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So you can land anywhere now?

 
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So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 8:46:57 AM   
tk208

 

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Hey guys,

Just noticed my PBEM opponent has landed a force on a non base hex, is this a feature of the new patch? Planning defensive operations will certinly change if this is the case.

Cheers
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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 10:03:55 AM   
TheLoneGunman


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To my knowledge, it's always been possible.

A fairly popular HR limits landings to dot base hexes, so you may want to consider discussing adding this rule to your game with your opponent. If you guys choose not to add such a rule, remember that when you're on the offensive, that you'll have the same advantage.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 10:10:56 AM   
Roger Neilson II


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Indeed, there is a bit penalty to it though in that many landing spots are pretty inaccessible so once ashore you have a haul to move anywhere are supply. On the other hand its almost impossible to defend against.

Although it favours the japanese initially I do feel (as an unashamed Allied player) that i get the best out of being able to land anywhere once we are in 1943...... especially if the enemy has not got air superiority.

A governing factor on invasions of non island bases should be the logistical issues, so maybe another approach would be to limit the size of any landing on a non dot base?

Roger

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 11:00:33 AM   
tk208

 

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Hmm cant belive i never knew that and ive been playing for a while now..

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 11:07:49 AM   
Andrew Brown


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quote:

ORIGINAL: tk208

Hey guys,

Just noticed my PBEM opponent has landed a force on a non base hex, is this a feature of the new patch? Planning defensive operations will certinly change if this is the case.

Cheers


It's always been possible (just like in real life). However some terrain types may not be invaded, such as swamp hexes (unless a base is present, in that instance).

Andrew

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 11:19:03 AM   
gradenko_2000

 

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As said, it's always been possible to do this, but supply and amphibious losses from being unable to "prep" for the landing spot can serve as discouraging factors.

Most players abide by a House Rule to not land in hexes that are not bases and are not dot-bases.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 7:00:41 PM   
m10bob


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The hex just to the left of Port Moresby cannot be landed by amphibs due to cliffsides, in spite of the "clear-looking" terrain..(Don't worry, the CPU will tell you if the hex is inaccessable when you try to designate it as the landing area.)

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/13/2012 10:39:17 PM   
vettim89


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I think the point about AE's harsh rules about disruption on being "non-prepped" for a non-base hex plus the unloading problems at a non-port just about make this move something to be avoided. If you don't have a HR against it, it is fair play but it is not somethign I would do on a regular basis.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 5:50:19 AM   
Roger Neilson II


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It is perfectly possible to land on a non base hex that is not occupied by the enemy without any prep or disruption issues.... then march on the enemy in another hex when you are suitably undisrupted, and you may already be fully prepped for the target you march on.

If non base/dot hexes may be landed on then the defender really must have something there or in fast reaction mode to counter it.

Roger

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 6:29:33 AM   
LoBaron


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheLoneGunman

A fairly popular HR limits landings to dot base hexes


This. Used in close to every PBEM.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 1:44:25 PM   
witpqs


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I won't use such an HR as I don't see such landings as any kind of a problem. BTW, I have yet to make any such landings in PBM. The developers put in sufficient penalties, and it was done in real life. One place where I really expect an IJ opponent to use this is at Darwin, where there is great terrain to land nearby and avoid the harbor defense guns.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 3:05:09 PM   
jay102

 

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The problem is, only a couple of squads landed on non-base/dot hex would probably block the entire supply flow, and even the retreat route of a big army.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 3:14:55 PM   
Roger Neilson II


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Yes similar to the gamey tactics of dropping the odd paratrooper and his dog.... HR normally says you must drop a whole unit. In PBEM its so important to play someone who will not do silly things.

OTOH even a small unit that was operating guerilla style behind the lines and knocking off supply columns would be a pain. It forces you to pull troops back from the front to keep your lines open, which in reality si what was done. I 'think' the hex side control rules pretty much sort this as well in AE.

Roger

< Message edited by Roger Neilson II -- 2/14/2012 3:15:28 PM >


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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 3:18:23 PM   
crsutton


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quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

I won't use such an HR as I don't see such landings as any kind of a problem. BTW, I have yet to make any such landings in PBM. The developers put in sufficient penalties, and it was done in real life. One place where I really expect an IJ opponent to use this is at Darwin, where there is great terrain to land nearby and avoid the harbor defense guns.



The issue is that in real life there were very few suitable spots for large scale landing operations-espcially in 42/43 before the Allies had enough specialty craft. And anytime for Japan who never had any mobile transport to speak of and would have a difficult time with supply supporting troops away from any beach head without taking a suitable port very fast. The dot hex limit is not perfect in that there are many bases that were also not suitable for invasions at all but it at least provides a reasonable limit to the locations that can be invaded. To be able to invade any coastal land hex would actually take the game even further from reality than it already is and I can't see a reason for that.

To think that Japan could actually seize a beach 100 miles from Darwin and then support an invasion force attacking Darwin without a port or transport is not realistic. It is bad enough that they can take Windham and then support an attack on Darwin over 400 miles of dirt track. But at least they control a port in that scenario.

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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/14/2012 3:44:07 PM   
Roger Neilson II


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I don't disagree with you. I have two PBEMs one where landings anywhere were allowed and one where they are not. Its entirely a matter of discussion between the partners I'd say.

The issue of supply over much of the coastline is a very real one, as is the Wyndham issue, as is the gas stations on every corner of the chinese motorway system.......

There are issues that need thinking through if the game is to play as any form of historical semblance.

As always its down to the preference of the players - and the importance of either ironing it all out in advance or having sensible discussions during the game.

Roger



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RE: So you can land anywhere now? - 2/15/2012 8:34:23 PM   
AirGriff


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I played a PBEM a long time ago where there were no HR's on this, and my opponent made full use of it. It was pretty tough to defend against in WitP since there were fewer small units to spread around, and even now it would be tough if no limits were placed. I'd say the max no-dot invaision force shouldn't be more than a battalion, or maybe a regiment. Otherwise, I think we should be able to break divisions into company sized pieces to spread around, and that's not likely to happen.

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