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RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, No Oloren

 
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RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/1/2012 4:15:00 PM   
Pelton

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439


quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

RE: Leadership changes, I think your priority is to work on bad Corps commanders first. These suggestions aren't totally off base, but here are my individual thoughts:

Question
I am contemplating the following leader changes, is this a wise move, or am I way off??
Guderian -> OKH OKH shouldn't be doing alot of fighting; Guderian is a fighting leader. I would keep Guderian as Army commander, and Halder is good for OKH, because Admin is the rating that matters, and that's the one that counts for OKH

Von Kluge -> AGN (That's fine, I wouldn't spend alot of points to do that)

Kesselring -> AGC (Smiling Albert is tempting to use; I prefer him in Luftwaffe, but I can see either way)

Model -> AGS (I think his rank is not high enough yet in 1941, without suffering penalties when you promote him. You don't want to do that. Get him promoted first. Even so, I prefer him as top Infantry Army commander)


Ok, so Halder at OKH and keep Guderian at army level.
To change leaders for AGN/AGC/AGS I HAVE to spend alot of points as the cost was listed as something like 25+11

But I will work on corps/army level first then. Thanks for the reply.


Terje



I do not waste many AP's changing leaders during 41. I put Model in charge of I Corp and thats about it. Your best leaders should be at Corp level during 41 not army.

Mainstein and Guard should be head of 2 Corp that have 4 mech units each with allot of SU's. Mech units recover very quickly, unlike panzer divisions which require many turns.

Use your AP's to fill up 18th army with high morale infantry divisions, poineers, artillry and stug's. 18th army then can basicly solo Leningrad vs the stiffest resistance with the help of 2 panzer Corp. that are used to exploit.

Save the rest of AP's for 5 to 10 HQ build ups during 41 summer and snow.

You should have a bunch to switch out a few leaders before blizzard, then by summer of 42 400+ ap's to start building your late war defensive wall and put units in or out of static mode.

At some point late in 43 you can mess around with the leaders. The army leaders seem basicly usless during combat. The Corp leader rolls are a huge. They effect allot of close battles.

< Message edited by Pelton -- 3/1/2012 4:16:37 PM >


_____________________________

GHC
22 - 4 - 8

15 games ended in 41 (15-0-0)
7 games ended in 42 (5-0-2)
8 games ended in 43 (2-3-3)
4 games ended in 44 (0-1-3)


General Cheesefinder of WitW

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DiSQ36zfWk

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 61
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/1/2012 4:16:38 PM   
CheerfullyInsane

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439

Concerns
Where do I make my winter-fallback-line?


Warsaw?
I hear it's lovely this time of year.


_____________________________

"Something is always wrong, Baldrick. The fact that I'm not a millionaire aristocrat with the sexual capacity of a rutting rhino is a constant niggle"
- Edmund Blackadder

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 62
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/1/2012 5:06:05 PM   
terje439


Posts: 6150
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@Pelton - Thank you. You are without doubt a much more experienced errr Hitler???? (no offence intended) than me
@CheerfullyInsane - Think it is far enough to the rear?


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to CheerfullyInsane)
Post #: 63
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/1/2012 6:25:02 PM   
Q-Ball


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Pelton I think is on target with his suggestions on AP expenditures. The 18th Army idea is a good one (make that your elite formation, with plenty of fort-bashing goodies). It takes a little shifting, because all the best siege artillery seems like it's in 9th Army, for who knows what reason.

I also agree you want to save-up for Fort Zones pre-winter. Not to actually dig, because they don't really do that, but to preserve forts you already have

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 64
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/1/2012 7:12:30 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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Go with Pelton's advice as he certainly should know having run through so many games looking at the effects of deployments and combats for the Germans. Can we get a screenshot of AGC and the northern part of AGS?

(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 65
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/2/2012 4:39:11 PM   
terje439


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Turn 10

Overall
The USSR try to make a stand at the Dnepr all along its length. Well, we will not have any of that, and the line is breached north of the Pripjet, while in the south the Dnepr should be crossed next turn.
We make 41 attacks, scoring 5 held, 24 retreat, 8 surrender and 4 routs.

Losses
USSR : 96.000 troops, 1.272 guns, 357 AFVs and 99 AC.
Axis : 28.000 troops, 212 guns, 118 AFVs and 37 AC.

Cities Captured
We liberate the poor people in Gomel, Cherkassy, Kirovgrad and Krivoi Rog from communism.

Units Destroyed
2 tank divisions, 4 rifle divisions, 1 mountain division and 1 fortified region all surrender to out panzers this turn.

Pools
Manpower : 28.698
Vehicle : 163.035
Armaments : 79.822
Hiwi : 65.207.

Concerns
How far can I push before mud? I will have to order the Italians to dig somewhere soon.







Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 66
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/2/2012 5:17:28 PM   
gingerbread


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Your not serious about making a head on attack on Kiev, are you? It should be isolated to get the terrain multiplier down. Kremenchug looks much more inviting...

(in reply to terje439)
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RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/2/2012 5:29:17 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

Your not serious about making a head on attack on Kiev, are you? It should be isolated to get the terrain multiplier down. Kremenchug looks much more inviting...


Listen to him on this one going head-on into a city fight is a sure way to take losses! Punch SE from Gomel if you are over the river there and start pocketing reds or there will be hell to pay come winter. You need to try going for encirclements more and giving the reds some losses to deal with.

How is the drive on Leningrad progressing?

Where are you on the AGC corridor to Smolensk?

What are your objectives again? territory and cities to do armament and manpower damage to soviets? Or destruction of the Red Army? Take a step back and see where you are with these goals.

(in reply to gingerbread)
Post #: 68
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/2/2012 6:41:19 PM   
terje439


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quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

Your not serious about making a head on attack on Kiev, are you? It should be isolated to get the terrain multiplier down. Kremenchug looks much more inviting...


No no, poor wording on my account. They will only attack the city after it is isolated and that CV of X is wastly reduced.


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to gingerbread)
Post #: 69
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/2/2012 6:44:19 PM   
terje439


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812


quote:

ORIGINAL: gingerbread

Your not serious about making a head on attack on Kiev, are you? It should be isolated to get the terrain multiplier down. Kremenchug looks much more inviting...


Listen to him on this one going head-on into a city fight is a sure way to take losses! Punch SE from Gomel if you are over the river there and start pocketing reds or there will be hell to pay come winter. You need to try going for encirclements more and giving the reds some losses to deal with.

1. How is the drive on Leningrad progressing?

2. Where are you on the AGC corridor to Smolensk?

3. What are your objectives again? territory and cities to do armament and manpower damage to soviets? Or destruction of the Red Army? Take a step back and see where you are with these goals.


1. Slowly as I am the rivers and the USSR is well entrenched, but we take 3-4 "river" hexes per turn.
2. Cracking the line trying to break it. something like 8 hexes away from the city.
3. Territory for now, then find a good position to tackle the blizzard, then try to kill off enough troops to collapse the USSR front.


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Tophat1812)
Post #: 70
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/3/2012 9:10:55 AM   
terje439


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Turn 11

Overall
We push as hard as possible north and south of Smolensk. The USSR will either have to fall back or risk losing about 1/5th of his army. We get alot of held result when we try to force the Dnepr, so we only manage to make a few bridgeheads across. We make a total of 68 attacks, and score 1 scouted, 20 held, 40 retreats, 6 routs and 1 shatter.

Losses
USSR : 98.000 troops, 1.387 guns, 914 AFVs and 274 AC.
Axis : 38.000 troops, 420 guns, 204 AFVs and 44 AC.

Units Destroyed
A motorcycle regiment shatters this turn.

Pools
Manpower : 29.087
Vehicle : 159.699
Armaments : 80.081
Hiwi : 71.800

Concern
We have lost all momentum, we are now moving at a very slow pace in most places. Not good as this allows the USSR to dig dig and then dig some more.







Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 71
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/3/2012 7:00:11 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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Your southern breakthrough seems fine but in the northern breakthrough do you have any armor or mobile divisions taking part in that attack?

What does your drive on Leningrad look like?


(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 72
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/3/2012 7:12:30 PM   
terje439


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812


1. Your southern breakthrough seems fine but in the northern breakthrough do you have any armor or mobile divisions taking part in that attack?

2. What does your drive on Leningrad look like?



1. Yup, both panzer and mechanized divisions in the northern attack as well.
2. Slow moving. The Fins are at the no attack line and cannot do anything more atm, the Germans are about 4 hexes away, but we are pushing the USSR away from all those pesky rivers up there.


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Tophat1812)
Post #: 73
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/3/2012 7:20:05 PM   
Blubel

 

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What are the loses looking like?

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 74
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/4/2012 10:04:44 AM   
terje439


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Turn 12

Overall
As expected the USSR manage to pull back in the north denying us from creating a pocket. South fo the Pripjet we manage to expand our bridgeheads across the Dnepr as well as make more of them. Around Leningrad movement is slow. This turn we only grab empty territory, no cities captured. We manage 91 attacks, scoring 22 held, 63 retreats, 6 routs and 1 shatter.

Losses
USSR : 92.000 troops, 1.460 guns, 768 AFVs and 131 AC.
Axis : 45.000 troops, 421 guns, 185 AFVs and 24 AC.

Pools
Manpower : 30.025
Vehicle : 161.645
Armaments : 70.923
Hiwi : 74.639

Concerns
I am not able to push those last few hexes when attempting to encircle enemy units, I need to aim smaller.
It also seems I am losing too much infantry...






Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 75
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/5/2012 1:38:55 PM   
terje439


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Joined: 3/28/2004
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Turn 13

Overall
Pushing wherever possible, and we make some progress, but movement is slow. We will try to make a pocket east of Kiev now, as there is a remote possibility of trapping some 20 USSR units, but it is probably a longshot. We make 45 attacks, scoring 1 scouted, 11 held, 29 retreats, 1 rout, 1 shatter and 2 surrender.

Losses
USSR: 57.000 troops, 952 guns, 143 AFVs, 129 AC.
Axis : 39.000 troops, 330 guns, 130 AFVs, 40 AC.
A 1 : 1 ratio in lost AFVs is not good for me, but that is what happens when a 10 CV unit is rebiffed by a 1 CV unit...

Cities Captured
We take Chernigov this turn.

Units destroyed
1 rifle division, 2 army artillery regiments and Moscow PM Rifle division all surrender to our troops.

Pools
Manpower : 30.733
Vehicle : 166.745
Armaments : 61.436
Hiwi : 76.935

Concern
Mud is coming on fast now.







Attachment (1)

< Message edited by terje439 -- 3/5/2012 1:39:23 PM >


_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 76
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/5/2012 2:56:36 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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Certainly looks like you have a golden opportunity to net a major group of soviet forces in a Kiev pocket.

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 77
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/5/2012 3:04:01 PM   
terje439


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812

Certainly looks like you have a golden opportunity to net a major group of soviet forces in a Kiev pocket.


There is IF my 10 : 1 attacks do not fail too miserably as they tend to do...


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Tophat1812)
Post #: 78
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/5/2012 6:07:24 PM   
randallw

 

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The neck on the northern pincer looks a little thin.

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RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/5/2012 10:17:11 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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Can we get a better pic of the two prongs of the projected pincer?

(in reply to randallw)
Post #: 80
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 2:15:27 PM   
terje439


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Joined: 3/28/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: randallw

The neck on the northern pincer looks a little thin.


Not that thin really as there are stacked units there, but as is the tale of the entire front, I could really use some more units


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to randallw)
Post #: 81
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 2:15:38 PM   
terje439


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812


Can we get a better pic of the two prongs of the projected pincer?


See below.


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Tophat1812)
Post #: 82
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 2:22:49 PM   
terje439


Posts: 6150
Joined: 3/28/2004
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Turn 14

Disclaimer
About a week ago, I "broke" my version of Gimp. Now I have messed up Paint somehow as well
"Unable to paste into paint" (something like that) is the message I get.

Overall
This turn we are more concerned about trying to keep pushing the USSR away from their rivers than we are at striking deep. The pincer movement east of Kiev is only partially successful (if even that) as the two arms are 9 hexes apart. We did however manage to cut the raillines into the forming pocket. The Question now is how many units will we manage to trap next turn.
We make a total of 81 attacks, scoring 3 scouted, 17 held, 50 retreat, 5 rout and 6 surrender.

Losses
USSR : 138.000 troops, 2.080 guns, 109 AFVs and 139 AC.
Axis : 50.000 troops, 612 guns, 132 AFVs and 34 AC.

Units Destroyed
6 rifle divisions surrendered to us this turn.

Pools
Manpower : 31.749
Vehicle : 166.308
Armaments : 61.380
Hiwi : 79.151

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 83
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 2:32:52 PM   
Tophat1812

 

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Sorry to hear about your MS paint issue. On the other hand its good to see those numbers of soviet losses rise to 3 times your losses. Keep that ratio up and you'll put the hurt on Big Red. Your armor losses are troubling,but its 41' and time to do some damage to the Red machine. Now that you have this pocket starting to form,start thinking about the next pocket you are going to make and do it before mud sets in.

How is that drive on Leningrad working out for you?

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 84
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 2:37:43 PM   
terje439


Posts: 6150
Joined: 3/28/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Tophat1812


Sorry to hear about your MS paint issue. On the other hand its good to see those numbers of soviet losses rise to 3 times your losses. Keep that ratio up and you'll put the hurt on Big Red. Your armor losses are troubling,but its 41' and time to do some damage to the Red machine. Now that you have this pocket starting to form,start thinking about the next pocket you are going to make and do it before mud sets in.

How is that drive on Leningrad working out for you?


The AFV losses this turn was expected as there is not much USSR armoured forces left, and mine had to push to try to keep pressure on the forming pocket.
Leningrad is still many turns away it seems, but things do improve as there are less and less rivers for the USSR to hide behind.


Terje

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to Tophat1812)
Post #: 85
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/6/2012 6:27:42 PM   
Balou


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quote:

I do not waste many AP's changing leaders during 41.

quote:

Your best leaders should be at Corp level during 41 not army

quote:

The Corp leader rolls are a huge. They effect allot of close battles.
copyright Pelton

Yess, and so do I. Gut feeling.

But, (and sorry for beeing late here and seemingly misusing this thread): from when on is Admin power of Army leaders really becoming equally/more important than key values of Corps leaders ?

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 86
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/7/2012 10:14:48 AM   
terje439


Posts: 6150
Joined: 3/28/2004
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Turn 15

Disclaimer
Seems I will have to reboot my PC to get paint working again.

Overall
The USSR sees the danger he is in, and counterattack/countermove (well, two attacks against my Rumanians holding my southern flank. Hmm why does keeping the Rumanians as flank guards make me uneasy? ). As a result we are unable to seal the pocket this turn, high hopes for the next turn though. The USSR launch two attacks, scoring 1 held and 1 retreat. We launch 89 attacks, scoring 20 held (this is really not good enough), 62 retreats, 6 routs and 1 shatter.

Losses
USSR : 76.000 troops, 1.306 guns, 112 AFVs, 191 AC.
Axis : 50.000 troops, 509 guns, 136 AFVs, 84 AC.

Units destroyed
2 PVO AA regiments, 1 army artillery regiment, 1 rifle division and Guards Leningrad PM Rifle Division all shatter when attacked by our valiant troops.

Cities Captured
The USSR abandon Kiev this turn. For 5 divisions however, it is too late as they are encircled just east of Kiev.

Pools
Manpower : 33.471
Vehicle : 166.812
Armaments : 54.797
Hiwi : 84.123

Concern
I would like to seal and destroy the "Kiev-pocket(ish)" before the mud arrives.

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 87
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/9/2012 11:01:03 AM   
terje439


Posts: 6150
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Turn 16

Overall
The first partisans arrive on the map, and the USSR manage to withdraw their forces out of the pocket. Once more we are a few hexes shy of an encirclement. And to make matters worse, our forces are in need of rest and resupply, and winter is coming. Things are not looking too good right now. We will have to straighten the front and find defensive positions where we can dig in. We will also need to get our panzer and mechanized troops away from the front and go all out in the 1942 campaign. At the moment I fear the USSR will take Berlin in this game. We make 75 attacks, scoring 1 scouted, 19 held, 47 retreats, 2 routs and 6 surrenders.

Losses
USSR : 124.000 troops, 1.655 guns, 227 AFVs, 129 AC.
Axis : 54.000 troops, 524 guns, 177 AFVs, 36 AC.

Units destroyed
7 rifle divisions, 1 PVO AA regiments and Moscow PM rifle division surrender to our infantry this turn.

Cities Captured
Our forces take Smolensk and Eastern Kiev.

Pools
Manpower : 33.653
Vehicle : 168.448
Armaments : 40.673
Hiwi : 85.318

Concerns
Winter is coming and we are not at all prepared for it.







Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"Hun skal torpederes!" - Birger Eriksen

("She is to be torpedoed!")

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 88
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/9/2012 12:17:14 PM   
Karri

 

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I'd say you are doing pretty bad. About 100-300km where Axis usually is...?

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 89
RE: Gnikam eht ni retsasid - Oloren USSR, Terje Axis, N... - 3/9/2012 12:59:27 PM   
Pelton

 

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Did you take Leningrad?

Things might look bad, but you can turn things around in 42 if you do not get wiped out during blizzard by a cav/mech crazy tactic.

I have seen a few AAR's where the German does badly during 41, but is able to really turn tables in 42.

It 100% depends on what the Russian does during blizzard, most russian blizzard's are really realy poor as few have figured out how to get around the logistics model other then a few.

Unless you friend has been talking to TDV I would expect the blizzard to be a cake walk and your forses should be very strong by summer. Go right for Moscow as its really not to hard to take during 42 and he will be forsed to defend it. This will give you allot of chances to pocket units of which he will be forsed to buy back.

Pull all your panzer units off line during the last turn of snow. Put mech units in citys close to front as you can use them as needed.

I personally pull 9 to 12 divisions from 18th army off line also, putting them close to front in citys.

Start pushing east during snow and clear spring turns. What your OOB look like.

Pelton

< Message edited by Pelton -- 3/9/2012 1:00:39 PM >


_____________________________

GHC
22 - 4 - 8

15 games ended in 41 (15-0-0)
7 games ended in 42 (5-0-2)
8 games ended in 43 (2-3-3)
4 games ended in 44 (0-1-3)


General Cheesefinder of WitW

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8DiSQ36zfWk

(in reply to Karri)
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