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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour

 
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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/17/2011 1:23:54 PM   
zuluhour


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Fish Hook: Due to the lengthy time to get prepped for phase II rear area depots are preparing:




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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/18/2011 4:12:46 AM   
zuluhour


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The worst day of the air war yet as the Dutch LBs suffer complete devastation against the mini Kido Butai off Java. Utter demoralization at HQ.




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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/18/2011 4:13:34 AM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/18/2011 4:16:46 AM   
zuluhour


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Oh yeah, and the Japs get Rabaul.

< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/18/2011 9:51:20 PM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/18/2011 3:44:11 PM   
DOCUP


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Keep the faith brother.  The tides will turn. 

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/18/2011 9:47:15 PM   
zuluhour


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I believe Rangoon is facing a two division re-inforced assault. The next turn shall tell much there. The squadrons have been withdrawn to the interior. A SCTF is off the coast but very vulnerable and will withdraw or bombard depending on the next turn resolution. It looks like Sumatra or Java now.




Back in the PI "Dug out" Doug still holds though fatigue is becoming a factor. Supplies there are above 16000 so I hope they can hold on for a few more weeks. Bataan: 742AV 3-forts.

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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/18/2011 9:50:46 PM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/19/2011 1:31:14 AM   
DOCUP


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Rangoon, did he walk troops there?  What troops do you have at Palemburg?  444 AV is alot.  You got some decent AV in places, but remember its prob low morale, exp and the like.

doc 

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/20/2011 1:52:20 AM   
zuluhour


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Yep, He just traipsed through the jungle, snuck accross the river upstream (sneaky Jap) from Pegu. At least the 33rd Div and some armor (but I suspect another Div as well) are at Pegu now. Palembang was re-inforced by the two Indian Brigades from the Malayan army diverted early (heavy PPs to). I am about to really FU to as they are both attacking out of Palembang to get at the disrupted Div I believe is accross the river. They will do a deliberate attack and fall back if all goes well and buy me another week in Burma. I have reviewed all commanders in theater, but not much I can do with the Indians.. OOpps wrong Indians. I am at a PP crisis though as I have an Aussie Div and more Indians which require political clout to move any further.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/22/2011 2:20:42 PM   
zuluhour


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Things getting tense in Sumatra. Japs are in the streets of Rangoon.




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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/22/2011 2:21:05 PM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/22/2011 11:15:48 PM   
zuluhour


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The strategic situation we hope to be in to turn the tide.




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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/22/2011 11:16:09 PM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 3:06:27 AM   
DOCUP


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Zulu I see your MLR in India. It looks a lil high, are you building up the bases along the border that are in jungle hexs or the open terrain hexs? Nice detailed pics I really like those. If your saying the white and green lines are your CV patrol areas. Then I think your risking your carriers early. Just my thoughts. Its your game don't mean to offend. I do listen to your advise on my thread and will always consider it.

doc

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:27:27 PM   
zuluhour


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Your advice, thoughts and humor will always be welcome here. Now as far as risk, see below.....

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:28:08 PM   
zuluhour


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February 17th 1941
Zulu HQ: under radio silence
CnCPac: Nimitz: Under orders from Admiral King, Admiral Nimitz sees the first opportunity for a raid against occupied Japanese territory. The carriers Enterprise, Lexington and Yorktown are 40-60nm south of the Santa Cruz Islands and believe they are unspotted. The successful B17 raid from Port Moresby yesterday revealed significant runway damage as well as ships at anchor at Rabaul. The plan is for another B17 raid on the 18th to be followed by an am strike by the carriers on the 19th. The objective is to cause enough damage to aircraft and facilities to force Japan into re-enforcement Ops as opposed to expansion Ops in theater for the near future. The raid is to rally the American people and pacify the journalists in Hawaii per Admiral King’s directives.





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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:30:20 PM   
zuluhour


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I am pondering the risk reward here as well as the correct co-ordination of the strike planes. If your going to chime in, now would be the time.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:31:35 PM   
DOCUP


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Thanks Zulu. It is early in the war. Do you know where the KB is? A good raid here might sting your opponent. Make him do something rash. What does he have at Rabaul? Also are you trying to build up Miline Bay or just leave it.

doc

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:31:59 PM   
zuluhour


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Ill do a better portrait of India shortly. The big map is pretty rough. I need something better than paint and cheaper than photo shop.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 8:45:37 PM   
DOCUP


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Ok I missed the map. Do you know where KB is? If you know that its not close within 2 days. Then risk should be minimal. Watch for Betties from Turk. Your launch point is close to the the Bettys range but not sure. Benefit you can get 2 CAs some DDs and APs. He dosen't get many CA's and DD's. Have a small (one DB squadron)go after the DDs. The rest divided between port and AF. Coordination sucks early war for the Allies in my exp. IMHO if the KB isn't close go for it. It will teach him a lesson. I think your set up pretty good for a victory, but watchout for the KB.

doc

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 10:37:58 PM   
zuluhour


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The Kido Butai departed to the northwest about a week ago. I got no reports from sub division I or II (over a dozen subs between Rabaul and Truk) that it retired to Truk. I believe it to be in Japan or enroute to the DEI to support the mini KB. I just don't see anywhere or reason to lurk within range to the northwest. I accept full responsibilty should it appear right after the raid. (who else could I blame. lol) I do have Cats searching from Horn Isl, PM, Gardner, and the little Isle at the end of the chain from Russell Isle southeast. (I don't have the map now). WE go for it. Raid on. I will display the co-ordination and disposition of the raider ac before the strike. The TF is moving up the Solomons and the turn rests with Japan.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 10:55:57 PM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zuluhour

The Kido Butai departed to the northwest about a week ago. I got no reports from sub division I or II (over a dozen subs between Rabaul and Truk) that it retired to Truk. I believe it to be in Japan or enroute to the DEI to support the mini KB. I just don't see anywhere or reason to lurk within range to the northwest. I accept full responsibilty should it appear right after the raid. (who else could I blame. lol) I do have Cats searching from Horn Isl, PM, Gardner, and the little Isle at the end of the chain from Russell Isle southeast. (I don't have the map now). WE go for it. Raid on. I will display the co-ordination and disposition of the raider ac before the strike. The TF is moving up the Solomons and the turn rests with Japan.


As Sir Humphrey Appleby would say, that would be a courageous decision, Minister, to so rely upon an early warning from search aircraft.

Courageous because:


  • at this early stage of the war, your naval search pilots' skill level is probably low
  • searching beyond a 12 hex range is very unproductive
  • the KB can loiter just outside of your effective search range and using Warp Factor speed (aka maximum speed) can move in and strike without being spotted en route


Which is not to say you should abandon the raid. Rather that if you go ahead with it, you should have Plan B ready in the event the KB drops in unexpectedly.

Alfred

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/23/2011 11:12:04 PM   
zuluhour


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first: i am honored by your appearence here. Secondly, should you have a plan B I am all ears. My only thoughts on a plan B are to be sure I am unspotted (as can be) in the approach area, being so spotted in the assembly point I would hope I could escape before I commit to the raid. That said I have not mentioned that the TFs would not have the sufficient fuel to use full speed if retirement becomes prudent before the raid. The AOs are three days out in two directions. I am using narrow bands with multiple CAT Sqds for the searches. I hoped this would improve my chances of a sighting as well as taking advantage of their range. Its all a big experiment for me. The TFs will be in the assembly area when the turn is returned to me. I'll post the SitRep then.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/24/2011 12:57:08 AM   
Alfred

 

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Plan B, heh

1. Supporting the raid with a 4E attack out of Port Moresby is good. It will help to distract enemy CAP. However don't just limit yourself to flying on the 18th only. They should also go in on the 19th in support of the carriers.

2. Don't send in the TFs if they don't have full bunkers. Just in case the KB shows up, you will kick yourself if you can't high tail out of Dodge at flank speed.

3. Your plan to send in the carrier strike in the morning against the enemy airfield is OK if you know for certain that the KB will not appear. Otherwise you face risking a KB strik with no capacity of your own to retaliate. The safer course of action, one which incorporates a Plan B is to have your strike carrier aircraft tasked with "naval attack" as their primary mission and "airfield" attack only as a secondary mission. That way you;

(a) get a chance to sink any enemy ships loitoring in the vicinity of Rabaul, which in the long run will be of much more to you than destroying a few aircraft and damaging the runway which will quickly be repaired,

(b) minimise the chances that the KB will catch you with your pants down, aka your fighters will be less fatigued as a result of having escorted the bombers on an airfield attack in the morning,

(c) with the PM 4E having been given the airfield strike as their primary mission, they will go in first in the morning and help to fatigue/destroy the enemy CAP over Rabaul, thereby clearing the way for your afternoon carrier strike against Rabaul.

4. You plan to launch from the vicinity of Shortlands. It probably doesn't have an airfield present but that doesn't prevent you from flying in at the last moment a Kingfisher unit to provide some additional CAP over the carriers. All you would need is the presence of an AVD/AV or in their absence, some Aviation Support dropped off by Catalinas.

5. Shortlands would be too close to the enemy but you could preposition some tenders further back, say at Tulagi to give some triage to any cripples from a KB encounter. Even a nearby anchorage would suffice for triage.

6. Your idea of avoiding detection is good. Don't be afriad of aborting the mission if detected before launching. In that event you might want to move the carriers around to another location, albeit still under enemy surveillance, before retiring to safety. That way you help to "persuade" your opponent to engage in reinforcement rather than expansion operations in the near future, which is the raid's primary stated mission.

Alfred

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/24/2011 2:56:46 AM   
DOCUP


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Thanks Alfred, I will have to keep this in my memory banks for when it becomes my time to launch carrier strikes. One more thing that I just remembered maybe some picket ships. It might distract some naval strikes. But I am waiting for your results and for my turn. lol

doc

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/25/2011 3:47:15 AM   
zuluhour


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Bit of a delay here as I forgot to send Terry the turn attachment. DOH!

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/25/2011 11:09:44 AM   
koniu

 

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Hi to all



subscribed

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/26/2011 12:59:53 AM   
zuluhour


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Hello all, I may not have a carrier task force for awhile after this.
I tried hard to put my self in Admiral Nimitz's shoes this turn. First after reviewing the fuel situation with the carriers and it was not optimal, I decided to proceed with the raid. I believe I have enough in the bunkers to make the launch points off Torokina and get the strikes out and have enough for one day at flank speed, dropping several shorter legged DDs, and make Sydney. I set the Tfs at react 6, able to retire, with 40% cap react 6 with most of the DBs going after the port. I cant remember the exact breakdowns, I hit the end orders button before I was completly sure of this. Fingers crossed! I believe the pressure from Admiral King to strike back at the earliest possible moment coupled with Halsey's "lets go". would have him giving the thumbs up. The reporters are going to get a story. Because of the fuel factor I have taken an extra day to get into position. The orders are out.




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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/26/2011 1:00:31 AM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/26/2011 1:02:27 AM   
zuluhour


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The raid will be preceded by a night strike at Rabauls airfields with a depleted B17 raid. There was good news yesterday from the Dutch.




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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/26/2011 1:08:50 AM   
zuluhour


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Alfred, I am still "under the radar"; I hope. I am going in less prepared than I would have liked from your tips. Whether or not I survive this exchange I will have a better grasp of the tactics as this unfolds and I am already taking some notes in regards to your comments for a little "Sara" exploit. I should add the B17s took alot of damage from the raid yesterday in daylight (I hope I switched them to night for casulties sake, ) as I needed another day to get into position.

< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/26/2011 1:10:29 AM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/26/2011 3:59:17 AM   
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Good luck,  So where did you hit the Shoho at?

doc

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/27/2011 2:00:16 AM   
zuluhour


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Shoho caught the fish at the confluence of the Celebes Sea and the Makassar Starights. I noticed the IJN avoiding shallow water, probably due to some earlier success I've had there.

....................................Severe weather in target hex aborts all three carrier strike packages......................................

I am also spotted 1/1 DL and 2/2 DL for Lex and Enterprise. Orders out, all CVTFs in the Solomons to retire with haste to the southwest. I do not have enough fuel to run at flank so fingers are again crossed. If it was not for Alfred pointing out the fuel considerations I never would have made the proper calculations. Funny how weather was the final word. While tempted to persue the mission, sanity prevails. If I had run into the launch area at full steam I would now be facing a slow run to Townsville.

I will post the actual FLT in Burma/ India soon and look forward to your thoughts. I was quickly out flanked at Rangoon and do not want that again. Singapore, Bataan and Rangoon are all under siege with Palembang perhaps ten days away. The DEI fighters are exhausted. Will the withdrawn pilots ever see action again? In China the great start from Chang and Mao scoring back to back large ground victories is over. The IJA is presently bombing both parties into dust.

I should also point out looking at the plan B above I am not all that uphappy the launch was aborted. I think I now have a newb check list for future raids together. I'll publish over the weekend and look forward to comments. It is kind of strange all three aborted to me, seems like the dice keep coming up boxcars in the airwar for me. My leading pilot is no longer the China man in the bi plane but a KIA (4kills) American. ps the poor Chinese guy is MIA.

< Message edited by zuluhour -- 9/27/2011 2:39:59 AM >

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 9/29/2011 7:39:38 PM   
DOCUP


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Knock knock.  Anyone at Zulu HQ.

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RE: Thinz2 vs Zuluhour - 10/1/2011 4:34:38 AM   
zuluhour


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Hey DOCUP! Nice pics. I was to visit the USNA museum and visitors center (I love the place) last weekend but the rain just keeps coming. I like to ride two wheels on the weekend. I hav'ent had anything worthy to post as I abandoned my ill provisioned raid. I am trying to build up the Burm India line as you can see below. The Japs landed at Merak since I last posted. It could be that Bataan,Singapore,Palembang,Batavia and Rangoon will all be under siege within the week.




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< Message edited by zuluhour -- 10/1/2011 4:36:08 AM >

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