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Community Request - Customized Designs

 
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Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/2/2012 11:42:54 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Hi everyone,

The new v1.7.0.12 Public Beta is now available and I want to call your attention to these new features:

• Pre-loaded Optimized Designs
o Added new feature that allows usage of pre-made custom ship and base designs loaded per race from folders at game startup:
o New designs subfolder under main game folder can contain subfolders for each race containing saved design files, e.g. "C:\Matrix Games\Distant Worlds\designs\human\"
o These design folders are also used by any themes/mods (i.e. you can create a designs subfolder cointaining race subfolders in a theme)
o These designs are loaded for each race at game startup and are used as optimized designs for each empire
o These optimized designs are used whenever an empire has all the required tech and is within current construction size limits. These optimized designs are always preferred over all other designs, unless made obsolete
o If multiple optimized designs for a single subrole can be built (e.g. multiple optimized destroyer designs), then the most advanced design will be preferred
o Optimized designs also guide AI research decisions: preference will be given to research projects with components required by the optimized designs
o Because of the above, you should make custom designs that use the race-specific tech and tech focuses (from Empire Policy) for the race, otherwise there will be many required research paths, and research will be diluted, e.g. Boskara designs should utilize Shaktur Firestorm torpedoes (race-specific tech), and Phasers (Empire Policy tech focus)

• Creating New Custom Design Files

o Create custom designs in the Design screen and then save them to a file
o Ideal setup to create new designs is to start a new game at max tech level (Level 7) so that all components are available, then create custom designs at various tech levels (different components that become available at different times in the game)
o Note that saved designs preserve the ship/base picture and any race-specific tech, so design files probably should not be shared between races - i.e. you should create different custom designs per race

Added in 1.07.13 Beta:

DESIGNS

- improved design selection for pirate ships so that not prematurely using advanced optimized designs
- AI will now create new designs to replace optimized designs if tech is significantly better than best buildable optimized design
- AI now properly obsoletes/removes old optimized designs when better designs available
- starting designs for new empires now more accurately reflect starting tech level (when using advanced tech start)
- optimized designs now properly have their Date Created reset to current date and Build Amount reset to zero when loaded
- added extra filters to designs screen: Show Latest Buildable Designs, Show Buildable Non-Obsolete Design

The combined play time all of you have put into Distant Worlds since its release is incredible and we've seen some save games with very well optimized ship designs and very successful empires. We would welcome your submissions for customized designs that the AI could learn to use to improve its play. If you have some excellent designs that you consider optimal for a particular species or combination of technologies, please read the notes above and zip up and post those files here. We'll choose the best ones to add to the official release!

Regards,

- Erik

< Message edited by Erik Rutins -- 3/20/2012 9:21:27 PM >


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Post #: 1
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 2:04:21 AM   
Igard


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Just did a quick test and it appears to be working!

So for mods, create a folder in your customizaion folder called 'designs'.

Create race folders inside your designs folder for each race.

Then save the designs inside this folder, and they load each time a new game is started.

Customization folder should look like this :- Matrix Games\Distant Worlds\Customization\'Themename'\designs\'Racename'\'yourdesigntechlevel1'.dwd

Really nice work Elliot and team!

I think I might have to go through all these for the Picard Era and at least rename the designs to match canon. I'll work on changing the components of the designs later. Oh the fun!!!

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Post #: 2
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 2:53:21 AM   
ehsumrell1


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From: The Briar Patch Nebula
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Igard

I think I might have to go through all these for the Picard Era and at least rename the designs to match canon. I'll work on changing the components of the designs later. Oh the fun!!!


Darn.....see what we've started Elliot!

Now we'll have Romulan and Klingon ships with Disruptors, Federation ships with Phasers,
Ferengi ships with Phaser Cannons, Breen with Shockwave Torpedoes.....on and on and on...

Oh my Galactic goodness!






Attachment (1)

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 4:45:51 AM   
Shadow Tiger


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This is excellent! My custom Skaven race will be able to have good starting designs now, which is a big deal since they have -20% military ship size. They also have access to the StarBurner drive, which seemed appropriate.

I wonder if this means the pre-built mining stations will use the designs as well. That would be nice to have them armed by default.

Question: Why is it that starting on the basic tech gives you access to racial tech from tier 2, but starting with tier 1 tech doesn't? With smaller military hulls this made going with tech 1 worse for ship designs. Is that intentional?

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Post #: 4
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 10:16:25 AM   
WiZz

 

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Maybe someone uploads his designs and free me from hard work?

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 2:08:38 PM   
Morelyn

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: WiZz

Maybe someone uploads his designs and free me from hard work?


I was hoping the same thing , that someone much more experienced than I would upload a generic (non-mod) set for me to use on my AI opponents. Would be great, but it IS a lot of work I know.

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Post #: 6
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 3:01:13 PM   
WiZz

 

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I have enough skills to create a deadly ship, but I'm too lazy to do it. That's why I'm using standard designs in DW.

< Message edited by WiZz -- 3/3/2012 3:02:16 PM >

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Post #: 7
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 4:18:32 PM   
Howard Mitchell


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Excellent idea.

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Post #: 8
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 8:31:58 PM   
ASHBERY76


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Nice addition but this is pretty complex and a lot of work.

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 9:50:52 PM   
Nedrear


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But the more fan loving mods like the Trekkie mod will use it for more accuracy. If only the warbird etc. use the stealth module it will give the game a little bit of fun...

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 11:11:53 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ASHBERY76
Nice addition but this is pretty complex and a lot of work.


Just start with one ship. Pick a faction you enjoy playing, design a ship, save it (you can now save individual designs) and post it here.

Regards,

- Erik

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Erik Rutins
Director of Product Development


For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 11:26:02 PM   
Igard


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Spot on there, Nedrear. If only!



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Post #: 12
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 11:43:46 PM   
Litjan

 

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I will attempt to get some designs for the humans going - just so we can avoid too much duplicate effort. I think the best approach would be to provide some basic designs for different "tech stages" that can then be used by the player to further refine his designs. Not sure if the AI would be able to do that, too?


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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/3/2012 11:49:45 PM   
WoodMan


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Hang on, is this going to change the game hugely?

Are all factions going to have brilliant ships now (that players are able to upload them for official release)? I kind of like the fact that the ships change depending on what the intelligence and other personality traits are of the AI races. I don't want every race to have optimized designs by pro players

If there was some way to limit (or increase) what players could put into ship designs race by race, forcing less intelligent races to have worse ships, but allowing players to design them to their optimum, that would be cool. Same with perhaps allowing more weapons on aggressive races ships etc

But correct me if I;m wrong there are no such limitations right? So the best ship, is the best ship fullstop, races lose the differences.

< Message edited by WoodMan -- 3/3/2012 11:52:15 PM >


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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 12:14:16 AM   
Igard


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Valid concerns, WoodMan.

I would hope that we have the sense to design these ships with an element of role-play in mind.

Maybe we should discuss our ideas a bit more before we jump in.

For example, Humans are 'all-rounders' yes? Try to give them a balanced design scheme.

Kiadians are smart but weak. Try to give them above average shielding, but low armour, less torpedoes (kinetic weapons are so uncivilized).

Perhaps we should give reasons for our design choices, or ask for feedback before we begin?

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The Picard Era for Distant Worlds

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Post #: 15
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 12:42:00 AM   
Tophat1812

 

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That Vor'cha cruiser model is nice indeed! Now finish the picard mod before you go and revamp everything with custom ships! LOL!!!!

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 1:00:43 AM   
Nedrear


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Valid point. My GW II mod - Not the WW II parody maybe the RP mod - will get a release using pre-designed RP ships. Maybe a later version 1.X. I will not work with the patches until they are official anyway.

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 1:14:20 AM   
WoodMan


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I really would like to see some kind of hardpoint system in the future, it would make creating ship designs much more fun for each race. For example, we keep the current size limit, but also add hardpoints, a peice of equipment takes up 1 hardpoint.

The hardpoints could be categorized:
Firstly, total hardpoints
then:

maximum weapons
maximum shields
maximum reactor
maximum armour

etc...

Then based on intelligence increase or decrease the max number of hardpoints, to make overall different quality ships. For example, if low intellgence, reduce total hardpoints by (pulling a number out of the air) 4. Then, you have to think, should I take off the shield or the reactor to make room for the laser etc.

Then based on personality, add or take away categorized hardpoints. So Quameno being intelligent would gain overall number of hardpoints, but lose weapons hardpoints due to the passiveness, and I guess gain shield hardpoints due to their cautiousness.

This would keep a difference between races (I think the next expansion should make this its mnain focus btw, difference between races) but make ship design great fun and I'm sure provide much fun for modders and some interesting strategic discussions for various races on the forums

< Message edited by WoodMan -- 3/4/2012 1:15:10 AM >


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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 3:11:32 AM   
Noble713


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nedrear

But the more fan loving mods like the Trekkie mod will use it for more accuracy. If only the warbird etc. use the stealth module it will give the game a little bit of fun...


Precisely. I'm forcing myself to finish the race files for my custom Star Wars mod so I can start a game and dig in making accurate designs for the Old Republic, Separatists, etc. I can't wait to encounter reasonably-accurate Munificents and Lucrehulks.

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 10:11:10 AM   
Sithuk

 

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Woodman: I find the prospect of power play ship designs for each race attractive. My preference is for a challenging game first and foremost, roleplay second.

I respect your wish for a roleplay mode where you can nerf the ship design of races who are supposed to be less intelligent in the back story. A solution would be an easy way to select between shipsets in game setup. Similar to the mod selector we have at present?

My preference for the default base shipset is that it be a power play approach where the ship sets are optimised for the race specific techs.

The ships design will not be uniform due to the race specific techs, unless of course another race acquires the race specific tech through trading.

Perhaps a randomiser for which ship sets get used by each race? There are likely to be multiple optimised ship sets rather than a perfect design for each collection of techs?

In summary:
1) I prefer the ships to be the best possible for all races. No nerfs for roleplay reasons please.
2) Game setup feature for which ship set to use (either for each race or a single collection of sets for that game. Include a random feature for available ship sets)


quote:

ORIGINAL: WoodMan

Hang on, is this going to change the game hugely?

Are all factions going to have brilliant ships now (that players are able to upload them for official release)? I kind of like the fact that the ships change depending on what the intelligence and other personality traits are of the AI races. I don't want every race to have optimized designs by pro players

If there was some way to limit (or increase) what players could put into ship designs race by race, forcing less intelligent races to have worse ships, but allowing players to design them to their optimum, that would be cool. Same with perhaps allowing more weapons on aggressive races ships etc

But correct me if I;m wrong there are no such limitations right? So the best ship, is the best ship fullstop, races lose the differences.



< Message edited by Sithuk -- 3/4/2012 10:18:50 AM >

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 10:32:00 AM   
Howard Mitchell


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Igard

Valid concerns, WoodMan.

I would hope that we have the sense to design these ships with an element of role-play in mind.

Maybe we should discuss our ideas a bit more before we jump in.

For example, Humans are 'all-rounders' yes? Try to give them a balanced design scheme.

Kiadians are smart but weak. Try to give them above average shielding, but low armour, less torpedoes (kinetic weapons are so uncivilized).

Perhaps we should give reasons for our design choices, or ask for feedback before we begin?



I completely agree. When designing my own ships I role-play based on the race's characteristics so it would be great if the designs for the other races do this to.

For example, Gizureans have a race victory condition of build the most ships. When playing them I keep my designs simple and cheap, using weight on numbers to overwhelm opponents. This ties in nicely with their lower maintenance costs. Gizureans have a huge reproduction rate and a hive mind so vast, expendable swarms of ships seems appropriate.

The Securans I play as being very careful with their people (coming from Utopian Paradise after all). I emphasise long range weapons and set them to flee when shields are at 50%. Avoiding casualties is very important.

Boskarans I play as hyper-aggressive, so I pack their ships full of weapons and put far less space into armour or shields. They also don’t flee. I’m not sure what the Boskaran for Banzai! Is but I imagine them shouting it as they charge the enemy.




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While the battles the British fight may differ in the widest possible ways, they invariably have two common characteristics – they are always fought uphill and always at the junction of two or more map sheets.

General Sir William Slim

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Post #: 21
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 11:22:51 AM   
ASHBERY76


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What happens if I design a whole set for the human A.I and then they find a superweapon ingame?

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 11:54:38 AM   
WoodMan


Posts: 1346
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From: Ol' Blighty
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sithuk

Woodman: I find the prospect of power play ship designs for each race attractive. My preference is for a challenging game first and foremost, roleplay second.

I respect your wish for a roleplay mode where you can nerf the ship design of races who are supposed to be less intelligent in the back story. A solution would be an easy way to select between shipsets in game setup. Similar to the mod selector we have at present?

My preference for the default base shipset is that it be a power play approach where the ship sets are optimised for the race specific techs.

The ships design will not be uniform due to the race specific techs, unless of course another race acquires the race specific tech through trading.

Perhaps a randomiser for which ship sets get used by each race? There are likely to be multiple optimised ship sets rather than a perfect design for each collection of techs?

In summary:
1) I prefer the ships to be the best possible for all races. No nerfs for roleplay reasons please.
2) Game setup feature for which ship set to use (either for each race or a single collection of sets for that game. Include a random feature for available ship sets)


quote:

Woodman: I find the prospect of power play ship designs for each race attractive. My preference is for a challenging game first and foremost, roleplay second.


Powerplay is fine with me, this doesn't mean everything has to be the same which is what this approach suggests. The suggestion I made incorprates roleplaying, (or we could say "variety", or "interesting racial differences" instead) and it also incorporates powerplaying as *most* of the races will still be balanced with this approach in terms of ships.

Furthermore if you want powerplay, have you tried playing as Shandar or Ugnari or Gizurean? These less intelligent races are completely overpowered compared to the Humans already, giving them ships as good as the more intelligent races would unbalance things as they don't have any negatives except their ship designs!!! For example depite their dumbness if you play Ugnari you will notice they research very fast due to creative re-engineering, a feature I like because its roleplaying, but... it means their only weakness now is their shipdesign because the penalty to research is reversed.

Have you played Shandar? No kidding here, I was able to set my taxes to 100% (or 99% because I was roleplaying and wanted my citizens to have *some* cash). This insane economy slays the Humans patetic economy.

I want a game where the race I choose completely changes the way I must approach the game. Ship designs are a huge part in this, some races are better militarily than others, making them the same is boring and doesn't make the game balanced anyway.

Hardpoint system for the win, then if you want a challenge, take a lesser race. (Edit: That last line is wrong, I mean if you want a ship design challenge, take a lesser race... they have other strengths as pointed out)

< Message edited by WoodMan -- 3/4/2012 12:19:32 PM >


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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 1:42:09 PM   
ASHBERY76


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I suppose the best way is to play a race from the start 1 tech level and focus on its military policy techs and save a design every tech update.I will certainly add my view of the games racial lore in the design in my personal mod.

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Post #: 24
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 2:13:55 PM   
Nedrear


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Woodman your race character hardpoint system would fail big time in the event system. The foreign policy (race characteristics) in a voting year of the United Colonies or other things in my GW II mod are changing that a lot. Should they be unable to build ships then? I doubt it...

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Post #: 25
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 2:39:19 PM   
ASHBERY76


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The A.I will only use 1 ship design per class type.So you will have to design for a multi role approach in mind for the A.I rather than what a player would do with a specialist design, ie bombard destroyer.

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Post #: 26
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 2:42:09 PM   
dazoline II


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I've tried this out at bit and it seems that you have to make a file per ship rather than one file containing all your chosen upgrades?

As when I have two modified ships in the same file when I create a new game to see if their there only one gets loaded. While if I have two files on with each ship when I create a new game their both there.

Is this correct?

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RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 5:02:00 PM   
Igard


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From: Scotland
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Hey dazoline II, it's working for me with multiple ships in one file.

On the designs screen, are you selecting each ship 'ctrl + click on design', then click save selected desings?

quote:

That Vor'cha cruiser model is nice indeed! Now finish the picard mod before you go and revamp everything with custom ships! LOL!!!!


Thanks, Tophat! I'm not touching these custom designs for now, far too much work! I'll make some after the mods released, and perhaps some of you guys could help me wiht that.

_____________________________

The Picard Era for Distant Worlds

Igard's Romulan Stormbird

(in reply to dazoline II)
Post #: 28
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 5:33:26 PM   
dazoline II


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Thanks, they all have to be highlighted to save. Good to know.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Igard

Hey dazoline II, it's working for me with multiple ships in one file.

On the designs screen, are you selecting each ship 'ctrl + click on design', then click save selected desings?

quote:

That Vor'cha cruiser model is nice indeed! Now finish the picard mod before you go and revamp everything with custom ships! LOL!!!!


Thanks, Tophat! I'm not touching these custom designs for now, far too much work! I'll make some after the mods released, and perhaps some of you guys could help me wiht that.



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Post #: 29
RE: Community Request - Customized Designs - 3/4/2012 6:13:34 PM   
Morelyn

 

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One problem I've had with saving ship designs, even before this beta, is that I would expect and prefer that if you start a new game and load your ship designs, they should override the default designs. What seems to happen instead is that the default designs are given new class names and exist side by side with your saved ones. So you have two destroyer designs, two frigate designs, etc.

It's not a major problem, but it means I have to go through and delete the designs I don't want, since I don't like looking at a design screen with so many designs I never intend to use.






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