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Isolated Unit CV

 
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Isolated Unit CV - 8/18/2011 8:30:49 PM   
Shupov


Posts: 183
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		Why does a unit's CV drop immediately and drastically when it becomes isolated? The unit can still have high levels of supply, fuel and ammunition but its CV can drop as much as 90%.

Section 15.2.1 says "Isolated units suffer a supply related CV penalty that is equal to the percentage of needed supplies (or fuel for motorized units) times the percentage of needed ammo. In addition, when calculating the modified CV ratio to determine whether a defender will be required to retreat, isolated defending units may have their CV divided by ten if they fail certain checks."

Does this mean an isolated unit's attack value doesn't get divided by ten? For example, if a motorized unit's CV is 10 and it has 80% fuel and 50% ammo when it gets isolated, is its attack value modified to 10 x 0.80 x 0.50 = 4.0?

In any case, the displayed CV appears to be modified by a factor of ten. Are the attacking and defending CV's different for isolated units? If they are, which CV is displayed?



_____________________________

Two broken Tigers on fire in the night,
Flicker their souls to the wind...

Al Stewart, "Roads to Moscow"
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RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/18/2011 8:47:00 PM   
Gargoil

 

Posts: 322
Joined: 1/6/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Shupov

Why does a unit's CV drop immediately and drastically when it becomes isolated? The unit can still have high levels of supply, fuel and ammunition but its CV can drop as much as 90%.

Section 15.2.1 says "Isolated units suffer a supply related CV penalty that is equal to the percentage of needed supplies (or fuel for motorized units) times the percentage of needed ammo. In addition, when calculating the modified CV ratio to determine whether a defender will be required to retreat, isolated defending units may have their CV divided by ten if they fail certain checks."

Does this mean an isolated unit's attack value doesn't get divided by ten? For example, if a motorized unit's CV is 10 and it has 80% fuel and 50% ammo when it gets isolated, is its attack value modified to 10 x 0.80 x 0.50 = 4.0?

In any case, the displayed CV appears to be modified by a factor of ten. Are the attacking and defending CV's different for isolated units? If they are, which CV is displayed?




Default is CV-Move, but in preferences, you can change it to Combat. This then displays a separate Attack and Defense CV. You will see units with CV value that are like "1=9". Not sure how this all works myself.

(in reply to Shupov)
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RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/18/2011 9:14:30 PM   
Shupov


Posts: 183
Joined: 2/7/2004
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quote:

Default is CV-Move, but in preferences, you can change it to Combat. This then displays a separate Attack and Defense CV. You will see units with CV value that are like "1=9". Not sure how this all works myself.


Yes, I understand the CV value is displayed as X=Y, where Y takes into account terrain and fortification modifiers. It seems to me the "X" value is always divided by 10 for isolated units.

_____________________________

Two broken Tigers on fire in the night,
Flicker their souls to the wind...

Al Stewart, "Roads to Moscow"

(in reply to Gargoil)
Post #: 3
RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/19/2011 11:35:46 AM   
Jakerson

 

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Joined: 8/15/2006
Status: offline 		Number that can drop 90% is offensive CV. Defensive CV dont drop that much from Isolation. Pressing Z key you can switch view and see defencive CV's.

CV dont drops instantly defender always have one turn trying to open gap for pocket or other some way to supply pocket if it works CV instantly get better.

Attacker cannot start exploiting isolation same turn they make pocket they always have to wait next turn. From attacker point of view it is one week out of supply until they can exploit isolated troops.



(in reply to Shupov)
Post #: 4
RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/19/2011 5:25:30 PM   
LiquidSky


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Joined: 6/24/2008
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Except that if you can reach 2:1 odds on the isolated unit, it will surrender. Makes that defensive CV look pretty small.

_____________________________

To the right General Patton, to the left the British Army, to the rear our own artillery, and besides all that its raining. And the only good thing to say about the weather: it keeps our air corps from blowing us all to Hell because its too lousy to fly.

(in reply to Jakerson)
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RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/19/2011 6:50:13 PM   
Joel Billings


Posts: 18456
Joined: 9/20/2000
From: Santa Rosa, CA
Status: offline 		Design decision. Units cut off for a full week were in trouble if they were not getting resupplied by air or could relink up with friendly forces. In the test version of 1.05 we are testing a new rule that allows units that get an adequate amount of air resupply to be considered in beachhead/airhead supply, which does not reduce CVs by anywhere near as much as when a unit is isolated. In fact Pavel and I are testing Trey's Red Army Resurgent scenario (operations in the AG A and AG B areas from Nov42-Mar43). The PBEM game has allowed us to find several problems and fine tune the new rules (and it's fun too).

_____________________________

All understanding comes after the fact.
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(in reply to LiquidSky)
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RE: Isolated Unit CV - 8/19/2011 9:03:05 PM   
Shupov


Posts: 183
Joined: 2/7/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Joel Billings

Design decision. Units cut off for a full week were in trouble if they were not getting resupplied by air or could relink up with friendly forces. In the test version of 1.05 we are testing a new rule that allows units that get an adequate amount of air resupply to be considered in beachhead/airhead supply, which does not reduce CVs by anywhere near as much as when a unit is isolated. In fact Pavel and I are testing Trey's Red Army Resurgent scenario (operations in the AG A and AG B areas from Nov42-Mar43). The PBEM game has allowed us to find several problems and fine tune the new rules (and it's fun too).


That sounds more realistic Joel. Units were often cut off when overextended but able to fight their way out on their own.

_____________________________

Two broken Tigers on fire in the night,
Flicker their souls to the wind...

Al Stewart, "Roads to Moscow"

(in reply to Joel Billings)
Post #: 7
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