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Pionier or regular infatnry

 
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Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/9/2011 8:07:36 PM   
parusski


Posts: 4468
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
Status: offline 		I know there are statistics provided in game and I can read them. I want to know if you prefer Wehrmacht infantry, Grenadiers or Pioniers, and WHY?

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman
Post #: 1
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/9/2011 8:27:03 PM   
J P Falcon

 

Posts: 2225
Joined: 11/1/2003
Status: offline 		Pioneers do a better job when attacking cities so that's good enough for me...I keep a couple of bridging units on hand as well....

(in reply to parusski)
Post #: 2
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/9/2011 9:44:03 PM   
James Ward

 

Posts: 990
Joined: 5/9/2000
From: Baltimore, Maryland, USA
Status: offline 		I had a regular infantry with a +2 movement hero. Man did they fly around the map!

(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 3
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/9/2011 11:32:57 PM   
terje439


Posts: 5333
Joined: 3/28/2004
Status: offline 		Pioneers any day. In fact my only inf units are Pioneers and Paratroopers.

Terje

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Post #: 4
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/9/2011 11:44:50 PM   
J P Falcon

 

Posts: 2225
Joined: 11/1/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439

Pioneers any day. In fact my only inf units are Pioneers and Paratroopers.

Terje


I must admit I have not devoted any Paratroopers to my core but I'll look into that possibility when I do a replay and see what new strategic fun I can have!

(in reply to terje439)
Post #: 5
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 1:39:19 AM   
Misconduct


Posts: 1777
Joined: 2/18/2009
From: Cape Canaveral, Florida
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: J P Falcon


quote:

ORIGINAL: terje439

Pioneers any day. In fact my only inf units are Pioneers and Paratroopers.

Terje


I must admit I have not devoted any Paratroopers to my core but I'll look into that possibility when I do a replay and see what new strategic fun I can have!


Early in the campaign Paratroopers are great for taking middle position airfields, however later in the Campaigns they can get overrun easily, so be wise with them


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(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 6
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 3:25:45 AM   
parusski


Posts: 4468
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: J P Falcon

Pioneers do a better job when attacking cities so that's good enough for me...I keep a couple of bridging units on hand as well....


I keep several, actually I end up with mostly Pionier's.

James Ward, I love those hero's, they not only fly but they kick ass.

Thanks for everyone's opinion.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 7
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 3:40:56 AM   
J P Falcon

 

Posts: 2225
Joined: 11/1/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: parusski


quote:

ORIGINAL: J P Falcon

Pioneers do a better job when attacking cities so that's good enough for me...I keep a couple of bridging units on hand as well....


I keep several, actually I end up with mostly Pionier's.

James Ward, I love those hero's, they not only fly but they kick ass.

Thanks for everyone's opinion.



It would be a great if there was an obit page for those hero's that are KIA. I lost a couple at Stalingrad and it would be a nice touch to review their achievments.

< Message edited by J P Falcon -- 9/10/2011 4:20:05 AM >

(in reply to parusski)
Post #: 8
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 9:05:57 AM   
Rood


Posts: 67
Joined: 7/16/2011
Status: offline 		Pioneer units all the way, in one campaign I also had a few paratroops but I ended up using them as regular infantry in the end.
Pioneer with movement bonus really is god mode.

(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 9
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 10:16:01 AM   
terje439


Posts: 5333
Joined: 3/28/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Misconduct
Early in the campaign Paratroopers are great for taking middle position airfields, however later in the Campaigns they can get overrun easily, so be wise with them



They are even better for taking the rear area victory cities.
The scenarios I find the Paratroopers of most value are;
-Norway
-Low Countries
-France
-Any scenario in the USSR except Kursk

I have never had issues with the defense values of my paratroopers unless I drop them in the middle of some KV2s. Against most rear area units they will hold their own easily.

The scenarios where you are on the defence however they are not that valuable (exception Scicily/Italy where I send them to take the bases in Africa and then send them into the eastern part of Scicily), but this is mainly due to the imo design flaw that they cannot be set up as ground units.


Terje

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Trying for Lebensraum in WitE
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(in reply to Misconduct)
Post #: 10
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/10/2011 12:13:28 PM   
parusski


Posts: 4468
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
Status: offline 		J P Falcon having an obit page is a grand idea. I would love to see that.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 11
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/12/2011 9:58:55 PM   
VR_IronFist


Posts: 153
Joined: 8/14/2011
Status: offline 		Always a fun topic. Here was my response to the same question on the Slitherine forums. My opinion hasn't changed as 1943 Grenadiers have won me many a multiplayer game with their ability to handle tanks from the proper terrain.

quote:

Interesting debate. Personally, I prefer a core of Grenadiers as my main Infantry force (I usually upgrade all my Wehrmacht Infantry to Grenadiers for 40 prestige ASAP) with some Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers as specialty support. Since what I really want are Panzergrenadiers, I will outfit them with sdkfz 250/251 as quickly as I can. That somewhat mitigates their 2 speed although initially prestige heavy. However I find it balances out over the course of a campaign and I love their hard-hitting ability against Hard targets.

I really like to vet my Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers the quickest so they become nasty, then I over-strength them each scenario to do the dirty work. They lack somewhat against Hard targets but I try to play the Campaign and Scenarios as historical as I can. Fallschirmjägers do get the "fortkiller" trait so they can somewhat sub for Pionieres (although I use them too, just not en masse like others). It's just historically, they were elite troops of the Wehrmacht.

(in reply to parusski)
Post #: 12
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/13/2011 3:39:24 AM   
parusski


Posts: 4468
Joined: 5/8/2000
From: Wyoming, Even Liberals Welcome
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: VR_IronFist

Always a fun topic. Here was my response to the same question on the Slitherine forums. My opinion hasn't changed as 1943 Grenadiers have won me many a multiplayer game with their ability to handle tanks from the proper terrain.

quote:

Interesting debate. Personally, I prefer a core of Grenadiers as my main Infantry force (I usually upgrade all my Wehrmacht Infantry to Grenadiers for 40 prestige ASAP) with some Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers as specialty support. Since what I really want are Panzergrenadiers, I will outfit them with sdkfz 250/251 as quickly as I can. That somewhat mitigates their 2 speed although initially prestige heavy. However I find it balances out over the course of a campaign and I love their hard-hitting ability against Hard targets.

I really like to vet my Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers the quickest so they become nasty, then I over-strength them each scenario to do the dirty work. They lack somewhat against Hard targets but I try to play the Campaign and Scenarios as historical as I can. Fallschirmjägers do get the "fortkiller" trait so they can somewhat sub for Pionieres (although I use them too, just not en masse like others). It's just historically, they were elite troops of the Wehrmacht.



That is a very intriguing concept. Your well written response has convinced me to try things your way.

_____________________________

"I hate newspapermen. They come into camp and pick up their camp rumors and print them as facts. I regard them as spies, which, in truth, they are. If I killed them all there would be news from Hell before breakfast."- W.T. Sherman

(in reply to VR_IronFist)
Post #: 13
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/13/2011 4:17:21 AM   
J P Falcon

 

Posts: 2225
Joined: 11/1/2003
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: parusski


quote:

ORIGINAL: VR_IronFist

Always a fun topic. Here was my response to the same question on the Slitherine forums. My opinion hasn't changed as 1943 Grenadiers have won me many a multiplayer game with their ability to handle tanks from the proper terrain.

quote:

Interesting debate. Personally, I prefer a core of Grenadiers as my main Infantry force (I usually upgrade all my Wehrmacht Infantry to Grenadiers for 40 prestige ASAP) with some Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers as specialty support. Since what I really want are Panzergrenadiers, I will outfit them with sdkfz 250/251 as quickly as I can. That somewhat mitigates their 2 speed although initially prestige heavy. However I find it balances out over the course of a campaign and I love their hard-hitting ability against Hard targets.

I really like to vet my Fallschirmjägers and Gebirgsjägers the quickest so they become nasty, then I over-strength them each scenario to do the dirty work. They lack somewhat against Hard targets but I try to play the Campaign and Scenarios as historical as I can. Fallschirmjägers do get the "fortkiller" trait so they can somewhat sub for Pionieres (although I use them too, just not en masse like others). It's just historically, they were elite troops of the Wehrmacht.



That is a very intriguing concept. Your well written response has convinced me to try things your way.


I second this, and if most of my core survive Kursk, I'll reduce my Pioneer Corps and replace them with Grenadiers.

(in reply to parusski)
Post #: 14
RE: Pionier or regular infatnry - 9/13/2011 11:16:23 PM   
VR_IronFist


Posts: 153
Joined: 8/14/2011
Status: offline 		Gentlemen, let me know how it goes. I do use Pionieres, but they are a specialty unit in my army.

I've won more than a few games on Brocage Breakout (my second favorite multiplayer map behind Hylan Valley) using Grenadiers. The 1943 version with a 7 Soft Attack and 8 Hard Attack does pretty well against US armor from the Brocage.

(in reply to J P Falcon)
Post #: 15
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