what must have been a LOT of other air-power. Lots of minor country Ftr intercepts on the east front as well.

USSR is sitting pretty I expect they would win on points if it goes to the end. (Game can't actually end until 1948 as USSR and Allies are not the same 'side' kind of odd in a two player game. I would love to play this three player, but it would be be pretty slow going I expect (plus PBEM does not support it at present) Finland has been taken, and I expect to take Persia within a few turns.

Felt a bit guilty taking on the AI in Finland but after you went after the Swiss I couldn't resist. It was Waaaaay to easy the as Finn AI is totally hopeless.

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Post #: 11
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/10/2012 7:45:19 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		Yes, my Hungarian Tactical Air(Land Locked Masters of the Sea) odd... It seems that interceptors don't do very much even when bombers have no air superiority. I am watching the USSR/USA pound the Reich into submission. -10% of production so far, and that's going up. It seems odd, as historically the bombing only lifted up the German Resolve and boosted production. IMHO it does make for fun strategy.

Where did you get what, 7-8 USA Bombers? Whoa, those things look like Atom Bombs without Atom Bombs :P and it's only the beginning of 1942

Suppose it's only Fair you threw Finland to the fire. :: shakes head :: This looks like a very Soviet World at this rate. I don't see much of a Western Allied Offense Force. I am guessing that we might make 1946...

News on the Front:

Invasion of Sicily Fails. Germany Invades The Middle East and Russian and German lines about to meet there.

Brest British Unit evacuated by air back to England to fight another day.

Hundreds and Hundreds Air Duels now. This has become a very stagnant Air War Game/Little Naval exchanges here or there. : ) This guy has enough Air Power to Sink Germany I think in 50 Turns we'll see if I can survive, any more bombers and England could fly itself to Germany : )

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 12
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/10/2012 7:06:23 PM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		FYI I got the wakadoodle bankrupt event which is why I ran out of Sicily. I expect you would have kicked me out but it would have taken a while... If I wasn't bankrupted by the event I could have repaired the damaged units from Egypt (3 corps) and made a fight of it. That's also why I had to evacuate Brest I could have easily repaired the unit there and held out longer but 'poof' all my money was gone.... Just like World of Warcraft sapped by an invisible rogue elf. LOL the events are needed in this game to handle things and make modding possible. BUT they shouldn't DRIVE game-play. In PBEM particularly the events are totally out of the players control marginalize players decisions. I know for sure the Soviet Events (or lack of them) drastically affected you, and not in a good way.

Sequence of play starting to look like this:
1 Move units
2 Combat
3 Draw cards from magic deck
4 build units (unless wrong card drawn)
5 Repair units (unless wrong card drawn
6 deploy any units which magically appear
7 Teleport home if in country which surrenders

I could do with a bit less of #3 #6 and #7.

Waiting for World In Flames (hope springs eternal)







Attachment (1)

< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/10/2012 7:10:09 PM >

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Post #: 13
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/12/2012 6:47:46 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		I will say this much, from the onset of this game, things have gone totally unexpectedly. Here I have met a match for me in skill, craft but most important so far in TOF, determination. Although I didn't ever expect a full Spearhead of Russians across my borders while I'm attacking France. Was this even possible? I highly doubt it, after the purges and the Winter War. 50,000 Germans should have been able to take on the Russian Army of 1940.
(considering they had just about had their butts handed to them)

To boot, I never expected that it would take till 1941 to knock out France and fighting for North Africa and The Middle East was an impossibility without the Luck I got from the cards I drew. Then I got the Vichy event which threw in a few beautiful ships to annoy your supply. Other than that it's not like taking out your supply has been much of an issue. I have never built a single U-boat but I do believe I have destroyed every convoy to the Isles, one way or the other. Others speak as if this was a point, I cannot see it.

Despite several MASSIVE blunders I seem to get rewarded after the fact. I am now on a new Offensive in the South of Russia. Not sure how luck will turn on this one, when the USA came in with that many Bombers, totally leveling France and Germany I was about to say I am near defeat. Although I had to see if I could push...

I mentioned The Events should be in the hands of the players, it was said to me that it would take too much time. I was like, "then put in the major events." I also said these Panzer Korps were going to dictate the war, and they do? Pretty much when in supply, and as you've noticed I don't have much of a problem fighting in Basra or in The Suez with them.

Game has some major patching to be done. The Air and Naval aspects too.

Nearing 5 Million Russian Dead by The Summer of 1942...I doubt even they could fight on in this situation? Unless those are captured? (we need a manpower pool like in Guns of August) Germany is near 2 Million

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 14
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/12/2012 10:54:30 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		1942 Spring:

The Kiev Offensive set off, including 6 Panzer Korps, Dozens of German Divisions and Army Korps. Over a Million Russians surrender.

In Iraq Russian and German Tanks battle for the Oil Wealth of the Middle East. A draw at the Iranian Border...

Meanwhile the Western Allies seem content in Bombing from One end of France to very end of Germany. From Narvik to Bordeaux ... Russians Through Poland, Berlin and the Baltic Port Cities all the way to Varna. Millions of Dead Axis Citizens cry out to the World Community. An Atrocity I say!

The Entire Baltic Fleet is being chased down, fighting for it's life. The US/USSR/UK Navy unrelenting in it's final demise.

Meanwhile Italy has it's own Pond in the Med. For now...

Level 3 Luftwaffe is pretty much fodder(they don't know how to intercept Bombers obviously) stronger more Fighters you build, waste your time, mine as well build more tanks :P

< Message edited by battlevonwar -- 4/13/2012 12:28:38 AM >

(in reply to battlevonwar)
Post #: 15
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/14/2012 7:21:52 PM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Mid summer 1942 Turn 107 (I still plan to post some screen shots of the battle for France which ended early last year)

Current news Dateline Moscow July 1942:

Hero of the Soviet Union Unit award granted to Croatian unit defending approaches to Kiev.

Turkey enters the war on Axis side Soviet high command not concerned. 10 Corps of 'off the books' reinforcements 'appear' in caucus. Politburo votes to shoot all Turkish leaders (after they stop laughing and celebrating that the USSR benefit Hugely politically from this after the war) Armenians celebrate Churchill's remark that the 'Great Powers will break Turkey up into several small pieces after the war is won. "What were they thinking" General Marshall comments after receiving news that US Tac Air based in Cypress has sunk several elements of the Turkish navy.

USSR takes offensive in Iraq the 2 identified German armor corps have been replaced by Italian troops near Basra massive Soviet force approaches the city. German DAK and others are expected to redeploy to Turkey.

Screen shot is Croat defender of the Soviet Union. (just got to LOVE that AI) No way I will attack this unit it has stayed put for a while and defends the fron better than any unit the USSR could deploy there...

We are actually sending them treats and supplies so they will stay. It will also be a great plus when the time comes for the eventual Soviet counter offensive

I made a movie of a dancing Portuguese unit moving in and out of Lisbon (replaced by another) each turn but as it reveals Allied buildup (or lack thereof) in the area so the military censors have forbidden posting it.



Line stable along most front line units are level 3 inf Corps on both sides. German offensive has lengthened the front but appears to be stalled. "We have more men" Zhukov declares "The extension of the front has overextended the enemy".




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< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/14/2012 7:36:18 PM >

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(in reply to battlevonwar)
Post #: 16
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/18/2012 8:39:27 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		Fall 1942:

After a very very long Siege of the Ukraine, it's given up. The Axis forces retreat out of there or dig in for the Oncoming Onslaught of Russian Hordes. Which after the Invasion of Iraq(spurred on Russian Caucasus Reinforcements, plus a Massive 5-10 turn -PP dry Spell due to civil unrest) has made the Axis unlikely to last 1942 ...

D-Day is fully launched, Massive level3, strength 15 Motorized British Units line the Brittany Provincial region. With Bombers and Fighters lining the Islands of Crete, Sardinia, Cyprus... England... Islands of Death reign out over Germany!

Turkey is being invaded by the Russians and Von Manstein is being routed in quick order. First Russian Tank Korp over strength 10 spotted there. Level2.

Germany is like my one of my fillings right now that needs a crown, being ripped in two. Ironically the Luftwaffe has finally done it's job that has been failing to do all war long. Despite being the strongest Fighter force on the Planet......Fighter attacks have slightly damaged the Allied War Machine...Panzer Korps meet their foes(will show screenies of this later) Really unparalleled so far in as far as PBEM actual success in Tech and Long Term survival!

< Message edited by battlevonwar -- 4/18/2012 8:41:53 AM >

(in reply to battlevonwar)
Post #: 17
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/23/2012 12:12:08 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		After a few frustrating PBEM glitches my turn is finally uploaded. I don't expect anything decisive in in 1942. Front is pretty stable in USSR, several strong German Armor Corps have apparently moved west. A strong German counterattack may be able to push the British out of France but it will take a considerable effort so the German offensive in the East is over and the Russians are cautiously taking the offensive. Significant forces are fighting in Iraq and Turkey. IMO Germans are overextended there but they are hanging on. USSR numerical advantage has diminished the effect of Turkey joining the axis. USSR had no problem assigning 10 inf Corps and the few German units encountered there so far indicate this will be a fairly static front.

IMO there is NO Way Turkey would have joined the Axis under the conditions that existed when the event triggered (USSR never lost any significant cities and holds Persia, UK is in France and US is in the war). Unlike many other whackadoodle events however it has not destabilized or unbalanced the game significantly.

Economically the tide is changing from the Axis toward the USSR and Allies. The USSR is starting to field Armor corps and will have gained the initiative by 1943. Corsica Sardinia Cypress and Crete are jumping off points for the Allies in the Med and a significant beachhead in Brest may hold out. Once the US armor corps begin to make an appearance the Germans will likely become fully defensive. The Axis still holds all of North Africa but the Allies may bypass it altogether or or look to draw German units there to isolate. The loss of the Suez has turned out not to be as serious a setback as I expected (British Colonies were never going to contribute anything since Axis Surface units have been operating right offshore there from early in the game pretty much ignoring the CV task forces opposing them) The British Colonies AI is too stupid to build transport points so I have pretty much just written that all off (perhaps they should build a nuke they have 1100+ points piled up). Interesting the strongest Commonwealth economy,Canada is not modeled in the game.

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(in reply to battlevonwar)
Post #: 18
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/23/2012 4:32:36 PM   
gwgardner

 

Posts: 2954
Joined: 4/7/2006
Status: offline 		The British Colonies don't build STPs. The British have to build them. You should be seeing events each turn that STPs get too low.

Your CVs should handily take care of any German surface ships near the British Colonies hex. Just fly air strikes, and watch the German ships take hit after hit.

In my current PBEM with Chocolino, his British carriers are deadly against my now non-existent German surface fleet. They are also deadly against subs.

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 19
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/25/2012 8:30:37 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Some more CV's on the way to the colonies one CV has been making a strike every turn for many months and once in a while it dings something... LOL CV's armed with nerf weapons (should it REALLY take Three CV task forces to chase Axis out of the Dahlak Archipelago) And the map is STRANGE are these actually adjacent to some any commonwealth nation? REALLY? are they on the route from India or Australia to South Africa???. Production of STP unless Colonies is controlled by player is out of player control Why couldn't commonwealth AI build at least some transports they did after all and not to mention planes etc. Canada alone outproduced Italy in aircraft. Canada South Africa and Australia had significant manufacturing capability (Particularly in a game where Romania can build 10+ Ftrs) Commonwealth VERY poorly modeled in ToF UK also under produces. On the other hand modeling the possible crippling effect of U-Boats on UK industry is not handled well. If cut off UK production is largely unimpeded by resource starvation (also food shortages)

ToF pretty much models UK at a reduced level of economic activity but it is somewhat less vulnerable resource interdiction. Commonwealth is Vastly under represented, and should be fully integrated with UK economy. This would require significant modification however. Naval rules significantly flawed as there is really no need for UBoats when surface ships can operate so freely. Historically German Surface units were only effective as a threat while they tied up many UK units 'watching them', very few actual operations were conducted & those which were made usually had quick decisive results (usually German ships sunk). They sail all over the seas in ToF with relative impunity.

< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/25/2012 8:39:13 AM >

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(in reply to gwgardner)
Post #: 20
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/25/2012 8:48:29 AM   
JLPOWELL


Posts: 377
Joined: 5/5/2011
From: Pacific Time Zone
Status: offline 		Gary,

Must disagree re CV vrs surface units. I posted this a while back on another thread, but it really belongs here as it is part of this AAR.

>> 13 April Post >>
Just got some results in. The Peter Strasser has finally been sunk in my PBEM game. I kept a log of the attacks to support my contention that naval combat 'needs work'.
7 weeks of chasing this ship + 1 BB +1 CA around the Atlantic (BattleVonWar too cagey to move where TAC could hit it with laser guided bombs)

Based on the forces involved this should have been 'over' in seven hours not seven weeks.

Strikes on hex with 'reported' German CV present.
USN CV strikes 31 (including the one which finally sunk it.)
RN CV strikes 9
4 Turns ending in in sea zone with 'spotted Ge CV' (large task forces 3+BB 3+CA 4+ CV) (big stuff here bigger than battle of Midway forces on Allied side)

Port strikes (based on 'someone' getting a hit on the Strasser in that port that turn
USSR 3
USAF 5
UK 3

So 11 port strikes (actually nearly half of the damage was done this way and this is likely the least effective based on the historical record which indicates : CV strikes most deadly Surface engagements second most Port strikes third (of the three) {Pearl harbor is a special case of a surprise attack when at 'peace'})
40 CV strikes plus whatever happens when 5 CV's end a turn in the same zone (mostly nothing)50 days of 'action'. Wow if the Japanese had a few of these they could have anchored them in San Francisco bay and Bombed Sacramento. All this is about as plausible as the movie about the nuclear Carrier which went thru a wormhole back to WWII.

So ANYONE tell me that if this is WAD that the design does not need a 'bit' of tweaking.

< Message edited by JLPOWELL -- 4/25/2012 8:51:49 AM >

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"Don’t you think that if I were wrong, I’d know it?"

(in reply to gwgardner)
Post #: 21
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/25/2012 8:58:55 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		1942(first snow fall in the East)

Axis Throw up the White Flag. Imagery Later. The Middle East/With Turkey are being swallowed up. The German Eastern Front is evaporating(I think it's 3 to 1 in Units on just that front alone, not including Minors)

The Axis have done well in Brittany but can spare so few Armies and Tanks to battle the Allies there. Therefore they're going to end up grinding down to the last man. It's likely by '43 that Paris will be liberated and perhaps '44 Berlin by either side depending on the ground forces available to the Western Allies. It is quite possible to delay both into late '44 but unlikely at the current rate of things...

This is by far the finest enemy I have faced.

< Message edited by battlevonwar -- 4/26/2012 5:05:35 AM >

(in reply to JLPOWELL)
Post #: 22
RE: A Game of Balance - 4/26/2012 5:03:40 AM   
battlevonwar

 

Posts: 176
Joined: 12/22/2011
Status: offline 		Here are the death tolls for each side. As you can see France took a chunk of the German Military out. I do not believe I ever fully recovered from this loss. Also the heavy losses to a Fully Mobilized and Fully Prepared Russian Army. You can also see DAK running in the Western Deserts of Iraq away from likely 15-20 Caucasus Front Russian Armies and Tanks. Another 10 free, from the Turkey Even Firing! : ( At the time I began the invasion of the Ukraine, I was -600 PPs, which continued the entire Summer of the Invasion of the Soviet Union. I am sure that Powell shall have nicer Screenies if he took some but I did not have time to Screen Capture and window every 5 minutes.

Germany never was able to take more than a handful of Russian cities, besieging only Kiev(in front of it's fortifications) alone of Major Russian Capitols









< Message edited by battlevonwar -- 4/26/2012 5:21:22 AM >

(in reply to battlevonwar)
Post #: 23
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