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Using Kamikazes

 
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Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 2:58:46 PM   
cap_and_gown


Posts: 2691
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From: Virginia, USA
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I have not used Kamikazes before so I have some questions about them:

When a Kamikaze unit makes an attack, does the unit then disappear? Or can I restock it with planes and pilots and keep on attacking as long as I have more planes and pilots? Do I need to set some level of "rest" so the unit does not entirely disappear?

Post #: 1
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 5:35:56 PM   
wild_Willie2


Posts: 2398
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Arnhem (holland) yes a bridge to far...
Status: offline
Hi.

Kami's work just like any other squadron that gets decimated in an attack (And I do not mean the literal 1/10 th death of an unit). You will simply have a zero plane squadron left, which can be restocked with fresh planes and pilots.

Good luck...

William

_____________________________

In vinum illic est sapientia , in matera illic est vires , in aqua illic es bacteria.

In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there are bacteria.

(in reply to cap_and_gown)
Post #: 2
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 6:21:40 PM   
PresterJohn


Posts: 360
Joined: 8/11/2009
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What skills do Kami's need? As in what improves their chance of hitting and is it worthwhile training them ... or just send em in from the repalcement pool. Lucky sods.

(in reply to wild_Willie2)
Post #: 3
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 6:22:51 PM   
PresterJohn


Posts: 360
Joined: 8/11/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: wild_Willie2

Hi.

Kami's work just like any other squadron that gets decimated in an attack (And I do not mean the literal 1/10 th death of an unit). You will simply have a zero plane squadron left, which can be restocked with fresh planes and pilots.

Good luck...

William


Showing some love for referencing the orgin of the word decimation...

(in reply to wild_Willie2)
Post #: 4
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 7:19:23 PM   
wild_Willie2


Posts: 2398
Joined: 10/8/2004
From: Arnhem (holland) yes a bridge to far...
Status: offline
Hi.

Well, the requirements for successful kami attacks vary according to who you ask.
Some forum members think that general EXP plus naval attack EXP are needed for a successful hit, while others go for general EXP plus LOW naval attack EXP for a successful hit....

Who knows ?

Gr.

William


_____________________________

In vinum illic est sapientia , in matera illic est vires , in aqua illic es bacteria.

In wine there is wisdom, in beer there is strength, in water there are bacteria.

(in reply to PresterJohn)
Post #: 5
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 7:28:35 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 15188
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cap_and_gown

I have not used Kamikazes before so I have some questions about them:

When a Kamikaze unit makes an attack, does the unit then disappear? Or can I restock it with planes and pilots and keep on attacking as long as I have more planes and pilots? Do I need to set some level of "rest" so the unit does not entirely disappear?


In your dreams, learned goose. Your squadrons shall be obliterated before they fly!

(in reply to cap_and_gown)
Post #: 6
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 8:06:51 PM   
Nemo121


Posts: 5808
Joined: 2/6/2004
Status: offline
Well kamis are quantifiable and how to use them has been explained by michaelm in discussion previously.

1. Kamis use a combination of LOW NAVAL Skill and EXPERIENCE to determine their hit rate. From my testing it appears to be pretty much the average of the LOW NAVAL Skill and Experience which determines the % hit. So if Low Naval is 60 and Experience is 40 then the kami will, if undamaged by interception or FlAK have a roughly 50% hit rate.


2. Do NOT bother doing general training or naval bombing training above 5,000 feet. All those will simple waste time in training kamis. Set them on 100% training, range 0, altitude 5000 feet and skill to be trained NAVAL ATTACK. Below 5,000 feet they should train in LOW NAVAL.


3. If you send kamis in at low altitude ( below 2,000 feet ( possibly up to 6,000 feet ) ) they will almost ALL hit the BELT ARMOUR, which is fine vs APAs etc but very bad when facing BBs as they'll just scratch the paint. If you send them in at high altitude ( maximum altitude for the plane ) they'll almost all tend to hit the DECK ARMOUR.


4. When determining penetration and damage caused the programme DOES look at the ordnance carried. If your bombs won't penetrate the armour facing which is hit then the kami will only do superficial damage. So, if your kamis can penetrate the deck but not the belt armour there's no point sending them in at low altitude.



When you order a kami attack look at the aggressiveness of the squadron leader. Careful leaders will commit 1/3rd of the squadron to 1/2 of the squadron per day. Aggressive leaders will send the entire unit out in a single day. Since numbers are more important than most other things you want aggressive leaders whenever possible. You also want them to have good NAVAL skill, since those are the attacks they'll be influencing.


Lastly, under the new beta you CANNOT train pilots in LOW NAVAL attack and FlAK has been unintentionally boosted so that attacks with 30 planes which would have gotten 7 to 9 hits previously ( when run under the current release executable ) don't get any hits and instead of 4 or 5 kamis downed by FlAK from the 30 I have gotten 28 downed by FlAK out of 30. This is obviously borked.

So, under the current BETA you CANNNOT use kamis at all. They will have to fly with untrained pilots and FlAK will kill far too many of them before they miss the ships and crash into the sea through poor training. Under the release executable kamis work reasonably well though.

_____________________________

John Dillworth: "I had GreyJoy check my spelling and he said it was fine."
Well, that's that settled then.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 7
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/22/2010 11:40:16 PM   
Fallschirmjager


Posts: 6392
Joined: 3/18/2002
From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
Status: offline
What is 'great' about Kamikazes is that you don't need many hits. They are more powerful than even Allied 1000 lb bombs. Even fighters do damage. Battleship armor is harder to crack and you need bombers or even better, float plan, to crack armor.
In a PBEM game for a year or so ago, I had six Emily's attack my bombardment fleet of old BB's. It was an eventful day so they go through the thick Cap unscathed and attacked six old BB's. Two were shot down and all were damaged but one got a hit on the New Mexico. I don't remember the exact numbers but it penetrated the armor and knocked out a 5 inch gun and a 20mm and did something like 35 system damage and 30 fire damage and 5 permanent float damage.
By the time it was contained the system damage was in the low forties. Poor New Mexico had to limp all the way across the Pacific to PH and then to the West Coast. This was in January 45 and she never did make it make into the war.

I don't know the magic combination of skills that makes Kami's good. One thing I have noticed however (with no evidence to back it up) it that the higher EXP pilots tend to pick the better targets, like Carriers.
Low EXP pilots will go after DD's or DE's.

One other bit of advice is what I call the 'high/low' strategy. Send a pack of fighters about 20,000 feet as LRCAP or escort and let them get slaughtered by Allied Cap. Send the Kamis at 1,000 or even 100.
Most of them will still get intercepted but by smaller numbers of fighters.
Most of your attacks will still fail and you will lose scores of planes. But it seems to help at least some and get more planes through.

Finally as the Allied player to defend against Kamis, who are one of the scariest things in the game. I use my big fleet carriers as high altitude Cap and then use my numerous escort carriers as low altitude Cap.
This was I can defend against Kamis and traditional bomb/torpedo attacks and my Cap won't be all pulled one way or another.

(in reply to Nemo121)
Post #: 8
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/23/2010 12:22:10 AM   
JohnDillworth


Posts: 1948
Joined: 3/19/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Showing some love for referencing the orgin of the word decimation...

+1

_____________________________

The last thing I want to do is hurt you. But it’s still on the list.

(in reply to Fallschirmjager)
Post #: 9
RE: Using Kamikazes - 12/23/2010 12:42:33 AM   
rader


Posts: 910
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nemo121

Lastly, under the new beta you CANNOT train pilots in LOW NAVAL attack and FlAK has been unintentionally boosted so that attacks with 30 planes which would have gotten 7 to 9 hits previously ( when run under the current release executable ) don't get any hits and instead of 4 or 5 kamis downed by FlAK from the 30 I have gotten 28 downed by FlAK out of 30. This is obviously borked.

So, under the current BETA you CANNNOT use kamis at all. They will have to fly with untrained pilots and FlAK will kill far too many of them before they miss the ships and crash into the sea through poor training. Under the release executable kamis work reasonably well though.



Ouch, that's a big problem... I'm glad we didn't update yet... Do you know if this was intentional?

(in reply to Nemo121)
Post #: 10
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