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escort tips? - 10/19/2009 8:02:50 PM   
undercovergeek

 

Posts: 1455
Joined: 11/21/2006
From: UK
Status: offline 		have repeatedly revisited pearl from the 7th onwards and attacked clark and manilla - my initial escort does great but then the CAP breaks through and decimates the bombers - are there any tips for escorting - at Pearl i had 80 zeros at 25k ft escorting 65 kates at 23k ft and the cap of 40 warhawks got through and damaged 20, at clark 30 zeros at 9k ft escorted 57 bettys at 6k ft and again i lost about 15 bettys to the cap of 30 warhawks - watching the replay the cap meets the escort and then after a while just breaks on through to the bombers - any tips?
Post #: 1
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 8:04:04 PM   
treespider


Posts: 9735
Joined: 1/30/2005
From: Knoxville
Status: offline 		Sweep.

_____________________________

Here's a link to:
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"It is not the critic who counts, .... The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..." T. Roosevelt, Paris, 1910

(in reply to undercovergeek)
Post #: 2
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 8:08:53 PM   
tbridges


Posts: 214
Joined: 6/25/2005
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		?? More details for this newbie, please Tree.

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Post #: 3
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 8:22:13 PM   
pad152

 

Posts: 2827
Joined: 4/23/2000
Status: offline 		Have your fighters at their best high alt rating conduct fighter sweeps of enemy airbases to wear down their fighters, also if your bombers are taking heavy loses, change them to night attack on airfields (alt around 12,000 ft). Both of these tactics will wear down the enemy air forces and allow you to gain control of the air.

Don't forget to rest/rotate air groups so you don't wear down your air groups!  

(in reply to tbridges)
Post #: 4
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 8:28:00 PM   
treespider


Posts: 9735
Joined: 1/30/2005
From: Knoxville
Status: offline 		As OP stated he had 80 Zeros escorting 65 bombers and was opposed by 40 P-40s.

Had he set 30-40 of those Zeroes to Sweep he may have cleared a substantial portion of the CAP....of course with RADAR the ensuing Escorted Bombing Raid (assuming the strikes come in uncoordinated) may see even more defending CAP in the air.

So generally I don't like to launch bombers against a target defended by such heavy CAP. Instead I sweep for several days to try to clear the skies of defending CAP...then I send in the escorted bombing raid hopefully catching the fighters damaged by the sweeps on the ground.

Works well early on ...at least until your Oscars meet the Hurricane.

_____________________________

Here's a link to:
Treespider's Grand Campaign of DBB

"It is not the critic who counts, .... The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..." T. Roosevelt, Paris, 1910

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Post #: 5
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:16:18 PM   
tbridges


Posts: 214
Joined: 6/25/2005
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		Hey Pad...HIGH altitude? Isn't a "sweep" intended to represent a very LOW altitude strafing run against ground targets? Wouldn't I set altitude for a sweep at 100 feet?

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Post #: 6
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:21:20 PM   
treespider


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From: Knoxville
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tbridges

Hey Pad...HIGH altitude? Isn't a "sweep" intended to represent a very LOW altitude strafing run against ground targets? Wouldn't I set altitude for a sweep at 100 feet?



Not unless you want to see your fighters shot up by AAA....

_____________________________

Here's a link to:
Treespider's Grand Campaign of DBB

"It is not the critic who counts, .... The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..." T. Roosevelt, Paris, 1910

(in reply to tbridges)
Post #: 7
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:29:45 PM   
tbridges


Posts: 214
Joined: 6/25/2005
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		Sorry to be so dense - I have a lot to learn about this game, but are you saying that the fighters will execute an effective strafing run from 15,000 feet? Or is it assumed that the altitude selected is only for the approach to target, at which point they will to dive to the appropriate strafing altitude automatically?

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Post #: 8
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:34:39 PM   
treespider


Posts: 9735
Joined: 1/30/2005
From: Knoxville
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tbridges

Sorry to be so dense - I have a lot to learn about this game, but are you saying that the fighters will execute an effective strafing run from 15,000 feet? Or is it assumed that the altitude selected is only for the approach to target, at which point they will to dive to the appropriate strafing altitude automatically?



SWEEPS are intended for the SWEEPing fighters to SWEEP the defending CAP from the skies...not to conduct an AIRFIELD ATTACK at 100'.

Although the manual says the Fighters should conduct this strafing attack if no fighters are encountered during a SWEEP, I have yet to see such an attack unless the SWEEP is set to 100'.

_____________________________

Here's a link to:
Treespider's Grand Campaign of DBB

"It is not the critic who counts, .... The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena..." T. Roosevelt, Paris, 1910

(in reply to tbridges)
Post #: 9
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:38:52 PM   
pad152

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tbridges

Hey Pad...HIGH altitude? Isn't a "sweep" intended to represent a very LOW altitude strafing run against ground targets? Wouldn't I set altitude for a sweep at 100 feet?



Fighter sweeps are for attacking enemy fighters, look at the aircraft data for both your fighters and enemy aircraft, try to pick a altitude where your fighters have a benefit in maneuverability.

Low altitude strafing attacks are for attacking enemy airfields and/or fighter attacks on naval targets (the only way to take out small units like PT/MTB's, & barges)!


(in reply to tbridges)
Post #: 10
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:41:47 PM   
tbridges


Posts: 214
Joined: 6/25/2005
From: North Carolina
Status: offline 		AHH...thank you gentlemen, that explains it...I misunderstood the term "sweep".

Thank you for clearing that up!

(in reply to treespider)
Post #: 11
RE: escort tips? - 10/19/2009 9:57:53 PM   
TheElf


Posts: 3812
Joined: 5/14/2003
From: Corpus Christi, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider

As OP stated he had 80 Zeros escorting 65 bombers and was opposed by 40 P-40s.

Had he set 30-40 of those Zeroes to Sweep he may have cleared a substantial portion of the CAP....of course with RADAR the ensuing Escorted Bombing Raid (assuming the strikes come in uncoordinated) may see even more defending CAP in the air.

So generally I don't like to launch bombers against a target defended by such heavy CAP. Instead I sweep for several days to try to clear the skies of defending CAP...then I send in the escorted bombing raid hopefully catching the fighters damaged by the sweeps on the ground.

Works well early on ...at least until your Oscars meet the Hurricane.

Just want to clarify something that Tree has already dutifully mentioned. To be specific setting a portion of a would be ESCORT to SWEEP does not guarantee that the SWEEP will be conducted BEFORE the raid those A/C would otherwise be escorting. This is obviously the intent, when sweeping, but coordination is a key factor in whether SWEEPs are flown before, during, or after the strike....or even at all! You STILL need to consider forecasted weather, leader ratings of all units involved, basing (co-location helps, and distance between coordinating units does not!).

If you are setting units to sweep from a large AF with all participating units there, an Air HQ with a Decent Air commander, good weather and short distances to the target in question, these factors will be the best case for a well coordinated, sweep of an enemy Hex.

If you are having trouble, try to achieve as many of the things as you can above, OR consider prepping the battlefield, by sweeping with strong Fighter units BEFORE you attempt a sustained Air campaign against well defended targets.

_____________________________

WAR IN THE PACIFIC: Admiral's Edition - Air Team Lead

IN PERPETUUM SINGULARIS SEDES



(in reply to treespider)
Post #: 12
RE: escort tips? - 10/20/2009 2:00:36 PM   
xj900uk

 

Posts: 1218
Joined: 3/22/2007
Status: offline 		Also if you are fighting P39's or P400's they don't have a turbo-supercharger and their performance noticably tails off above 9,000'.  Keep everything up above 15k when dealing with them & make them stagger up to fight you, then your Zero's can swoop down (admittedly not very easy for a low wing-loading aircraft) and nobble them

(in reply to TheElf)
Post #: 13
RE: escort tips? - 10/21/2009 12:22:10 AM   
Pappy


Posts: 608
Joined: 9/12/2000
From: NY, USA
Status: offline 		Question: Say you have two fighter units available at the same base. Do you sent one Sweep @ 100% and one Escort @100% or do you split each 50/50?

(in reply to xj900uk)
Post #: 14
RE: escort tips? - 10/21/2009 12:26:49 AM   
Shark7


Posts: 6212
Joined: 7/24/2007
From: The Big Nowhere
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: treespider

As OP stated he had 80 Zeros escorting 65 bombers and was opposed by 40 P-40s.

Had he set 30-40 of those Zeroes to Sweep he may have cleared a substantial portion of the CAP....of course with RADAR the ensuing Escorted Bombing Raid (assuming the strikes come in uncoordinated) may see even more defending CAP in the air.

So generally I don't like to launch bombers against a target defended by such heavy CAP. Instead I sweep for several days to try to clear the skies of defending CAP...then I send in the escorted bombing raid hopefully catching the fighters damaged by the sweeps on the ground.

Works well early on ...at least until your Oscars meet the Hurricane.


A good Oscar group can hold its own against a mediocre Hurricane group, but you have to seriously watch attrition. In other words, Oscar vs Hurricane on a daily basis is hazardous to Oscars health, once in a while is OK.

_____________________________

aka- Akula

Larry Bond's Harpoon - Commander's Edition

Development Team Member

(in reply to treespider)
Post #: 15
RE: escort tips? - 10/21/2009 1:36:29 AM   
Djordje

 

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Joined: 9/12/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pappy

Question: Say you have two fighter units available at the same base. Do you sent one Sweep @ 100% and one Escort @100% or do you split each 50/50?


I go for 1 full squadron on sweep, other one on escort. 50/50 just calls for additional coordination, which means more chance for strike to be fragmented.

(in reply to Pappy)
Post #: 16
RE: escort tips? - 10/22/2009 12:27:07 AM   
Pappy


Posts: 608
Joined: 9/12/2000
From: NY, USA
Status: offline 		Makes good sense - thanks!

(in reply to Djordje)
Post #: 17
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