Matrix Games Forums

Join the Matrix Team at Historicon!Recruiting Privates for Germany at War: Barbarossa 1941!Ageod takes you back to the Civil War Battle Academy iPad and PC 50 per cent off!Close Combat Last Stand Arnhem v5.60.53 update Allied Corps Walkthrough playlist and AARConflict of Heroes: Ghost Divisions Released!Pandora Beta Playthrough VideosGermany at War: Barbarossa 1941 Announced!Great Battles Medieval coming to your tablet with a 50 per cent off launch sale!		 Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

RE: Pelton vs Kamil

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> After Action Reports >> RE: Pelton vs Kamil Page: <<   < prev  10 11 12 [13] 14   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/9/2012 5:05:25 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		161 OOB


From bad to worse. Once Soviets gather momentum, there is no way of stopping them.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 361
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/9/2012 5:07:39 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		161 morale


They know their trade now.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 362
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/9/2012 6:14:10 PM   
Flaviusx


Posts: 5761
Joined: 9/9/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Schmart


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pelton
The German army was at it pinnacle in 1943 not 1941 hehehe what are you smoking?

In 1941 the German army had some of the worst equipment in the world. The French,English and Russians had better Artillary, tanks, AC ect ect ect. The training of new replasements never changed until late 43.


The only thing being smoked, is reality. Morale-wise, the Germans were most assuredly at their pinnacle in 1941. It was downhill from there. Slowly at first, but as defeats added up, it accelerated. The influx of HIWIs and Ost Battalions and additional watering down of manpower began before late 1943.


Yes and no. The infantry peaked in 41 and declined thereafter. Arguably the mechanized forces got a second wind in 43 and in some respects may have reached their height in that year thanks to the Guderian reforms. Unfortunately, all that carefully husbanded reform and refitting got thrown away in Kursk.

_____________________________

WitE Alpha Tester

(in reply to Schmart)
Post #: 363
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/10/2012 2:33:01 AM   
Farfarer

 

Posts: 661
Joined: 7/21/2004
Status: offline 		Imagine what the Kwantung Army felt like when these guys and their leaders seasoned from 4 years war against the Wehrmacht sliced into Manchuria.

(in reply to Flaviusx)
Post #: 364
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/10/2012 2:48:14 AM   
TulliusDetritus

 

Posts: 3810
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: Back to Reality :(
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Farfarer

Imagine what the Kwantung Army felt like when these guys and their leaders seasoned from 4 years war against the Wehrmacht sliced into Manchuria.


It was rather quick (like modern days dentists) When I found this pic two months ago, I noticed I possibly was at the EXACT same place of these Red Army soldiers (but in 2009). The Songhua River in Harbin.

Yes, it has to be the same place. There were ships where you see the ones in the photo: to cross the river (which I did). In fact the ship which is closest to shore is strikingly familiar to the one I boarded! LOL




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by TulliusDetritus -- 2/10/2012 2:55:29 AM >

_____________________________



"Block is very important. If you think block is useless now it's ok. If you don't like block, why don't you take it with your face...?" -- Kung Fu master

(in reply to Farfarer)
Post #: 365
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/10/2012 2:58:42 AM   
Farfarer

 

Posts: 661
Joined: 7/21/2004
Status: offline 		Spector's book "In the ruins of empire" (i think) is fascinating. I had no idea that enormous japanese armies remained essentally in the employ f western powers for years and years after VJ day to keep order, or that Japan had spent so much to to modernize/colonize/annex Manchukuo ( which was promptly removed locust-mode by Stalin). Sorry thread hijack. Good AAR!

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 366
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/11/2012 3:09:04 AM   
M60A3TTS

 

Posts: 794
Joined: 5/13/2011
Status: online 		How many cav corps do you have? Seems like maybe more of them than tank corps.

(in reply to Farfarer)
Post #: 367
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/12/2012 12:21:56 AM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline
quote:

M60A3TTS

How many cav corps do you have? Seems like maybe more of them than tank corps.



23 cavalry, 3 mech and 31 tank

(in reply to M60A3TTS)
Post #: 368
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/12/2012 1:07:34 AM   
M60A3TTS

 

Posts: 794
Joined: 5/13/2011
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kamil

quote:

M60A3TTS

How many cav corps do you have? Seems like maybe more of them than tank corps.



23 cavalry, 3 mech and 31 tank


Interesting. I was thinking that you would be having a shortage of trucks with that many tank corps. But maybe you don't use many tank attachments or lost few truck factories in 1941

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 369
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/13/2012 12:20:12 AM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		162 Overview


Transitory turn.


Pelton is conserving his strength by withdrawing to next defensive line - river Wisla.

In the meantime Romanians change sides.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 370
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:30:51 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		Turn 163
320,000 armament pts in the pool
37,000 men in manpower pool

I think the manpower issue was fixed. I have been taking a beating and manpower pool is low with allot of armament pt's still in pool.

I have fallen back to the first river defence line. I held it for one turn woot!
The Northern part of line seems safe as I think the railheads are many miles to east, many Kamil can throw up a pic of it.




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 371
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:31:54 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		The center of line seems safe for a turn. The line is fairly solid behind line for a turn or 2 hopefully.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Pelton -- 2/14/2012 12:33:19 AM >

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 372
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:35:11 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		Center south. Kamil has most of his armor and best troops in this area. I am hoping to hold the general line for a turn and start withdrawing.




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 373
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:36:55 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		Far south I am in full run Forrest run mode! I have a line built in western Hungry behind a river I am falling back to.

next time around I will leave Romanian on its own once the writing is on the wall. I could be using these extra divisions to dig in a 2nd and 3rd row of forts in front and behind river.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Pelton -- 2/14/2012 12:41:49 AM >

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 374
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:37:59 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		Loses




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 375
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 12:38:45 AM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		OOB




Attachment (1)

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 376
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 2:28:44 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		163 overview


Thanks to shortening of the front, Pelton's defences are very strong. My first assault across river Wisla was unsuccessful. btw, I might be wrong, but defenders losses seems to be pretty high.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Kamil -- 2/14/2012 2:29:43 PM >

(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 377
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 2:32:23 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		163 elite strike force


It is second consecutive turn of rest for my armoured forces, so boys grow big and fat.

Below I present my elite formation, with proper leadership and within command limits of both army and front.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 378
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 5:03:12 PM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		LOl that just doesn't seem realistic at all. Attacking across a hvy defended river and the loses at 1=1.

I think that just might need to be addressed.

Lowering of the SHC manpower # is not going to fix anything when loses are so clearly out of wack.

The problem is not German retreat losses but Russian loses when they lose.

Pelton

_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 379
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/14/2012 5:47:58 PM   
Seminole


Posts: 491
Joined: 7/28/2011
Status: offline
quote:

The problem is not German retreat losses but Russian loses when they lose.


But look how many tubes he brought to that fight. He had one artillery piece for every 8 men you had!
Look at his command penalties, too. It seems like much of his force couldn't even find the fight.

There are SO many variables in each combat (and that is by design), it's really hard to draw conclusions from a few instances.

This should make you feel better:


(in reply to Pelton)
Post #: 380
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/16/2012 6:11:54 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		164 overview


I decided to exploit weakest part of Pelton's defences of river Wisla - east of Krakow. Out of two options I had, I think I have chosen wrong one. Instead of blowing up the hole in his defences and penetrating far and deep I settled for half-measure - gaining bridgehead, plus minor encirclement of 6 divisions.


I gained second crossing too. It is little bit to the north, near river Wieprz. I think, that one of the battles that taken place during these crossing involved most soldiers and guns I ever assembled for one attack.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Seminole)
Post #: 381
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/16/2012 6:23:56 PM   
Seminole


Posts: 491
Joined: 7/28/2011
Status: offline 		I guess nearly 9,000 artillery tubes led to disruption, eh?
Ever watch one of these monster fights with message level 7 just to see what it doing all the killing?

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 382
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/16/2012 10:44:26 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline
quote:

Seminole

Ever watch one of these monster fights with message level 7 just to see what it doing all the killing?



I tried once, but I could not endure it for more than 2 minutes. I got strange feeling, that I would turn 40 before combat would have ended.

(in reply to Seminole)
Post #: 383
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/18/2012 7:07:39 PM   
juret

 

Posts: 182
Joined: 10/17/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Seminole

quote:

The problem is not German retreat losses but Russian loses when they lose.


But look how many tubes he brought to that fight. He had one artillery piece for every 8 men you had!
Look at his command penalties, too. It seems like much of his force couldn't even find the fight.

There are SO many variables in each combat (and that is by design), it's really hard to draw conclusions from a few instances.

This should make you feel better:




attacking over fortified river costed 1:10 to 1:20 for attacker.
Just a few days for defenders to prepare make attacks very hard couse mashinegun nets dugin cower huge areas that u gotta cross somehow and preplanned arty on riverbanks makes it extremly hard operation.

(in reply to Seminole)
Post #: 384
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/18/2012 11:47:34 PM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		165 overview


Another boring report - Pelton is withdrawing and I am advancing. Prove below.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 385
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/19/2012 12:26:31 PM   
Pelton


Posts: 4379
Joined: 4/9/2006
Status: offline 		Not really anything the German can do once it becomes clear that you can't pocket units.

All things being equal, which they hardly ever are, the SHC player should easly beable to stop German attacks during the late summer of 1942. Once that happens because of the nerfed combat ratio loses even when the German player wins it is 100% hurting the German player to attack. So it becomes a boring steam roller west for 150ish odd turns.

You can't do anything specail to defend as German as you simply don't have enough units to do anything other then fight forward with a few mech units behind the front. Reserve statis can be used but one panzer division 20 cv's does nothing to up the odds of a fight thats got 150+ cv attacking. Again your really only hrting yourself. The Red Machine has stacks and stacks of 50-50 CV hexes of units with art.

The lowering of the manpower * really is not going to help at all in games where both players are equal as I am sure Kamil has millions and millions of men in his manpower pool as 8421 all rdy has in his with a 7+ million man army in 1942.

The center of the issue is far to low russian losses and far to high german losses for winning battles from 42 on.

I wish there was a button for switching from human to computer control of the game and not a auto win button.

Hoooper/Kamil and 8421 are all good Russian players. Not much you can do as German attacking in 42 as combat ratio is much much lower then historical in 1942. Its far to easy for Red Army to attack because the lose ratio is so low. Russian took massive loses attacking in 1942.

Lower german retreat loses is not a reflextion of history and does noting to address morale which is all that really matters.

The attrition ratio is not reflective of the 3 to1 ratio. Its about 2 to1 which is even less then what the Russians admitted to from 42 to 44.

Russian losses need to be put back where they were before 1v1=2v1 was removed.


_____________________________

GHC
15 - 3 - 7

10 games ended in 41 (10-0-0)
4 games ended in 42 (4-0-2)
3 games ended in 43 (1-2-3)
1 game ended in 44 (0-1-2)

On leave until 9/13

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 386
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/21/2012 12:13:29 AM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		166 overview


My infantry reached enemy lines, so I undertaken partially successful assault on Pelton's positions near Krakow - penetration in narrow and shallow so it will only lead to another withdrawal of enemy forces.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 387
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/21/2012 12:15:18 AM   
Kamil

 

Posts: 1591
Joined: 2/5/2011
Status: offline 		166 combat results spam


Results of majority of my deliberate attacks.




Attachment (1)

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 388
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/21/2012 12:32:50 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 568
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Production is the key to any game like this worth it's salt.  Let production dictate the game.  If the Germans significantly damage russian production, so be it and that it reflected in 42/43.  If they don't, then they suffer.  But any artifical combat affects should be removed.  Let the combat system dictate itself. 

(in reply to Kamil)
Post #: 389
RE: Pelton vs Kamil - 2/21/2012 12:34:10 AM   
vicberg

 

Posts: 568
Joined: 4/19/2008
Status: offline 		Pelton,

As a newbie German, what do you do with support units?  I need all the help I can get.  :)

(in reply to vicberg)
Post #: 390
Page:   <<   < prev  10 11 12 [13] 14   next >   >>
All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Gary Grigsby's War in the East Series >> After Action Reports >> RE: Pelton vs Kamil Page: <<   < prev  10 11 12 [13] 14   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.188