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AI Evacuation

 
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AI Evacuation - 9/3/2011 9:48:41 PM   
Marquo


Posts: 1095
Joined: 9/26/2000
Status: offline 		Turn 6 I am 1 hex away from the RR leading from Leningrad - and on turn 7 every armament/industry/vehicle/tank/everything that can be moved is moved - but there is no possible way for there to be enough RR points to move it all in one turn. How much of a "cheat" does the AI get when moving production?

Thanks.

Maruqo
Post #: 1
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/3/2011 9:52:24 PM   
Farfarer

 

Posts: 661
Joined: 7/21/2004
Status: offline 		100 percent of whatever is required, even if surrounded. AFAIK against the AI you get the industry by actually taking the hex, or never.

(in reply to Marquo)
Post #: 2
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/4/2011 1:21:15 PM   
rotfront

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 4/11/2011
Status: offline 		I guess capping the rail link will prevent evacuation, at least in my present game I trapped the factories in Leningrad...

but generally, the AI evac rules are retarded. They lead to an unrealistic style of play because industry can only be destroyed by making huge leaps (because of 10 hex rule). Steady quick advance will not destroy factories. A major rule and AI change is really called for here...

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Reminder: The novice studies tactics, the master studies logistics.

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Post #: 3
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/4/2011 1:28:29 PM   
gradenko_2000

 

Posts: 569
Joined: 12/27/2010
Status: offline 		What's the 10 hex rule?

(in reply to rotfront)
Post #: 4
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/4/2011 6:37:15 PM   
rotfront

 

Posts: 18
Joined: 4/11/2011
Status: offline 		If you finish a turn closer than 10 hexes to an factory location, that factory will be gone in the next turn.
I think it is 10 hexes (roughly), please correct me if I am wrong.

the AI has no rail cap limit, but only rolls out the factory that are threatened (10hex rule), so you can easily game the system and destroy a lot of IC if you leap forwards with your fuelled up panzers, in one single turn.


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Reminder: The novice studies tactics, the master studies logistics.

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Post #: 5
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/4/2011 7:24:29 PM   
JocMeister

 

Posts: 1789
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		That explains alot... Why doesn´t the AI have any rail cap? 

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Post #: 6
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/10/2011 12:33:37 PM   
DTurtle

 

Posts: 169
Joined: 4/26/2010
From: Mannheim, Germany
Status: offline 		This is the first I've heard of that rule.

Where is it stated? Because I know of at least one AAR, where the AI has not evacuated factories despite only being slowly surrounded in Kharkov and Leningrad.

(in reply to JocMeister)
Post #: 7
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/10/2011 10:06:56 PM   
Cannonfodder


Posts: 1325
Joined: 10/22/2008
Status: online 		Guys, the AI needs help.. give it a break

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Post #: 8
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/11/2011 9:16:18 PM   
Valgua


Posts: 218
Joined: 11/10/2006
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cannonfodder

Guys, the AI needs help.. give it a break


Agreed, but is it fun to play against the AI when it is impossible to execute a plan because of "super-powers"? I do not own the game and the rumors I keep hearing about the AI teleporting units are keeping me from buying it. It is a pity. I would love a monster game on the Eastern Front, but I don't have the possibility to PBEM. I need a working AI. I hope that the problems will be solved with patches.

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Post #: 9
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/11/2011 10:59:12 PM   
EisenHammer


Posts: 401
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline 		As far as I can tell the AI is working great. It makes a few mistakes here and there like leaving an city wide open one time. Besides that, the AI good. I haven't experience the AI teleporting units.

(in reply to Valgua)
Post #: 10
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/11/2011 11:20:47 PM   
Valgua


Posts: 218
Joined: 11/10/2006
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline 		Really? From this thread and others I got the feeling that the AI was pretty lame anche prone to cheating. Is your experience different?

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Post #: 11
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/12/2011 12:12:28 AM   
EisenHammer


Posts: 401
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline 		no doubt the AI could use some improvements.
And I'll rather have a challenging AI that's cheats than an AI that's a total push over.
But like I said I had not experience AI teleporting units, it could be I just don't realize it happening FOW.

(in reply to Valgua)
Post #: 12
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/12/2011 2:19:41 AM   
Wild


Posts: 306
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline 		I am an AI only player who has played war games for 25 years. I can in all honesty say that the AI for WITE is the best i have played.

Does it have a few cheats. Yes. But far fewer than other war games i have played. Also, let's face it no AI can play like a human and it needs a little help.

As far as teleporting units. This has been greatly overstated in my opinion.


(in reply to Valgua)
Post #: 13
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/12/2011 9:25:54 AM   
Valgua


Posts: 218
Joined: 11/10/2006
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wild

I am an AI only player who has played war games for 25 years. I can in all honesty say that the AI for WITE is the best i have played.

Does it have a few cheats. Yes. But far fewer than other war games i have played. Also, let's face it no AI can play like a human and it needs a little help.

As far as teleporting units. This has been greatly overstated in my opinion.




Thanks for your comments! I am deciding if this game could be a good time (and money) investment and every input is useful.

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Post #: 14
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/19/2011 7:34:54 AM   
Valgua


Posts: 218
Joined: 11/10/2006
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline 		I ended up buying the game. It's too tempting too resist. I will dive in it as soon as I have a moment. I just hope that the developers will continue to support those who play mainly against the AI. I think we are a silent majority.
If indeed the Soviets can evacuate a surrounded city... well... that's not cool. I understand that the AI needs some advantages, but IMHO this is simply too much.



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Post #: 15
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/19/2011 12:28:11 PM   
lastdingo

 

Posts: 110
Joined: 7/31/2006
Status: offline 		That's correct.

In case of Kharkov it takes an accumulation of fast divisions at 11 hexes distance (=behind a river)
PLUS
accumulation of bombers in the region
PLUS
good recce of the region so your divisions don't bump into obstacles.


Then you bomb the **** out of Kharkov divisions once, move your divisions into neighbouring hexes of Kharkov with enough MP left for a deliberate attack (difficult!), set bomber readiness requirement to zero and ground attack setting to 300/300, and do the final assault against Kharkov.
It would help to saves and do several attempts till it works. Hey, the AI cheats as well!



By the way, the 10 hexes rule is historically inaccurate. Leningrad had still a tank production while besieged in much less distance!

(in reply to Farfarer)
Post #: 16
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/19/2011 5:40:02 PM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 18456
Joined: 9/20/2000
From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: offline 		This is what I got from Gary re the AI and factory evacuation.

1) The AI will evacuate factories if an enemy unit gets within 10 hexes and it determines that there is an unfavorable force ratio in the area.
2) It will only evacuate if the city is linked to the supply grid (not isolated), and it should not evacuate if there is an enemy unit next to the city.
3) It may exceed the rail capacity with one evacuation move, but should not start an evacuation of a factory if it's rail points are at 0 (so there is the potential of a small cheat here).

If you are seeing some behavior that doesn't match this, please send us a pre-save (just before the Soviet logistics phase where they do an evacuation against the rules). Send to 2by3@2by3games.com or post it as a bug in the tech support area and attach the save to the bug report post. Thanks.

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All understanding comes after the fact.
-- Soren Kierkegaard

(in reply to lastdingo)
Post #: 17
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/20/2011 3:03:56 AM   
Wild


Posts: 306
Joined: 12/10/2007
Status: offline 		Thanks Joel. This is good to know.

(in reply to Joel Billings)
Post #: 18
RE: AI Evacuation - 9/20/2011 12:27:54 PM   
Valgua


Posts: 218
Joined: 11/10/2006
From: Uppsala, Sweden
Status: offline 		Thank Joel! Great game btw. I started playing Barbarossa as Axis yesterday. Wonderful!

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(in reply to Joel Billings)
Post #: 19
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