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French Indochina in Modern Wars

 
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French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 3:40:02 PM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline
Regarding the Dinassauts ( a contraction of Divisions Navales d'Assaut )


Jason, here are 6 examples of the river craft the Dinassauts used. They are the most common, and were in use for the longest periods of time, so I think they would be a good representation of the various types. I don't know whether you would create brand new graphics for these, or just modify the existing ones from JCTS, so I've matched each Dinassaut vessel one to its nearest JCTS unit. Click on the links, and you can see details of armament fitted





LCT Mk.4 ( Closest JCTS Unit: Landing Craft Tank LCT )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#LCT4

These were in use throughout the war. I'm a bit doubtful as to whether one vessel could carry an entire battalion as stated.

_____________


LCM 3 & 6 ( Closest JCTS Unit: Landing Craft Mechanized LCM )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#LCM3
http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#LCM6


_____________


LCI ( Closest JCTS Unit: Landing Craft Tank LCT )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#LCI


_____________


LCM Monitor ( Closest JCTS Unit: Landing Craft Mechanized LCM )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#Monitor

Vital boats these, for providing fire power


_____________


LCM Command Boat ( Closest JCTS Unit: Landing Craft Mechanized LCM )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#Command

THis raises the question of command radius and supply for Dinassaut units. By their nature, they were pretty self-sufficient with a high level of organic supply. Need to discuss that further maybe


_____________

Landing Ship Support Large ( Closest JCTS Unit Frigate/Cutter )

http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/boats.html#LSSL

The landing ship designation is a bit of a misnomer here because they were small warships rather than landing vessels

_____________


I think the above, coupled with all the unmodified landing craft that we already have in JCTS, will provide more than enough for any coastal and/or river scenarios. Dinassauts moved with their own infantry and even tanks embarked too.

Additionally, the full range of tracked landing craft was used by the French,

LVT(A)4 Amphibious Tanks,LVT(A)4
LVT(A)1 Amphibious Tanks,LVT(A)1
LVT4 Amphibious Personnel Carrier,LVT4
LVT(A)2 Amphibious Personnel Carrier,LVT(A)2
LVT2 Amphibious Personnel Carrier 2,LVT2


Regards

Paul



< Message edited by Geomitrak -- 5/3/2009 4:36:47 PM >


_____________________________

Post #: 1
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 4:29:44 PM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline
Jason, some things that came up in the other thread...

1) Yes, the Vietnamese Paras, (BPVN) should be included in the French OOB

2) In the OOB you gave, you mention these two units:

Local Auxiliary Force
Local Irregulars

Am I right in assuming that one represents the locally-raised, and somewhat ineffectual, militias that attempted to defend villages, while the other represents guerilla forces raised from hill tribes and led by French officers and/or senior NCOs ( similar to the Montagnards and US Green Berets) ? The latter were very effective indeed !

3) Both sides would need the ability to lay and clear mines, and have bridging units, boats and rafts.

4) The recoilless rifle was a favoured weapon on both sides, so it would be a good idea to include those. The French used American-made ones. The Viet Minh used captured examples of course, but also Russian and Czech-built ones. From 1950, they had a clandestine factory producing SKZ 75mm recoilless guns.


More thoughts to come. Jason, I have a fairly good collection of books and articles on the period, so please don't hesitate to ask anything you wish. Stefan (Legionaer) will correct me if I get anything wrong

Regards

Paul




_____________________________


(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 2
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 5:39:56 PM   
Jason Petho


Posts: 5432
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak

Regarding the Dinassauts ( a contraction of Divisions Navales d'Assaut )


Jason, here are 6 examples of the river craft the Dinassauts used. They are the most common, and were in use for the longest periods of time, so I think they would be a good representation of the various types. I don't know whether you would create brand new graphics for these, or just modify the existing ones from JCTS, so I've matched each Dinassaut vessel one to its nearest JCTS unit. Click on the links, and you can see details of armament fitted



Hi Paul

Excellent list with lots of information, thank you.

The reference to existing graphics is helpful, as it is easier to modify than the create from scratch. I'll see if Mike has time to work on some of these. Mike?

Would you be terribly upset if you didn't receive all of the equipment in the first release?

Jason Petho



_____________________________

Petho Cartography

Mapping Military History

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 3
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 6:14:38 PM   
Jason Petho


Posts: 5432
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak

Jason, some things that came up in the other thread...

1) Yes, the Vietnamese Paras, (BPVN) should be included in the French OOB

Duly noted!
quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak
2) In the OOB you gave, you mention these two units:

Local Auxiliary Force
Local Irregulars

Am I right in assuming that one represents the locally-raised, and somewhat ineffectual, militias that attempted to defend villages, while the other represents guerilla forces raised from hill tribes and led by French officers and/or senior NCOs ( similar to the Montagnards and US Green Berets) ? The latter were very effective indeed !

I believe they cover both, but I would have to double check the weapons values as to which is which.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak
3) Both sides would need the ability to lay and clear mines, and have bridging units, boats and rafts.

Also duly noted!


quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak
4) The recoilless rifle was a favoured weapon on both sides, so it would be a good idea to include those. The French used American-made ones. The Viet Minh used captured examples of course, but also Russian and Czech-built ones. From 1950, they had a clandestine factory producing SKZ 75mm recoilless guns.

Good to know, good to know.

Of course, that was the complete list, but here it is. The present French platoons available (I will add to it based on the information I gather here!)

M8 Armored Car Section , M8 Arm'd Car Sec ,
M5A1 Light Tanks , M5A1 Lt. Tanks , Stuart
M5A1 Light Tanks , M5A1 Lt. Tanks , Stuart
M24 Light Tanks , M24 Lt. Tanks , Chaffee
M24 Light Tanks , M24 Lt. Tanks , Chaffee
M24 Light Tanks , M24 Lt. Tanks , Chaffee
M24 Light Tanks , M24 Lt. Tanks , Chaffee
Ferret FV 701 , Ferret FV 701 ,
H39 Light Tanks , H39 ,
AMX-13/75 Light Tank , AMX-13/75 ,
AMX-13/75 Light Tank , AMX-13/75 ,
AMX-13/75 Light Tank , AMX-13/75 ,
AMX-13/75 Light Tank , AMX-13/75 ,
AMX-13/90 Light Tank , AMX-13/90 ,
AMX-13/90 Light Tank , AMX-13/90 ,
AMX-13/90 Light Tank , AMX-13/90 ,
M4 Medium Tanks , M4 Med. Tanks , Sherman
M4 Medium Tanks , M4 Med. Tanks , Sherman
M4 Medium Tanks , M4 Med. Tanks , Sherman
M47 Patton , M47 Patton ,
M47 Patton , M47 Patton ,
M47 Patton , M47 Patton ,
AMX-30 MBT , AMX-30 ,
AMX-30 MBT , AMX-30 ,
AMX-30 MBT , AMX-30 ,
AMX-30 MBT , AMX-30 ,
AMX-30B2 MBT , AMX-30B2 ,
AMX-30B2 MBT , AMX-30B2 ,
AMX-30B2 MBT , AMX-30B2 ,
AMX-30B2 MBT , AMX-30B2 ,
AMX-30 EBG CEV , AMX-30 EBG ,
Leclerc MBT , Leclerc ,
Leclerc MBT , Leclerc ,
Leclerc MBT , Leclerc ,
Leclerc MBT , Leclerc ,
M3 Halftracks , Halftracks ,
M3 Halftracks , Halftracks ,
M3 Halftracks , Halftracks ,
M3 Halftracks , Halftracks ,
AMX-VCI , AMX-VCI ,
AMX-VCI , AMX-VCI ,
AMX-VCI , AMX-VCI ,
AMX-VCI , AMX-VCI ,
AMX-VCI , AMX-VCI ,
AMX-10P IFV , AMX-10P ,
AMX-10P IFV , AMX-10P ,
AMX-10P IFV , AMX-10P ,
AMX-10P IFV , AMX-10P ,
VAB 4x4 APC , VAB ,
VAB 4x4 APC , VAB ,
VAB 4x4 APC , VAB ,
VAB 4x4 APC , VAB ,
VAB 6x6 APC , VAB ,
VAB 6x6 APC , VAB ,
VAB 6x6 APC , VAB ,
VAB 6x6 APC w/20mm , VAB 20mm ,
VBL w/20mm , VBL 20mm ,
VBL w/20mm , VBL 20mm ,
VBL Anti-Personnel Combat Vehicle , VBL APCV ,
VBL Anti-Personnel Combat Vehicle , VBL APCV ,
M3A1 Scout Car Section , M3A1 Scout Sec ,
M3 HT Twin 20mm , M3 HT Twin 20mm ,
AMX-13 DCA Twin 30mm , AMX-13 DCA ,
AMX-13 DCA Twin 30mm , AMX-13 DCA ,
AMX-13 DCA Twin 30mm , AMX-13 DCA ,
AMX-30 Roland , AMX-30 Roland ,
AMX-30 Roland , AMX-30 Roland ,
Panhard VBL w/Mistral , VBL MISTRAL ,
M8 HMC Self-Propelled 75mm Howitzers , M8 HMC Sec , Scott
M7 105mm SP Gun , M7 ,
MK 61 105mm SP Gun , MK 61 ,
MK F3 155mm SP Gun , MK F3 ,
Giat GCT 155mm SP Gun , Giat 155mm ,
M36 GMC 90mm Tank Destroyers , M36 GMC , Jackson
Jeep w/106mm RR , Jeeps - RR ,
Jeep w/SS11 , Jeep w/SS11 ,
Jeep w/Milan , Jeep w/Milan ,
Jeep w/Milan , Jeep w/Milan ,
VAB Mephisto/Milan , VAB Mephisto ,
VAB Mephisto/Milan , VAB Mephisto ,
Panhard VBL w/MILAN , VBL MILAN ,
Panhard VBL w/MILAN , VBL MILAN ,
Panhard VBL w/TOW , VBL TOW ,
Panhard VBL w/TOW , VBL TOW ,
AMX-13/75/SS-11 Light Tank , AMX-13/75/SS-11 ,
M3/AOP Halftracks , M3/AOP Halftracks ,
M3/81 Halftracks , M3/81 Halftracks ,
AMX-VCPM(120) , AMX-VCPM(120) ,
AMX-VCPM(120) , AMX-VCPM(120) ,
AMX-VCPM(81) , AMX-VCPM(81) ,
AMX-VCPM(81) , AMX-VCPM(81) ,
VAB 4x4 APC w/81mm , VPM 81mm ,
Panhard 178B Armored Cars , 178B Arm?d Cars , Pan 178 ,
Coventry MK.I Armoured Cars , Cov MK.I ,
AML-60 Armored Car , AML-60 ,
AML-90 Armored Car , AML-90 ,
ERC-90 Armored Car , ERC-90 ,
EBR-75 Armored Car , EBR-75 ,
EBR-90 Armored Car , EBR-90 ,
AMX-10 RC Armored Car , AMX-10RC ,
AMX-10 RC Armored Car , AMX-10RC ,
Panhard M3 , Panhard M3 ,
Panhard M3 , Panhard M3 ,
Panhard VBL , VBL ,
Panhard VBL , VBL ,
Jeep with MG , Jeeps - MG ,
Jeep with MG , Jeeps - MG ,
Jeep with MG , Jeeps - MG ,
Jeeps , Jeeps ,
Jeeps , Jeeps ,
Armed Trucks , Armed Trucks ,
Armed Trucks , Armed Trucks ,
Armed Trucks , Armed Trucks ,
Armed Trucks , Armed Trucks ,
Heavy Truck , Trucks ,
Heavy Truck , Trucks ,
Heavy Truck , Trucks ,
Heavy Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Prime Movers , Prime Movers ,
AVLB , AVLB ,
Dozers , Dozers ,
Maintenance Recovery M578 , Maint Rec Pltn ,
Maintenance Recovery M74 , Maint Rec Pltn ,
Maintenance Recovery AMX , AMX Rec ,
AMX-13 CPP Bridging , AMX-13 CPP ,
AMX-30 CCP Bridging , AMX-30 CCP ,
Boats , Boats ,
Rafts , Rafts ,
DUKW Amphibious Trucks , DUKWs ,
Terrapin Amphibious Trucks , Terrapins ,
LVT4 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , LVT4 , Alligator; Amtrac; Buffalo
LVT4 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , LVT4 , Alligator; Amtrac; Buffalo
LVT4 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , LVT4 , Alligator; Amtrac; Buffalo
LVT4 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , LVT4 , Alligator; Amtrac; Buffalo
LVT(A)4 Amphibious Tanks , LVT(A)4 , Amtank
M29 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , M29 , Crabe
M29 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , M29 , Crabe
M29 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , M29 , Crabe
M29 Amphibious Personnel Carriers , M29 , Crabe
LCPV Landing Craft , LCPV ,
LCM Landing Craft , LCM ,
Landing Craft Tank , LCT ,
60mm Mortars , 60mm Mtrs ,
60mm Mortars , 60mm Mtrs ,
81mm Mortars , 81mm Mtrs ,
81mm Mortars , 81mm Mtrs ,
120mm M65 Mtr , 120mm M65 Mtr ,
M1 81mm Mortars , 81mm Mtrs ,
M1 81mm Mortars , 81mm Mtrs ,
M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzers , 75mm Pack How ,
M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzers , 75mm Pack How ,
M3 105mm Howitzers , 105mm How ,
M3 105mm Howitzers , 105mm How ,
M3 105mm Howitzers , 105mm How ,
155mm Howitzers , 155mm Hows ,
155mm Howitzers , 155mm Hows ,
M1A1 155mm Guns , 155mm Guns , Long Tom
M1 57mm Anti-Tank Guns , 57mm ATG ,
M18 57mm Recoilless Rifles , 57mm Recoilless ,
M20 75mm Recoilless Rifles , 75mm Recoilless ,
106mm RR , 106mm RR ,
SS-10 Missile , SS-10 Missile ,
SS-11 Missile , SS-11 Missile ,
Milan AT Missile , Milan AT Missile ,
Redeye SAM , Redeye SAM ,
Mistral SAM , Mistral SAM ,
Quad Anti-Aircraft Machine Guns , Quad AAMG ,
Mk.3 20mm AA , 20mm AA ,
40mm Bofors L/60 AA , 40mm L/60 AA ,
5-inch Naval Guns , 5-in. Naval Guns ,
6-inch Naval Guns , 6-in. Naval Guns ,
8-inch Naval Guns , 8-in. Naval Guns ,
12-inch Naval Guns , 12-in. Naval Guns ,
Rifle Platoon 48 , Rifle 48 ,
Rifle Platoon 48 Green , Rifle 48 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 48 Veteran , Rifle 48 (V) ,
Rifle Platoon 51 , Rifle 51 ,
Rifle Platoon 51 Green , Rifle 51 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 51 Veteran , Rifle 51 (V) ,
Rifle Platoon 54 , Rifle 54 ,
Rifle Platoon 54 Green , Rifle 54 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 54 Veteran , Rifle 54 (V) ,
Rifle Platoon 58 , Rifle 58 ,
Rifle Platoon 58 Green , Rifle 58 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 58 Veteran , Rifle 58 (V) ,
Rifle Platoon 67 , Rifle 67 ,
Rifle Platoon 67 Green , Rifle 67 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 67 Veteran , Rifle 67 (V) ,
Rifle Platoon 74 , Rifle 74 ,
Rifle Platoon 74 Green , Rifle 74 (G) ,
Rifle Platoon 74 Veteran , Rifle 74 (V) ,
Reconnaissance Section , Recce Sec ,
Reconnaissance Section , Recce Sec ,
Colonial Infantry , Col Inf ,
Colonial Infantry , Col Inf , " "
Metropolitan Infantry , Met Inf ,
North African Infantry , NA Inf ,
North African Infantry , NA Inf ,
Senegalese Infantry , Senegal Inf ,
Senegalese Infantry , Senegal Inf ,
North African Irregular Infantry , NA Irr Inf ,
Catholic Militia Platoon , Cat Mil Pltn ,
Auxiliary Light Infantry , Auxiliary Infantry ,
Auxiliary Light Infantry , Auxiliary Infantry ,
Local Auxiliary Force , Local Auxiliary Force ,
Local Irregulars , Local Irregulars ,
Submachinegun Platoon , Smg Pltn ,
Engineer Platoon 48 , Engineer 48 ,
Engineer Platoon 63 , Engineer 63 ,
Armoured Engineer Platoon , Arm. Eng Pltn ,
Bridge Engineer Platoon , Bridge Eng Pltn ,
Construction Platoon , Construction Pltn ,
Mine Platoon , Mine Inf Pltn ,
Colonial Paratrooper , Col Para Inf ,
Metropolitan Paratrooper , Met Para Inf ,
Foreign Legion Paratrooper , Legn Para Inf ,
Heavy Machinegun Platoon , HMG Pltn ,
Heavy Machinegun Squad , HMG Squad ,
.50-cal Machinegun Platoon , .50-cal MG Pltn ,
Anti-Aircraft Machinegun Section , AAMG Sec ,
Civilians , Civilians ,
Armoured Infantry , Arm'd Inf Pltn ,
Armoured Infantry 48 , Arm'd Inf 48 ,
Armoured Infantry 48 (Green) , Arm'd Inf 48 (G) ,
Armoured Infantry 48 (Veteran) , Arm'd Inf 48 (V) ,
Armoured Infantry 54 , Arm'd Inf 54 ,
Armoured Infantry 54 (Green) , Arm'd Inf 54 (G) ,
Armoured Infantry 54 (Veteran) , Arm'd Inf 54 (V) ,
Armoured Infantry 58 , Arm'd Inf 58 ,
Armoured Infantry 58 (Green) , Arm'd Inf 58 (G) ,
Armoured Infantry 58 (Veteran) , Arm'd Inf 58 (V) ,
Armoured Infantry 67 , Arm'd Inf 67 ,
Armoured Infantry 67 (Green) , Arm'd Inf 67 (G) ,
Armoured Infantry 67 (Veteran) , Arm'd Inf 67 (V) ,
Armoured Infantry 74 , Arm'd Inf 74 ,
Armoured Infantry 74 (Green) , Arm'd Inf 74 (G) ,
Armoured Infantry 74 (Veteran) , Arm'd Inf 74 (V) ,
Paratrooper 48 , Para 48 ,
Paratrooper 48 (Green) , Para 48 (G) ,
Paratrooper 48 (Veteran) , Para 48 (V) ,
Paratrooper 58 , Para 58 ,
Paratrooper 58 (Green) , Para 58 (G) ,
Paratrooper 58 (Veteran) , Para 58 (V) ,
Paratrooper 67 , Para 67 ,
Paratrooper 67 (Green) , Para 67 (G) ,
Paratrooper 67 (Veteran) , Para 67 (V) ,
Paratrooper 74 , Para 74 ,
Paratrooper 74 (Green) , Para 74 (G) ,
Paratrooper 74 (Veteran) , Para 74 (V) ,
Foreign Legion Paratrooper 48 , F.L. Para 48 ,
Foreign Legion Paratrooper 48 (Veteran) , F.L. Para 48 (V) ,
Foreign Legion Paratrooper 66 , F.L. Para 67 ,
Foreign Legion Paratrooper 66 (Veteran) , F.L. Para 67 (V) ,
Foreign Legion Mech Platoon , Legn Mech Inf ,
Foreign Legion Infantry , Legn Inf ,
Foreign Legion Cavalry , Leg Cavalry ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 48 , F.F. Legion 48 ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 48 (Green) , F.F. Legion 48 (G) ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 48 (Veteran) , F.F. Legion 48 (V) ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 67 , F.F. Legion 67 ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 67 (Green) , F.F. Legion 67 (G) ,
Foreign Legion Platoon 67 (Veteran) , F.F. Legion 67 (V) ,
Marine Commando Platoon , Mar Cmdo Pltn ,
Marine Commando Platoon , Mar Cmdo Pltn ,
Marine Platoon , Mar Pltn ,
Marine Mech Platoon , Mar Mech Pltn ,
Marine Heavy Machinegun Section , Marine HMG Pltn ,
Army HQ , Army HQ ,
Corps HQ , Corps HQ ,
Divisional HQ , Div HQ ,
Brigade HQ , Bde HQ ,
Regimental HQ , Rgt HQ ,
Battalion HQ (foot) , Btln HQ (foot) ,
Battalion HQ (mot.) , Btln HQ (mot.) ,
AMX-10P HQ , AMX-10P HQ ,
VAB 4x4 GQ , VAB HQ ,
AMX-VCI HQ , AMX-VCI HQ ,
VBL 4x4 GQ , VBL HQ ,
Commander 1 , Cdr 1 ,
Commander 2 , Cdr 2 ,
Commander 3 , Cdr 3 ,
Commander 4 , Cdr 4 ,
Commander 5 , Cdr 5 ,
Commander 1 (mot.) , Cdr 1 (mot.) ,
Commander 2 (mot.) , Cdr 2 (mot.) ,
Commander 3 (mot.) , Cdr 3 (mot.) ,
Commander 4 (mot.) , Cdr 4 (mot.) ,
Commander 5 (mot.) , Cdr 5 (mot.) ,
Morane Cricket , Morane Cricket ,
Grumman Goose Gunship , Goose Gunship ,
B-26 Invader Direct Fire , Invader ,
H-21 , H-21 ,
H-21 Gunship , H-21 Gunship ,
Bell 47 , Bell 47 ,
Bell 47 Gunship , Bell 47 Gunship ,
Bell 47 AS10 , Bell 47 AS10 ,
H-34 , H-34 ,
H-34 Gunship , H-34 Pirate , Pirate
H-19 , H-19 ,
H-19 Gunship , H-19 Gunship ,
SA-313B Alouette II , SA-313B , Alouette II
SA-313B Alouette II Gunship , SA-313 "Gunship," Alouette II
SA-313B Alouette II SS11 , SA-313 SS11 , Alouette II SS11
Sa-321K Super Frelon , Sa-321K , Sa-321K Super Frelon
SA330 Puma , SA330 , Puma
SA330 Puma Gunship , SA330 "Gunship," Puma
SA341 Gazelle (ATGM) , SA341 (ATGM) , Gazelle
SA341 Gazelle Gunship , SA341 Gunship , Gazelle
AU-1 Fighter Aircraft , AU-1 , Corsair
Spitfire Mk IX Fighter Aircraft , Spitfire IX ,
P-63 Fighter Aircraft , P-63 , Kingcobra
F-8F Fighter Aircraft , F-8F , Bearcat
F-6F-5 Fighter Aircraft , F-6F-5 , Hellcat
B-26 Invader , Invader ,
Mystere IV , Mystere ,
Dassault Ouragan MD.450 , Ouragan ,
AU-1 Fighter Aircraft , AU-1 , Corsair
SBD Dive Bombers , SBD , Dauntless
SB2C Dive Bombers , SB2C , Helldiver
Mirage IIIC , Mirage ,
Super Mystere B2 , Super Mystere ,
Vautour IIB , Vautour ,


quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak
More thoughts to come. Jason, I have a fairly good collection of books and articles on the period, so please don't hesitate to ask anything you wish. Stefan (Legionaer) will correct me if I get anything wrong


Thank you, Paul!! Certainly is helpful information!!

Jason Petho



_____________________________

Petho Cartography

Mapping Military History

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 4
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 6:32:11 PM   
Jason Petho


Posts: 5432
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Status: online
Existing Vietnam (Communist)

PT-76B (Amph Lt. Tk) , PT-76B ,
Type 63 (Amph Lt. Tk) , Type 63 ,
T-34/85 , T-34/85 ,
T-54 , T-54 ,
Type 59 , Type 59 ,
T-55A , T-55A ,
M41 Bulldog , M41 ,
OT-54 Flame Tank , OT-54 Flame Tank ,
OT-55 Flame Tank , OT-55 Flame Tank ,
MTU-1 , MTU-1 ,
"Dozers," Dozers ,
AVLB , AVLB ,
Maintenance Recovery BTR , Maint Rec Pltn ,
Maintenance Recovery Prime , Maint Rec Pltn ,
SU-100 , SU-100 ,
ISU-122 , ISU-122 ,
GAZ-107 RR , GAZ-107 RR ,
M-13 132mm Rocket Launchers , VM BM-13-16 ,
K63 SPRL (107mm) , K63 SPRL ,
BM21 (122mm) , BM21 ,
BM14/17 (140mm) , BM14/17 ,
BTR-ZPU 14.5 SP AAMG , BTR-ZPU ,
BTR-50-ZPU 14.5 SP AAMG , BTR-50-ZPU ,
ZSU-57 , ZSU-57 ,
Type 63 SPAA , Type 63 SPAA ,
ZSU-23 Shilka , ZSU-23 ,
BTR-40P , BTR-40P ,
BRDM-1 , BRDM-1 ,
K63 APC , K63 APC ,
BTR-152K , BTR-152K ,
BTR-50PK , BTR-50PK ,
BTR-60PB , BTR-60PB ,
M113 APC , M113 , Green Dragon
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Light Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Medium Truck , Trucks ,
Artillery Tractors , Tractors ,
Artillery Tractors , Tractors ,
Wagons , Wagons ,
Wagons , Wagons ,
Wagons , Wagons ,
Wagons , Wagons ,
Bicycles , Bikes ,
Bicycles , Bikes ,
Bicycles , Bikes ,
Bicycles , Bikes ,
Boats , Boats ,
VC Boats , VC Boats ,
VC Sampans , VC Sampans ,
VC River Junk , VC River Junk ,
VC Mortar "Junks," VC Mtr "Junks,"
Civilian Boats , Civilian Boats ,
Sampans , Sampans ,
Junks , Junks ,
Patrol Craft , Patrol Craft ,
Patrol Missile Craft , Patrol Missile Craft ,
VM 50mm Mortars , VM 50mm Mtrs ,
VM 50mm Mortars , VM 50mm Mtrs ,
VM 60mm Mortars , VM 60mm Mtrs ,
VM 60mm Mortars , VM 60mm Mtrs ,
VC 50mm Mortars , VC 50mm Mtrs ,
VC 60mm Mortars , VC 60mm Mtrs ,
NVA 60mm Mortars , NVA 60mm Mtrs ,
VM 81mm Mortars , VM 81mm Mtrs ,
VM 81mm Mortars , VM 81mm Mtrs ,
VM 82mm Mortars , VM 82mm Mtrs ,
VM 82mm Mortars , VM 82mm Mtrs ,
VC 82mm Mortars , VC 82mm Mtrs ,
NVA 82mm Mortars , NVA 82mm Mtrs ,
107mm Mortars , 107mm Mtrs ,
M1943 120mm Mortars , 120mm Mtrs ,
VM 120mm Mortars , 120mm Mtrs ,
M53 160mm Mortar , 160mm Mtr ,
VC 57mm RR , VC 57mm RR ,
NVA 57mm RR , NVA 57mm RR ,
VC SPG9 73mm RR , VC 73mm RR ,
NVA SPG9 73mm RR , NVA 73mm RR ,
VM 75mm RR , VM 75mm RR ,
VC 75mm RR , VC 75mm RR ,
NVA 75mm RR , NVA 75mm RR ,
VC B-10 82mm RATG , VC 82mm RATG ,
NVA B-10 82mm RATG , NVA 82mm RATG ,
NVA B-11 107mm RATG , NVA 107mm RATG ,
M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzers , 75mm Pack How ,
75mm Pack Howitzers , 75mm Pack How ,
M1942 76mm (ZIS3) Gun , M1942 76mm Gun ,
D-44 M1945 85mm ATG , D44 85mm ATG ,
D10 100mm ATG , D10 100mm ATG ,
M1955 100mm Gun , M1955 100mm Gun ,
105mm Howitzers , 105mm How ,
M1937 122mm (A19) Gun , M1937 122mm Gun ,
D30 122mm Howitzer , D30 122mm How ,
M30 122mm Howitzer , M30 122mm How ,
M1955 122mm How , M1955 122mm How ,
M1946 130mm Gun , M1946 130mm Gun ,
M1943 152mm D1 How , D1 152mm How ,
M1937 152mm ML20 Howitzer , ML20 152mm How ,
VC 107mm Rockets , VC 107mm RL ,
107mm Rockets , 107mm RL ,
BM21 (122mm) , BM21 ,
BM14/16 (140mm) , BM14/16 ,
VC ZPU-4 AA (14.5mm) , VC 14.5mm AA ,
ZPU-4 AA (14.5mm) , 14.5mm AA ,
VC ZU-23 23mm AA -2 , VC 23mm AA -2 ,
ZU-23 23mm AA -2 , 23mm AA -2 ,
Type 55 37mm Anti-Aircraft Guns , Type 55 37mm AA Guns ,
Type 55 37mm Anti-Aircraft Guns , Type 55 37mm AA Guns ,
S-60 57mm AA , 57mm AA ,
SA-7 Strela AA Missile , SA-7 ,
SA-3 Goa AA Missile , SA-3 ,
AT-3 Sagger AT Missile , Sagger ATGM ,
VC RPG-7 Team , VC "RPG-7,"
VC RPG-2 Team , VC "RPG-2,"
NVA Rifle AK Platoon , NVA AK Rifle Pltn ,
NVA Sapper Platoon , NVA Sapper Pltn ,
NVA Recon Platoon , NVA Recon Pltn ,
NVA Recon Sapper Platoon , NVA Recon Sapper Pltn ,
NVA Swimmer Sapper Platoon , NVA Swimmer Sapper Pltn ,
NVA Marine AK Platoon , NVA/AK Marine Pltn ,
NVA Engineer Platoon , NVA Eng Pltn ,
NVA Medium Machinegun Section , NVA MMG Pltn ,
NVA Heavy Machinegun Section , NVA HMG Pltn ,
VC Main Force Rifle Platoon AK , VC MF AK Rifle Pltn ,
VC Main Force Recon Platoon AK , VC MF AK Recon Pltn ,
VC Main Force Sapper Platoon AK , VC MF AK Sapper Pltn ,
VC Main Force Swimmer Sapper Platoon AK , VC MF AK Swim Sap Pltn ,
VC Medium Machinegun Section , VC MMG Pltn ,
VC Heavy Machinegun Section , VC HMG Pltn ,
VC Local Force Rifle Platoon , VC LF Rifle Pltn ,
VC Local Force Sapper Platoon , VC LF Sapper Pltn ,
Civilian Infiltration Platoon , Civilian Infiltration Pltn ,
VC Anti-Aircraft Machinegun Platoon , VC AAMG Pltn ,
NVA Anti-Aircraft Machinegun Platoon , NVA AAMG Pltn ,
VM Sniper , VM Sniper ,
VC Sniper , VC Sniper ,
NVA Sniper , NVA Sniper ,
Civilians , Civilians ,
VM Local Guerilla (6 SP) , VM Du Kick , Du Kick
VM Local Guerilla (5 SP) , VM Du Kick , Du Kick
VM Local Guerilla (4 SP) , VM Du Kick , Du Kick
VM Local Guerilla (3 SP) , VM Du Kick , Du Kick
VM Local Guerilla (2 SP) , VM Du Kick , Du Kick
VM Militia (6 SP) , VM Tu V? , Tu V?
VM Militia (5 SP) , VM Tu V? , Tu V?
VM Militia (4 SP) , VM Tu V? , Tu V?
VM Militia (3 SP) , VM Tu V? , Tu V?
VC "Civilians," VC Civilians ,
VM "Civilians," VM Civilians ,
VM Rifle Platoon 48 (Civilian Arms 1) , VM Rifle 48(C1) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 48 (Civilian Arms 2) , VM Rifle 48(C2) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 48 (Japanese Arms) , VM Rifle 48(J) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 48 (U.S. Arms) , VM Rifle 48(US) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (U.S. Arms) , VM Rifle 50(US) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (U.S. Arms)(Green) , VM Rifle 50(US)(G) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (U.S. Arms)(Veteran) , VM Rifle 50(US)(V) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (Soviet Arms) , VM Rifle 50(S) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (Soviet Arms)(Green) , VM Rifle 50(S)(G) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 50 (Soviet Arms)(Veteran) , VM Rifle 50(S)(V) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (U.S. Arms) , VM Rifle 53(US) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (U.S. Arms)(Green) , VM Rifle 53(US)(G) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (U.S. Arms)(Veteran) , VM Rifle 53(US)(V) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (Soviet Arms) , VM Rifle 53(S) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (Soviet Arms) , VM Rifle 53(S)(G) ,
VM Rifle Platoon 53 (Soviet Arms) , VM Rifle 53(S)(V) ,
VM Anti-Aircraft Machinegun Platoon , VM AAMG Pltn ,
VM Medium Machinegun Platoon (US) , VM MMG Pltn (US) ,
VM Medium Machinegun Section (US) , VM MMG Sec. (US) ,
VM Medium Machinegun Platoon (Soviet) , VM MMG Pltn (S) ,
VM Medium Machinegun Section (Soviet) , VM MMG Sec. (S) ,
VM Bazooka Team , VM Bazooka Team ,
VM Engineer Platoon , VM Eng Pltn ,
NVA Rifle Platoon SKS , NVA SKS Rifle Pltn ,
NVA Sapper Platoon SKS , NVA SKS Sapper Pltn ,
NVA Recon Platoon SKS , NVA SKS Recon Pltn ,
NVA Recon Sapper SKS Platoon , NVA SKS Recon Sap Pltn ,
NVA Swimmer Sapper SKS Platoon , NVA SKS Swimmer Sap Pltn ,
NVA Marine Platoon SKS , NVA SKS Marine Pltn ,
NVA Engineer Platoon SKS , NVA SKS Eng Pltn ,
VC Main Force Rifle SKS Platoon , VC MF SKS Rifle Pltn ,
VC Main Force Recon SKS Platoon , VC MF SKS Recon Pltn ,
VC Main Force Sapper SKS Platoon , VC MF SKS Sapper Pltn ,
VC Main Force Swimmer SKS Sapper Platoon , VC MF SKS Swim Sap Pltn ,
VC Local Force Rifle Platoon AK , VC LF AK Rifle Pltn ,
VC Local Force Sapper Platoon AK , VC LF AK Sapper Pltn ,
VC Main Force Rifle Platoon , VC MF Rifle Pltn ,
VC Main Force Recon Platoon , VC MF Recon Pltn ,
VC Main Force Sapper Platoon , VC MF Sapper Pltn ,
VC Main Force Swimmer Sapper Platoon , VC MF Swimmer Sapper Pltn ,
VC Local Force Rifle Platoon SKS , VC LF SKS Rifle Pltn ,
VC Local Force Sapper Platoon SKS , VC LF SKS Sapper Pltn ,
Bridge Engineer Platoon , Bridge Eng Pltn ,
Engineer Mine Platoon , Eng Mine Pltn ,
Construction Engineer Platoon , Const Eng Pltn ,
VC Engineer Mine Platoon , VC Eng Mine Pltn ,
Suicide Assault Sapper , Suicide Sapper ,
Army HQ , Army HQ ,
Corps HQ , Corps HQ ,
Divisional HQ , Div HQ ,
NVA Divisional HQ (foot) , NVA Div HQ ,
VC Divisional HQ (foot) , VC Div HQ ,
VM Divisional HQ (foot) , VM Div HQ ,
Brigade HQ , Bde HQ ,
NVA Regimental HQ (foot) , NVA Rgt HQ (foot) ,
VC Regimental HQ (foot) , VC Rgt HQ (foot) ,
VM Regimental HQ (foot) , VM Rgt HQ (foot) ,
Regimental HQ (mot.) , Rgt HQ (mot.) ,
NVA Battalion HQ (foot) , NVA Btln HQ (foot) ,
VC Battalion HQ (foot) , VC Btln HQ (foot) ,
VM Battalion HQ (foot) , VM Btln HQ (foot) ,
Battalion HQ (mot.) , Btln HQ (mot.) ,
NVA Commander 1 , NVA Cdr 1 ,
NVA Commander 2 , NVA Cdr 2 ,
NVA Commander 3 , NVA Cdr 3 ,
NVA Commander 4 , NVA Cdr 4 ,
NVA Commander 5 , NVA Cdr 5 ,
VC Commander 1 , VC Cdr 1 ,
VC Commander 2 , VC Cdr 2 ,
VC Commander 3 , VC Cdr 3 ,
VC Commander 4 , VC Cdr 4 ,
VC Commander 5 , VC Cdr 5 ,
VM Commander 1 , VM Cdr 1 ,
VM Commander 2 , VM Cdr 2 ,
VM Commander 3 , VM Cdr 3 ,
VM Commander 4 , VM Cdr 4 ,
VM Commander 5 , VM Cdr 5 ,
Commander 1 (mot.) , Cdr 1 (mot.) ,
Commander 2 (mot.) , Cdr 2 (mot.) ,
Commander 3 (mot.) , Cdr 3 (mot.) ,
Commander 4 (mot.) , Cdr 4 (mot.) ,
Commander 5 (mot.) , Cdr 5 (mot.) ,
Mil Mi-1 Hare , Mil Mi-1 , Hare
Mil Mi-4 Hound , Mil Mi-4 , Hound
Mil Mi-8 Hip , Mil Mi-8 , Hip
Mig-15 , Mig-15 ,
Mig-17 , Mig-17 ,
Mig-19 , Mig-19 ,
Mig-21 , Mig-21 ,
Mig-23 , Mig-23 ,


_____________________________

Petho Cartography

Mapping Military History

(in reply to Jason Petho)
Post #: 5
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 7:24:00 PM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jason Petho



Hi Paul

Excellent list with lots of information, thank you.

The reference to existing graphics is helpful, as it is easier to modify than the create from scratch. I'll see if Mike has time to work on some of these. Mike?

Would you be terribly upset if you didn't receive all of the equipment in the first release?

Jason Petho




I would be prostrate with grief, Jason.

Would it be possible to simply beef up the armament and armour ratings on an existing JTCS landing craft as a temporary solution, without the need for new graphics ? For instance, the JTCS Landing Craft Mechanized carries two .50 MGs. If it was provided with three 20mm Oerlikons and increased armour, you would have a very acceptable interim LCM6! Obviously, the existing unit would be retained...the LCM6 wouldn't replace it, but be an additional unit.

If you do have to trim it down, can you include the Landing Ship Infantry Large (LSIL) which I didn't list in the first post. They carried a useful mortar battery. The LSIL and the LCM Monitor would be essential for indirect fire support. Along with those beefed up JTCS LCMs, we would have three vessels, and that would be enough to provide a nucleus.

The rest of the fleet can be made up from the various 'stock' landing craft that we will be getting anyway.

Landing Ship Infantry Large...

By the way, 'yes please' to your offer to include towed quad .50 mounts in the other thread. M24 Chaffee tanks too, please!


Regards

Paul

_____________________________


(in reply to Jason Petho)
Post #: 6
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 7:37:06 PM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline
Jason, those lists made me jump a little!

A Leclerc MBT ? At Dien Bien Phu ? Oh, how they must have wished !

Of course, you are constructing a single French OOB to cover everything from the 1950s to the present day. That didn't dawn on me at first.

_____________________________


(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 7
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/3/2009 9:40:58 PM   
Jason Petho


Posts: 5432
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak

Jason, those lists made me jump a little!

A Leclerc MBT ? At Dien Bien Phu ? Oh, how they must have wished !

Of course, you are constructing a single French OOB to cover everything from the 1950s to the present day. That didn't dawn on me at first.


Yes, that is correct, creating the French OOB that will also be a start for the NATO vs Warsaw Pact game in Volume II when we get to it. No sense creating the wheel twice, right?

Jason Petho



_____________________________

Petho Cartography

Mapping Military History

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 8
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/4/2009 11:16:34 AM   
Legionaer

 

Posts: 368
Joined: 6/8/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
Paul, great work here from you!!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Geomitrak

1) Yes, the Vietnamese Paras, (BPVN) should be included in the French OOB

Disagree, because the "south" vietnamese troops to this time were strong enough for an own nation folder. I will create them up to the next weekend. Than you should decide where they are better bedded .

Local Auxiliary Force
= http://members.lycos.co.uk/Indochine/cefeo/auxilia.html#top (without the catholic militias, they have their own platoon)

Local Irregulars
= guerrillas, counter-guerrillas, scouts

My origin intentions here were that hill tribes, if they do not helped the VM, often were terrorized by VM/VM guerrillas. So they were won for combat against the VM by the french. They were high moraled, hard fighters.

quote:

Am I right in assuming that one represents the locally-raised, and somewhat ineffectual, militias that attempted to defend villages, while the other represents guerilla forces raised from hill tribes and led by French officers and/or senior NCOs ( similar to the Montagnards and US Green Berets) ? The latter were very effective indeed !

Agree with Paul.

Stefan

_____________________________

I create and revise: Order of Battles, Table of Equipments, Weapon Values for Modern Wars (in work: DG Lebanon War ´82 -´85, DG First Indochina War ´48 -´54 and again CWE!)

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 9
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/4/2009 12:18:03 PM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline
Hi Stefan,

Are you creating a separate OOB for the French-era Vietnamese National Army ? If so, then I agree with you. The Vietnamese Paratroopers should go in that OOB and not the French one.

What do you think of the idea of the three boats for the Dinassauts ? If we can not have everything to start with, do you agree that those 3 types would be enough for now ?

Regards

Paul

_____________________________


(in reply to Legionaer)
Post #: 10
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/4/2009 3:22:48 PM   
Jason Petho


Posts: 5432
Joined: 6/22/2004
From: Calgary, AB, Canada
Status: online
Existing Pro West Vietnam (Country Slot 11) platoons:

M24 Chaffee , M24 ,
M41 Bulldog , M41 ,
HQ M113 APC , HQ M113 , Green Dragon
HQ M41 Bulldog , HQ M41 ,
HQ M48A3 Patton , HQ M48A3 ,
M3 Halftracks , M3 Halftracks ,
HQ M113 ACAV , HQ M113ACAV , Green Dragon
M3A1 Scout Car Section , M3A1 Scout Car Sec ,
M8 Armored Car Section , M8 Arm'd Car Sec ,
M8 HMC Self-Propelled 75mm Howitzers , M8 HMC Sec , Scott
M48A3 Patton , M48A3 ,
M48 Roller , M48 Roller ,
M132 Flamethrowers , M132 ,
Recon Jeeps , Recon Jeeps ,
106mm Recoilless Rifle Jeep , 106mm RR Jeep ,
M113 RR , M113 RR ,
M114 , M114 ,
V100 Commando Armoured Cars , V100 ,
M106 Self-Propelled "4.2""" mortar , M106 ,
M107 Self-Propelled 175mm Howitzer , M107 ,
M108 Self-Propelled 105mm Howitzer , M108 ,
M109 Self-Propelled 155mm Howitzer , M109 ,
M110 Self-Propelled 203mm Howitzer , M110 ,
M125 Self-Propelled 81mm mortar , M125 ,
M113 APC , M113 , Green Dragon
M113 ACAV , M113ACAV , Green Dragon
Jeeps , Jeeps ,
MG Trucks , MG Trucks ,
Heavy Trucks , Hvy Trucks ,
Medium Trucks , Mdm Trucks ,
Light Trucks , Lt Trucks ,
Prime Movers , Prime Movers ,
ONTOS SPMRR , ONTOS ,
DUKWs , DUKWs , Duck
M42 Duster , M42 ,
M163 Vulcan , M163 ,
M35A2/M55 SPAA , M35 Gun Truck ,
"Dozers," Dozers ,
AVLB , AVLB ,
Maintenance Recovery "M578," Maint Rec Pltn ,
Boats , Boats ,
Rafts , Rafts ,
Landing Craft Personnel , LCP ,
Landing Craft Vehicle Personnel , LCVP ,
Landing Craft Assault , LCA ,
Landing Craft Mechanized , LCM ,
Landing Craft Tank , LCT ,
LVTP5 , LVTP5 ,
River Patrol Boat , Monitor ,
60mm Mortars , 60mm Mtrs ,
81mm Mortars , 81mm Mtrs ,
4.2-inch Mortars , 4.2-in. Mtrs ,
57mm Recoilless Rifle , 57mm RR ,
75mm Recoilless Rifle , 75mm RR ,
90mm Recoilless Rifle , 90mm RR ,
106mm Recoilless Rifle , 106mm RR ,
105mm Howitzers , 105mm How ,
155mm Howitzers , 155mm How ,
175mm Howitzers , 175mm How ,
203mm Howitzers , 203mm How ,
M55 Quad Anti-Aircraft Machine Guns , Quad AAMG ,
40mm Anti-Aircraft Guns , 40mm AA Guns ,
Redeye SAM , Redeye SAM ,
Hawk SAM , Hawk SAM ,
Dragon Team , Dragon Team ,
4-inch Naval Guns , 4-in. Naval Guns ,
4.7-inch Naval Guns , 4.7-in. Naval Guns ,
5.25-inch Naval Guns , 5.25-in. Naval Guns ,
Marine Platoon , Marine Pltn ,
Airborne Platoon , Airborne Pltn ,
M16 Rifle Platoon , M16 Rifle Pltn ,
M1/14 Rifle Platoon , M1/14 Rifle Pltn ,
Ranger Platoon , Ranger Pltn ,
CIDG Platoon , CIDG Inf Pltn ,
Regional Forces Platoon , RF Pltn ,
National Police , Nat Police ,
Military Police , MP's ,
Popular Forces Platoon , PF Pltn ,
Mobile Strike Force Platoon , MIKE Pltn ,
Eagle Flight Platoon , EF Pltn ,
Special Forces Platoon , LLDB Pltn ,
Scout Platoon , Scout Pltn ,
Assault Platoon , Assault Pltn ,
Engineer Platoon , Eng Pltn ,
Bridge Engineer Platoon , Bridge Eng Pltn ,
Mine Platoon , Mine Inf Pltn ,
Construction Platoon , Construction Pltn ,
Cavalry Platoon , Cav Pltn ,
BAR Machinegun Section , BAR MG Sec ,
M60 Machinegun Section , M60 MG Sec ,
M2HB Machinegun Section , M2HB MG Sec ,
M60 Machinegun Platoon , M60 MG Pltn ,
Sniper , Sniper ,
Marine Platoon , Marine Pltn ,
Airborne Platoon , Airborne Pltn ,
Ranger Platoon , Ranger Pltn ,
Scout Platoon , Scout Pltn ,
Assault Platoon , Assault Pltn ,
Engineer Platoon , Eng Pltn ,
Cavalry Platoon , Cav Pltn ,
ROK Special Forces Platoon , ROK SF Pltn ,
ROK Rifle Platoon , ROK Rifle Pltn ,
ROK Marine Platoon , ROK Marine Pltn ,
Montenyard Scout Platoon , Montenyard Scout Pltn ,
civilians , civilians ,
Army HQ , Army HQ ,
Corps HQ , Corps HQ ,
Divisional HQ , Div HQ ,
Brigade HQ , Bde HQ ,
Regimental HQ (foot) , Rgt HQ (foot) ,
Regimental HQ (mot.) , Rgt HQ (mot.) ,
Regimental HQ (arm.) , Rgt HQ (mot.) ,
Battalion HQ (foot) , Btln HQ (foot) ,
Battalion HQ (mot.) , Btln HQ (mot) ,
Battalion HQ (arm.) , Btln HQ (mot) ,
Commander 1 , Cdr 1 ,
Commander 2 , Cdr 2 ,
Commander 3 , Cdr 3 ,
Commander 4 , Cdr 4 ,
Commander 5 , Cdr 5 ,
Commander 1 (mot.) , Cdr 1 (mot) ,
Commander 2 (mot.) , Cdr 2 (mot) ,
Commander 3 (mot.) , Cdr 3 (mot.) ,
Commander 4 (mot.) , Cdr 4 (mot.) ,
Commander 5 (mot.) , Cdr 5 (mot.) ,
A1 Skyraider , Skyraider ,
A26 Invader , Invader ,
A37 Dragonfly , Dragonfly ,
A7D Corsair , Corsair ,
F5 , F5 ,
F105D , F105D ,
UH-1H Iroquios , UH-1H , Iroquios
AC47 Gunship , AC47 Gunship ,
Birddog , Birddog ,
UH-1D Huey Recon , UH-1D Huey Recon ,
UH-1D Huey , UH-1D Huey ,
Chinooks , Chinooks ,
UH-1B Gunship , UH-1B Gunship ,
UH-1B Gunship "(Rockets)," UH-1B Gunship ,
A1 Skyraider , Skyraider ,


< Message edited by Jason Petho -- 5/4/2009 3:23:16 PM >


_____________________________

Petho Cartography

Mapping Military History

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 11
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/4/2009 8:44:34 PM   
Legionaer

 

Posts: 368
Joined: 6/8/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
Gents,

i think we´re on a good way. Have revised the platoon11 with units for the Armée Nationale Vietnamienne and will start work on the other structures.

Question: Should the following forces change into the vietnamese folder?

P08211 Catholic Militia Platoon
P08218 Local Auxiliary Force
P08219 Local Irregulars

These two i would use for Kambodian (Khmer), Thai or Laotian troops.

P08217 Auxiliary Light Infantry
P08249 Auxiliary Light Infantry

Any other ideas?

Stefan

_____________________________

I create and revise: Order of Battles, Table of Equipments, Weapon Values for Modern Wars (in work: DG Lebanon War ´82 -´85, DG First Indochina War ´48 -´54 and again CWE!)

(in reply to Jason Petho)
Post #: 12
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/9/2009 1:26:42 AM   
Geomitrak


Posts: 179
Joined: 6/11/2007
From: Cambridge, UK
Status: offline
Stefan, when you say Thai troops, do you mean Thai as in Thailand, or the hill tribe named Thai ? The hilltribe Thais must be included, of course. They were very important allies to the French.

Are other French Union troops such as Laotian and Cambodian only auxiliary grade troops ? I really must read up on their combat record again...you could be right !

Another thing; we should have the Consolidated PB4Y-2 Privateer included ? The French operated them in the bomber role.

Regards

Paul

_____________________________


(in reply to Legionaer)
Post #: 13
RE: French Indochina in Modern Wars - 5/9/2009 5:24:29 PM   
Legionaer

 

Posts: 368
Joined: 6/8/2007
From: Germany
Status: offline
quote:

Another thing; we should have the Consolidated PB4Y-2 Privateer included ? The French operated them in the bomber role.

You´re right Paul, it should be possible to play with them.

My first thoughts if i create the platoon08 were the hill tribes and the regular Thai troops in one. I really don´t know the best way to use them at all. Maybe they should get a better detailed structure.

quote:

Are other French Union troops such as Laotian and Cambodian only auxiliary grade troops ?

All troops are united under the french command, all raids or operations were led be the french, also the AVN campaigns! That´s what i find out.

If you have other results let me know.

Regards,
Stefan

_____________________________

I create and revise: Order of Battles, Table of Equipments, Weapon Values for Modern Wars (in work: DG Lebanon War ´82 -´85, DG First Indochina War ´48 -´54 and again CWE!)

(in reply to Geomitrak)
Post #: 14
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