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Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy

 
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Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 6/16/2010 3:37:03 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy


There has been a great deal of discussion, debate and argument over the past, present and future path of the Harpoon simulations on the computer. Here at AGSI and Matrix, we've listened to what has been said. Thought long and hard about the issues raised, and made some decisions regarding Harpoon's future that will hopefully make all fans of the series happy, both those who have played it in the past and those who still play it. We hope that explaining the philosophy behind our decisions will help clear the air and remove some of the confusion and misinformation that has been part of the complex history of these games. The new "Harpoon: Ultimate Edition" which is due to be released this summer will be the realization of these decisions and this philosophy and we hope that it will serve the existing community well, and continue to attract new naval warfare fans to Harpoon.


We will be releasing a great deal more information on Harpoon: Ultimate Edition over the next month, but here are the highlights. Harpoon: Ultimate Edition will include both a new version of Harpoon 3 Advanced Naval Warfare and a new version of Harpoon: Commander's Edition. These will be together in one package at a price below the current combined price of both games. In addition, to celebrate the 20th Anniversary of Harpoon and to give fans who still enjoy playing the older versions a great archival edition, we will be including every previous version of Harpoon that we have access to in this package. That means over 20 classic versions of Harpoon, including Harpoon 3 (v3.6.3) and many previous versions of Harpoon Commander's Edition / Harpoon Classic. This will allow players who have databases or scenarios tied to these older versions to continue to enjoy them for years to come, and it will also allow new players who purchase the Ultimate Edition access to this rich older content. We believe this comprehensive bundle, unlike any that has previously been released for Harpoon on the computer, represents a digital history and "Collector's Edition" of Harpoon that every Harpoon gamer will want to have on their shelf for years to come.



As far as our philosophy, AGSI's and Matrix's position on the Harpoon simulations is simple. They are computer implementations of the Bond/Carlson Harpoon system models (aka the Admiralty Trilogy models). Bond and Carlson also have tabletop miniatures implementations of their models. When Harpoon was first coded in 1987-1989 AGSI tried to follow the 3rd Edition of those rules as faithfully as 8088 CPU's and 640k of RAM would allow. Many of the missing pieces have been added over the twenty years since then and the Harpoon Commander's Edition actually includes elements of the 4th edition models.


Harpoon 3 was born of Harpoon II written in 1994-1995 by a previous team of very skilled programmers. However, they didn't have a lot of former Naval Officers on their team and they didn't ask Bond or Carlson a whole lot of questions. Since regaining control of the property in 2000, AGSI has been steadily correcting course and bringing the Harpoon 3 product closer and closer to the 4th and now 5th edition of models. We believe that we are uniquely positioned among all naval simulations in this regard by having official access to the Bond/Carlson modeling concepts and experience, which means that we are able to bring you the state of the art in naval warfare simulations at the unclassified level.


There are some people in the Harpoon community who don't like change; they are content with what they have and they want to hold onto their contributions. That's their privilege and in fact by releasing the Ultimate Edition, we are making it easier than ever to play the version of Harpoon that you prefer. But, we want to make it clear that we aren't going to sit still when the state of the art is advancing. Harpoon 3's primacy is in the modeling and that is only true because it is the Bond/Carlson models. This is why military professionals around the world have used the product for training, education and analysis.


We believe that continuing to improve the fidelity of the simulation and continuing to advance the state of the art for computer Harpoon is the best way to serve our customers. Harpoon on the computer should always look forward and continue to improve along with the latest improvements and updates from the system models, rather than look back. We give credit to Harpoon's past on the computer, but its future is not in backwards compatibility, but rather in continuing to improve along with the authoritative state of the art models from Bond and Carlson that are simply not available anywhere else.


Given this philosophy, we will still place a high value on feedback, and we always appreciate valid defect reports (aka bugs). However, because of Harpoon's complex history there are many issues that are specific to older databases or scenarios not of AGSI’s or Matrix’s making that haven't kept up with the modeling changes. We are responsible for the official databases and scenarios, and for informing the public regarding what changes each update entails. Third party designers are responsible for their own scenarios in this regard. If we have to choose between improving the simulation or maintaining backwards compatibility with third party data and scenarios, we will choose the former. We realize some fans of Harpoon may prefer to stay with older versions for whatever personal reasons, which is part of why we decided with the Ultimate Edition to include as many of the older Harpoon versions as we could fit into a single release. This allows us to meet the needs of both parts of the community - those that want the simulation to advance and those that want compatibility with older databases and scenarios.


It's also worth noting that in the past, we have heard a great deal from people who have never been to sea, who have never been trained as naval (or air) professionals, have never programmed or created a full database, with strongly worded opinions on how our simulation is supposed to behave. While constructive feedback from our customers is always welcome, we believe that the work by Bond and Carlson should be our guide in terms of how the simulation should work. As many Harpoon fans are aware, this community has seen some very unfortunate events in its history that have given rise to online flame wars, personal attacks and questions of intellectual property; both between community members and in terms of some copyrighted materials. We hope to see the end of this with the steps we are taking for the Ultimate Edition release and for the future of Harpoon. We want to make it clear that we will not accept non-constructive feedback on our official forums in the future. However well intended or misguided, this has caused harm to the game and the community and we will not allow that to continue.


As far as the User Interface goes and overall game functionality - we really do want useful feedback and ideas. We want databases, scenarios, and artwork. Our new encryption feature will help protect an author’s investment in their database work, so that there should be no future concerns about data being stolen or "borrowed". We can also add scenario encryption if need be (ditto for original artwork).



Now as far as defects are concerned, there is a right way and a wrong way to report these. First, due to our limited resources and the seemingly endless permutations of data and game engines once third party databases and scenarios are added to the mix, we will automatically reject any claimed defects on our sites if they are not reproduced in the ANWDB or the HUD3 databases. We will take responsibility for correcting those defects that can be reproduced in one of the two aforementioned databases with the latest official release. We reserve the right to reclassify defects into bugs (something we'll prioritize for fixing), feature requests (stuff that folks want but the game doesn't currently have), user knowledge (i.e. user doesn't understand how the model works) and unsupported functionality (a user who does something with the game or scenario editor that we hadn't thought of and thus hadn't tested).


Secondly, to report a defect, we kindly request that you use this template. If you are consistent in the quality of your reporting we will set you up with direct access to our web based bug tracker "Mantis".


1. Database name and version
2. Scenario name
3. Screen shot(s)
4. Expected behavior
5. Witnessed behavior
6. Desired behavior
7. Notes
8. Any saved games, scenario files, and logs zipped up and emailed to us can only help.


Generally speaking, the operating system or computer configuration has nothing to do with how the simulation runs, so these are not crucial details for our purposes.


Allow us to explain how this works. First, we have very limited resources due to the very small audience of bright people who really understand modern air/naval warfare and buy a Harpoon product every few years. As a consequence, our underpaid programmer(s) really don't enjoy hunting through 15-year-old C++ code originally written by a previous development team on a death march without a clear report to guide them. They would rather be adding new features and functionality. So, the clearer the report, the easier it is to reproduce the defect, the more likely it is that it will be found and fixed. At the end of the day we only have so much time.


This also goes for our forums. As we explained above, we will no longer be accepting lists of bugs related to third party unofficial databases or scenarios. If you find an issue, please duplicate it with an official database and scenario before reporting it and please report it as noted above. Otherwise, you’ll have to seek out the owner of that third party product for assistance.



We want to provide the best possible simulation given the resource limitations. If you want to help, work with us, not against us. We have a long history of volunteers making a positive difference, politely and professionally. Our volunteers have received written credit, some swag, bragging rights, and a few even made some beer money for their efforts. We need scenario authors, database editors/authors, artists, testers and maybe some day, investors. Part of our philosophy and the policy stated above is to give credit to, and work with the members of our community who have put in their time to support Harpoon and who are willing to work with us as we continue to improve.


Thank you for reading this long post and we hope that you at least understand the basis for our decisions. And for those who agree that we are on the right track, there is still plenty of work to do. We believe the new features and content in the upcoming Harpoon: Ultimate Edition, which we will be providing much more detail on in the next few weeks, will open up new avenues in your air/naval simulation experience.


- Matrix Games / AGSI

_____________________________

Erik Rutins
Director of Product Development


For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.
Post #: 1
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 6/16/2010 5:33:25 PM   
TonyE


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Quick note to Harpoon Classic/Commander's Edition players. I think the prior versions are pretty cool! We did not include them all but I think they'll be enough to satisfy all but the most serious collectors.


Some of the text of the announcement does not apply to you...

HUD/ANWDB, etc. do not apply to HC and we plan to continue accepting reports using any database provided or linked to in each issue report

We use the Issue Tracker at HarpGamer.com rather than Mantis


_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 2
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 6/16/2010 5:50:08 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

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Thanks for clarifying that Tony, very true that a lot of this was aimed at H3 but as the Ultimate Edition also includes HCE and our forum policy is consistent on this I figured I should post it here as well.

Regards,

- Erik

_____________________________

Erik Rutins
Director of Product Development


For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 3
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 6/16/2010 6:36:22 PM   
TonyE


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Yep, lots of good info in your announcement Erik!

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 4
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 6/17/2010 2:45:37 PM   
mbar


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I'm glad to see this didn't get cancelled. Thanks for the progress report!

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 5
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 7/6/2010 3:58:34 AM   
donaldseadog

 

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I'm concerned about the actual size of a download that includes all of this stuff (as good as it sounds).
I don't have time to devote to both games and I don't have room on my computer to install further large programs, I also don't much like the idea of having to download a very large installation file just to get a part of the package.
Harpoon has been going for ages and if it is deemed time to buy another licence in order to continue to get upgrades I wouldn't argue. I just don't like the idea of having to buy and perhaps more particularly having to download a very large package most of which I don't want.
This then makes me wonder if I don't purchase "The Ultimate edition" will my days of writting and postsing scenarios end, after all I'd only be writing for an out dated version?
When I bought HCE there was a discounted bundle offer but I didn't take it for much the same reasons as I state herein.
I therefore wonder about the wisdom of a compulsory bundle  and not the option to just buy a new license and download the wanted components.
Don Thomas

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 6
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 7/6/2010 10:09:16 PM   
TonyE


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quote:

ORIGINAL: donaldseadog

<snip>
I therefore wonder about the wisdom of a compulsory bundle  and not the option to just buy a new license and download the wanted components.
Don Thomas



Hi Don,

Thank you for expressing your thoughts on the distribution of the game. Most of us are waiting and wondering to see how the package comes out and how it is received.

Brad and I and certainly others see you creating scenarios and contributing in other ways. We'll do everything we can to keep you in the mix. It may be sending you the game on a USB drive so it doesn't take up any hard drive space, or whatever other strange workarounds we can find.



_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to donaldseadog)
Post #: 7
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 7/8/2010 1:18:30 AM   
donaldseadog

 

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Thanks for your support Tony, I'm sure if I need to I'll manage my computer situation.
In fact I'm most concerned that I think the compulsory bundling is not the best approach from the point of view of the computer harpoon family of games.
The programs are quite big compared to a lot of the competition. Compulsory bundling make it huge (I assume). I looked at this site and found some interesting sounding games that are a lot smaller. Prices are generally similar. I looked from the view point that I was looking for a first game and considered that I can walk into the local computer shop and browse hundreds of games that I just pick off the shelf and carry home with my shopping. By offering harpoon only as a bundle I think the others look more attractive to the new comer.
New comers won't comprehend the (probably) unique aspects of Harpoon that make it so attractive and so addictive. I think it is important to get new owners of either harpoon game.
I think the bundle is a great idea for current players who do lots of playing but don't go into the depths of the game or for those that have a lot of time to spend on the game. They will appreciate the diversity within the Harpoon philosophy and being able to play the old scenarios.
I doubt I am alone though as an established “addict” but not wanting to buy additional games that I don't need. I think a lot of people in my position will not buy the bundle but will drift away. I think if the bundle was a discounted option most would buy the revamped (which ever: HCE, ANW) at a reasonable price.
I therefore think a better approach would be to offer the two individual games (status quo) and an option to purchase a dual licence and get the historical stuff plus a discount (the dual licence deal being available both initially and at a later date). For an established player getting the historical stuff is very attractive but I guess for the new comer pointless.
From the business point of view you want the most $s, from the Harpoon community point of view you want the most players. It's like selling cars, few manufacturers can get away with only offering the high tech fully kitted out model, most have an entry level but make it easy to buy up when ready.
I can't see that the compulsory bundling is the best package for either the new buyer or the existing player. I don't think it will get either the most new players or the most $s.
So I wonder if the decision to go compulsory bundle is based on market research or is just a bit of a guess? I make these comments so that if it is 'a bit of a guess' those doing the guessing have a second thought. Of course if the matter has been properly studied, fair enough.
PS I'd love to see a bundle of $s come in if it would mean big progress in writing code. For that reason I'm not against buying an upgraded licence for continued development. I just don't think the outlined approach is the best way about it.
Don Thomas

(in reply to TonyE)
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RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 7/9/2010 10:51:41 PM   
Falkon

 

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I think I'm in the target group for several reasons.

I often see a game that I'd like to try, but don't buy right away. Some time later, the bundle pack comes out, looks like a great deal, and catches my eye. Sometimes I like a game, but don't keep up with all of the expansions and sequels. Then I see the bundle pack and grab it to get what I've been missing out on. I really like to see the evolution of games throughout a series, and to have the full collection, but I'm not at all likely to buy every version when it first comes out. So I own a lot of these bundle and series packs.

I haven't been able to decide whether to get the current version of ANW or CE or both. I like both approaches, but don't play often enough to buy both. The full pack, with the historical bonus, will save me a decision and seal the deal.

Been playing occasionally since the 3rd ed. pen & paper days, Harpoon Classic and HIIAE.

(in reply to donaldseadog)
Post #: 9
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 8/6/2010 6:06:38 PM   
rich12545

 

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I have a couple of questions on this.  I have HCE and H3 but mostly play HCE.  I have zero interest in past Harpoon games.  Will these two get the same upgrades as individual products that they'll get in the Ultimate Edition?

If not, wouldn't it be fair to offer the Ultimate to those of us who bought both at a large discount or even free? 

(in reply to Falkon)
Post #: 10
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 8/6/2010 8:04:15 PM   
TonyE


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My understanding is that Ultimate will be available at a huge discount to existing owners but not so huge as to be free. Matrix has said each of the existing games will get a single patch (to ultimate patch level or to the next level after ultimate I do not know). After that patch Matrix says the player will need to purchase ultimate for future patches.

See http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=2499323 for some more detail.

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 11
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/9/2010 9:32:15 AM   
glojo

 

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Good morning everyone and have we an update as to when Harpoon Ultimate will be released please?

Yes I will be buying it and I am regularly checking to see if there is any information as to when I can get my greasy mitts on Harpoon Ultimate Edition :)

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 12
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/9/2010 4:36:25 PM   
rich12545

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TonyE

My understanding is that Ultimate will be available at a huge discount to existing owners but not so huge as to be free. Matrix has said each of the existing games will get a single patch (to ultimate patch level or to the next level after ultimate I do not know). After that patch Matrix says the player will need to purchase ultimate for future patches.

See http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=2499323 for some more detail.


The more I think about it the more I hope this is not the case. In computer gaming there is an unspoken agreement that when a game is purchased the buyer is entitled to all future patches unless stated otherwise ahead of time. To change that a few years later isn't the right thing to do. To force people to spend additional money to get patches they should be receiving at no charge isn't right. This is especially true for bug fixes. I hope MG realizes this and continues to offer patches to owners of the games.

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 13
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/9/2010 5:52:33 PM   
TonyE


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rich12545


quote:

ORIGINAL: TonyE

My understanding is that Ultimate will be available at a huge discount to existing owners but not so huge as to be free. Matrix has said each of the existing games will get a single patch (to ultimate patch level or to the next level after ultimate I do not know). After that patch Matrix says the player will need to purchase ultimate for future patches.

See http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/fb.asp?m=2499323 for some more detail.


The more I think about it the more I hope this is not the case. In computer gaming there is an unspoken agreement that when a game is purchased the buyer is entitled to all future patches unless stated otherwise ahead of time. To change that a few years later isn't the right thing to do. To force people to spend additional money to get patches they should be receiving at no charge isn't right. This is especially true for bug fixes. I hope MG realizes this and continues to offer patches to owners of the games.


Just because I bought Silent Hunter III doesn't mean I got Silent Hunter IV for free. There is that argument to Harpoon, eventually the changes pile up enough to be considered an upgrade rather than a patch. Harpoon also emerged as one of the first products to charge for add-ons (battlesets, scenario editor, database editor, etc.) so there is a storied history of paying over and over again for Harpoon.

We have added a lot to HC since the original HCE release, the battleset builder, a couple of entirely rewritten sensor models, parts of the AI have seen much improvement, plus the database and scenario work continues to make this a better game. Those things are all available to anyone who purchased HCE already. Ultimate on the HC side doesn't add a ton of things that sell me; the game itself mainly sees tweaks. The biggie, which has value to some and not to others, are the older versions of the game that come in the new package.

That all said I happen to agree with you that lacking any technical reason (file incompatibility between ultimate and prior releases for one) that it would be nice for patches to continue working on the earlier HCE releases.

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 14
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/9/2010 11:02:19 PM   
rich12545

 

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Tony, we're not talking about ver 3 going to ver 4.  And we're not talking about a free Ultimate.  We're talking about making future patches to HCE available to HCE owners.  The improvements made to HCE to date are about average for a lot of games.  My understanding is the HCE in Ultimate will be the same as the HCE I own now except with maybe some bug fixes and maybe a couple more tweaks.  That's all part of servicing a game.  It is simply not right to charge owners of HCE more money for future patches.  The same goes for owners of ANW btw.  If MG is, for whatever reason, unable to issue separate patches in the future, then they should just bite the bullet and give a free Ultimate to owners of both games and a discount to owners of either one.  Most people imo have no interest in older versions of Harpoon.

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 15
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/10/2010 2:01:54 AM   
ruixilyy


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I totally agree with rich12545. I guess both the HCE and H3ANW in the Ultimate Edition are just the same as we get now. Maybe we still have to install all the former patches so as to 'update' our games. SO what we need are the new patches, not a 'new without new' game.

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 16
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/10/2010 1:29:32 PM   
TonyE


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quote:

ORIGINAL: ruixilyy

I totally agree with rich12545. I guess both the HCE and H3ANW in the Ultimate Edition are just the same as we get now. Maybe we still have to install all the former patches so as to 'update' our games. SO what we need are the new patches, not a 'new without new' game.


The Ultimate package includes fully patched games, no updates to apply as yet but I can say on the HC side the next update after Ultimate will lay impressive groundwork for the future!

_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to ruixilyy)
Post #: 17
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/11/2010 12:38:36 AM   
rich12545

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TonyE


quote:

ORIGINAL: ruixilyy

I totally agree with rich12545. I guess both the HCE and H3ANW in the Ultimate Edition are just the same as we get now. Maybe we still have to install all the former patches so as to 'update' our games. SO what we need are the new patches, not a 'new without new' game.


The Ultimate package includes fully patched games, no updates to apply as yet but I can say on the HC side the next update after Ultimate will lay impressive groundwork for the future!



I'm very happy and appreciative HCE will continue to improve. It would be nice, however, to get a clarification on future costs. Here's a quote from the manual.

"In order to maintain our product excellence, Matrix Games releases updates containing new features, enhancements, and corrections to any known issues. Keeping up with these updates is made easy and is free by signing up for a Matrix Games Member. When you’re signed up, you can then register your Matrix Games products in order to receive access to these important game-related materials."

It looks like all future patches will be available at no cost. Yet it also looks like MG plans to charge for patches after the next one because of Ultimate. It would be really nice if Erik or someone would post MG's plans on this.

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 18
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/11/2010 2:29:33 AM   
TonyE


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I want to mention a couple of items in case my silence suggests my tacit agreement with statements.

H3 has significant new features in the Ultimate Edition (boarding/takeover and expansion of missions, better missions chaining, etc.). HC just happened to fall during a period of bug fixing and not big feature additions.

Speaking as someone who bought H2, H2 Deluxe Multimedia, the database editor, and then the Admiral's Edition (and even more versions and pieces of HC), the money for Ultimate gets me a whole lot more than most of those paid upgrades got me. It doesn't make anything right or wrong but it certainly shows a precedent with Harpoon.

Erik already stated in the thread's original post that existing owners of HCE or H3ANW will be able to buy Ultimate at a deep discount, deeper than what I'd consider a 'normal' upgrade price. This is a nod and their recognition of all of the points you are raising.

Ultimate is a different sku/product/package and whatever else to Matrix getting them around your quoted section of the manual. Again, not stating my opinion on the matter which you should be able to glean from my posts but I am echoing Matrix's stated approach to the situation.



_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 19
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/11/2010 3:52:09 PM   
rich12545

 

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Tony, we seem to be miscommunicating.  You're talking one thing and I'm talking another.  So just to be clear.

Owners of HCE or ANW should continue to receive free updates for products we bought regardless of Ultimate.  It doesn't matter if MG comes out with Ultimate we should still get those updates.  Ultimate is for those who want additional Harpoon games or for new customers.  Many of us already purchased and should not have updates cut off for those products.  That's an unspoken agreement in the industry and it's spelled out in writing in the HCE manual.

Again, it would be nice for Erik or somebody from MG to post and clarify.

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 20
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/11/2010 4:30:57 PM   
TonyE


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If you succeed trying to make that argument with Matrix I'll be looking forward to 10s of thousands of dollars back from Microsoft when you topple them too

I think Erik was pretty clear in the first post; the only ambiguity I read is whether Matrix plans on patching existing users to the Ultimate level (feasible for HCE) or one patch level beyond (gets hairy as codebases diverge and I'm a cranky volunteer with limited time so...). I'm not sure he has reason to jump in until pricing has been finalized.



_____________________________

Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to rich12545)
Post #: 21
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/16/2010 2:31:05 PM   
patrickrizer243


Posts: 6
Joined: 2/2/2007
From: Casper Wyoming
Status: offline
Any update on the expected release date? I can't wait for Ultimate.My dad and I had a copy of the original Mac version on 3.5 Disk (remember those?!?), and a copy of Harpoon II that came in a bundle. We had to make do with GIUK in Harpoon I and Global Conflicts I for Harpoon II. The reason why I bring this up is because my dad's birthday is the 22nd. Any chance it will be out by then? Any chance we could pre-order soon? Also, any idea how much this beast is going to cost?

(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 22
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 9/17/2010 12:55:24 AM   
TonyE


Posts: 1508
Joined: 5/23/2006
From: MN, USA
Status: offline
It won't be out by the 22nd; past that I have no idea.

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Sincerely,
Tony Eischens
Harpoon (HC, HCE, HUCE, Classic) programmer
HarpGamer.com Co-Owner

(in reply to patrickrizer243)
Post #: 23
RE: Harpoon: Ultimate Edition and Our Philosophy - 10/15/2010 8:59:56 AM   
jomni


Posts: 2769
Joined: 11/19/2007
Status: offline
I think this Ultimate Package is a scheme to make people who like HCE (like me) to finally move to the next generation ANW.  Honestly, I have mixed feelings.  I don't want to move to ANW because of the all problems it has and I just want continued patches for HCE.  But if ANW is finally fixed... then maybe I'll like it. So the price better be good!

< Message edited by jomni -- 10/15/2010 9:02:52 AM >


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(in reply to TonyE)
Post #: 24
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