Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Uncommon Valor: Campaign for the South Pacific covers the campaigns for New Guinea, New Britain, New Ireland and the Solomon chain.

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RGIJN
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Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

To prevent the other thread from more hijacking I created this one on the CF subject. Maybe even Matrix´ Staff will notice it that way. What would be fine.

Posted here is the response from Joel Billings (2by3 Games) when I privately asked for the progress of CF. It´s about three and a half months ago...



No, unfortunately we don't have a release date or even an estimated release
date on this project. Gary and I are focused now on our Eastern Front game,
while Mike Wood and Justin Prince (the developer for War Plan Orange) are
working on Carrier Force. If I have any info I'll be sure to post it on the
2by3 website in my developer's journal (although I admit I don't do that
very often). Thanks for your interest.

Joel Billings

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralf G." <Ralf-Gerhardt@gmx.de>
To: <2by3@2by3games.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 6:57 AM
Subject: Carrier Force


Hello,

since I am a member of the Matrix Games forum I closely track all the things
around CF development (also contributed to the "What would you like to see
in Carrier Force?" thread several times) and I am quite eager to the release
of this new game.
Is there any crude kind of a schedule when Carrier Force is about to be
released? Of course I´m not going to treat any date as certain, it´s just to
have an idea about.

Thank you very much in advance for your response,
Ralf Gerhardt


After all, this does not sound very encouraging...
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by kev_uk »

I dont think they (being Matrix not 2by3) should neglect UV - all they need to do really is update it with WitP standard patches? No? This surely cant be too hard. The one one thing which really sticks the Mk14 into both UV and WitP is the goddam AI - playing through the WitP Southern Pacific scenario and it really sucks eggs...which is why its just not worth playing the whole war vs AI. So in effect with a human its gonna be a real time war..more or less. I wish I could code in C++.

Kev
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

To prevent the other thread from more hijacking I created this one on the CF subject. Maybe even Matrix´ Staff will notice it that way. What would be fine.

Posted here is the response from Joel Billings (2by3 Games) when I privately asked for the progress of CF. It´s about three and a half months ago...



No, unfortunately we don't have a release date or even an estimated release
date on this project. Gary and I are focused now on our Eastern Front game,
while Mike Wood and Justin Prince (the developer for War Plan Orange) are
working on Carrier Force. If I have any info I'll be sure to post it on the
2by3 website in my developer's journal (although I admit I don't do that
very often). Thanks for your interest.

Joel Billings

----- Original Message -----
From: "Ralf G." <Ralf-Gerhardt@gmx.de>
To: <2by3@2by3games.com>
Sent: Wednesday, October 29, 2008 6:57 AM
Subject: Carrier Force


Hello,

since I am a member of the Matrix Games forum I closely track all the things
around CF development (also contributed to the "What would you like to see
in Carrier Force?" thread several times) and I am quite eager to the release
of this new game.
Is there any crude kind of a schedule when Carrier Force is about to be
released? Of course I´m not going to treat any date as certain, it´s just to
have an idea about.

Thank you very much in advance for your response,
Ralf Gerhardt


After all, this does not sound very encouraging...

The thing is this RGIJN. Grigsby and Billings are not the ones working on CF, this is not their project. Neither is WITP AE. they have ¨left the building¨ on these to say. If they were they would be done already.

It´s a dead project, and if it isn´t we´ll all be dead before it´s released.

Doubtful they even read the other thread on CF or will read this one unless someone PM them about it. [8|]
¨If you tremble with indignation at every injustice, then you are a comrade of mine.¨ Che Guevara

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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

I dont think they (being Matrix not 2by3) should neglect UV - all they need to do really is update it with WitP standard patches? No?

This is what I was wanting (And others I think.) The UV given all the WITP features. Not fighting the battles out in a tactical mode.

If you want to do that you can order Fighting Steel for $14.99 from NWS today.

Fighting Steel

¨If you tremble with indignation at every injustice, then you are a comrade of mine.¨ Che Guevara

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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by kev_uk »

ORIGINAL: Ike99
I dont think they (being Matrix not 2by3) should neglect UV - all they need to do really is update it with WitP standard patches? No?

This is what I was wanting (And others I think.) The UV given all the WITP features. Not fighting the battles out in a tactical mode.

If you want to do that you can order Fighting Steel for $14.99 from NWS today.

Fighting Steel


Yeah, and if they just gave the AI some more check routines - would be nicer :)

Yes I have seen and played Fighting Steel - brought it when it came out, was it 99? Good good game...

I like the strategic element of UV - I have Carriers at War to play for the Carrier battles...dont want that - just an updated UV please (please?!?)

Kev
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by borner »

this came up a while back when talking about adjustments to the F4U strength. Matrix pretty much said UV is at the end of it's line, and CF would address things from there..... now CF is going nowhere.
&nbsp;
thanks for the link IKE, I may have to look at a couple of those.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

ORIGINAL: Ike99
The thing is this RGIJN. Grigsby and Billings are not the ones working on CF, this is not their project. Neither is WITP AE. they have ¨left the building¨ on these to say. If they were they would be done already.

Yeah I know that they don´t do this game. But as I got it, they are the heads of their Company (2by3 games) and they should at least know what is going on with all the projects running. Or aren´t they talking to each other?

But may be you´re right, and CF is dead longe since.
ORIGINAL: Ike99
Doubtful they even read the other thread on CF or will read this one unless someone PM them about it.

what a disregard it would be... But still possible in the times we have. Will email Matrix games now!
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

ORIGINAL: Ike99




If you want to do that you can order Fighting Steel for $14.99 from NWS today.

Fighting Steel


Too, thanks for the link.

I even played the predecessor - Burning Steel (SSI). It was released 1994. Still the most exciting wargame (before and aside from UV) is QQPs "Battles of the South Pacific" for me, also from this timeframe.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

Matrix staff replied very quickly...:


Hi
Unfortunately we don't get much info on games in development. Your best bet is to check on the forums because the developers monitor them.


[--- UPDATED: 2/12/2009 12:48:15 AM BY AGENT: Daniel Heath ---]



So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Puhis »

ORIGINAL: RGIJN

Matrix staff replied very quickly...:


Hi
Unfortunately we don't get much info on games in development. Your best bet is to check on the forums because the developers monitor them.


[--- UPDATED: 2/12/2009 12:48:15 AM BY AGENT: Daniel Heath ---]



So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!

So be nice boys, or else you can't play!
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

Your best bet is to check on the forums because the developers monitor them.

Yes, check the forums for what the developers say, all 2 post from a year ago [8|]

I`ve seen this type of thing before on the ¨For Liberty¨ forum.

Dead project.
It is a shame that Hussar Games has decided not to respond to players issues. I think that this is a fine game; however, due to their lack of response, I cannot get my friends interested in buying the game.

Regards,
Mark
Yes, this is disgraceful. I had left this board for nearly six months now and when I return I still see no answers to basic questions.

That will be my last "Hussar" game.
Hussar games not only does not respond to issues raised on this forum, they use the same misbegotten supply system in Napoleon in Italy. The game system has potential, but needs improvement. Fool me, once....

How familiar.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

ORIGINAL: RGIJN

Matrix staff replied very quickly...:


Hi
Unfortunately we don't get much info on games in development. Your best bet is to check on the forums because the developers monitor them.


[--- UPDATED: 2/12/2009 12:48:15 AM BY AGENT: Daniel Heath ---]


So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!
So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!

No we are not.
So be nice boys, or else you can't play!

Play what? There is nothing to play. David Heath is part of Matrix and Matrix is a game publisher, not a game developer. They just sell the games, not make them.

And if the CF developers are ¨monitoring¨ the forum why was their last post a year ago?...From a total of two. Why have they not been here to defend CF and say it is a active project?

Hmmmm...

Maybe because they don´t monitor the forum or because it´s not an active project, or more than likely, both.

Why is Carrier Force not in the [Coming Soon and In Development] section on Matrix Forum?

If you look on my and borners AAR we had problems with a vanishing Japanese regiment, a bug, something the developers of Carrier Force would be interested in because they will share some of the same engine from my understanding. Well, at least a person would think so.

I sent a PM to the ¨developers¨ offering the save. No reply for a week. Now if you go look on the AAR you will see neither Mike Wood or Justin Prince posted any expressed interest about it. Only jwilkerson, project lead for AE expressed any interest.
jwilkerson-In WITP we found "disappearing unit" and "teleporting unit" bugs that were related to fragments which had supposedly been deactivated (removed from the map) getting reconnected to actual active units (even ones from the other side), thus causing strange behavior. Did either side have a fragment in that hex recently?

I'm guessing the only way to fix this is for you to go down there and at least pull some fragments out - that still might not bring the whole unit back. If you absolutely want the whole unit back - you may need a "truce" while you go down, pick it up and bring it back to Rabaul.

Ah - is this a MOD? If so looking at the editor files might be worth while. Like any chance there are duplicate units in there??

Carrier force is D-E-A-D or may as well be.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

ORIGINAL: Ike99
ORIGINAL: RGIJN

Matrix staff replied very quickly...:


Hi
Unfortunately we don't get much info on games in development. Your best bet is to check on the forums because the developers monitor them.


[--- UPDATED: 2/12/2009 12:48:15 AM BY AGENT: Daniel Heath ---]


So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!
So guys, we´re being monitored from the CF developers crew...!

No we are not.

of course we aren´t...! It was meant rather ironic... [X(]
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by RGIJN »

ORIGINAL: Ike99


Carrier force is D-E-A-D or may as well be.
Image


Even then, even more so then, we could at least expect some kind of response. Saying it is dead or it is (still) alive. But nothing. It´s a kick in the teeth to all the (future) customers and -above all- all the faithful members that contributed to Mr. Prince´s ill-fated thread. To say nothing says a lot.

Maybe I am too bona fide, okay.

But my confidence has got a decent punch. [:(]
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by kev_uk »

I gather that CF is still in the works; I think, by going on recent threads, that there is still interest in the game. I like how UV sticks in my mind more so than WitP, because when it was released in 2002? it was *new*, a new genre, or rather style and a new game for Grigsby. Fond memories. And its easier than WitP ;-)

Kev
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

I gather that CF is still in the works;

Don´t hold your breath.
Vaporware is a term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar product.

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In other cases, vaporware may be announced by companies in order to damage the development or marketability of more real products by competitors, sometimes in combination with a campaign of fear, uncertainty and doubt; if customers believe the hype, they may put off purchasing the real product to wait for its vaporous rival to mature.

Many companies announce vaporware in order to prove that their R&D departments are still full of new ideas. One subtle variation of this strategy is to remove a planned feature of a forthcoming product.

Sometimes vaporware is the result of over-optimism, and may actually materialize after a long waiting time (sometimes years).

One of the most infamous pieces of vaporware is Duke Nukem Forever, which was originally scheduled for release in 1997, but is still under development as of February 2009.

Lack of focus

By trying to do everything within a single product, the end result may be one that fails to do anything properly at all. By forgetting the initial purpose of a new software and trying to add more and more features, each individual feature gets less production resources invested.

An added risk to this approach is increased software instability, as rapidly growing software can generate increased amounts of unforeseen bugs, glitches, security holes and other problems that can sometimes go unnoticed for weeks and months. These bugs may indeed never get fixed at all, the patches required to address the issues themselves becoming new vaporware items.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Chad Harrison »

ORIGINAL: Ike99

It´s a dead project, and if it isn´t we´ll all be dead before it´s released.

I better go and tell my fellow CF Beta Testers that CF is dead because Ike99 said so . . .

Which is a shame, becuase Justin and Mike are working on amazing game.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

RGIJN-But may be you´re right, and CF is dead longe since.

what a disregard it would be... But still possible in the times we have.

If you go look at the original information on Carrier force you will find this...
Mike Wood-Hello...

Carrier Force [UV Deluxe] would offer the player the chance to control land, sea and air forces over a period of weeks or months in the South Pacific.

Carrier Strike would offer the player the chance to play carrier battles lasting several days, across the Pacific, over a period of years, with role playing aspects.

Scale would be 30 miles hex for Carrier Force, 15 mile hex for Carrier Strike. Combat systems and flight operations systems quite similar.

Different objectives and scope.

Bye...

Michael Wood
Joel Billings-We're hoping for the UV carrier game to be done (probably 9 months to a year later, but that's just a guess)first half of 2007 and the carrier strike game will follow after that .

Carrier Force was/has obviously been dropped because they went on to make the American Civil war game ¨Gary Grigsby's War Between the States¨ and now I think they are working on a Russian Front game.

Carrier Force is Vaporware.


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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Ike99 »

I better go and tell my fellow CF Beta Testers that CF is dead because Ike99 said so . . .

Which is a shame, becuase Justin and Mike are working on amazing game.

Yes go tell them I said it´s vaporware and you have nothing to show after 2 years and do not even monitor the forums or respond to customer feedback.

We´ll remember that when you come asking for our $50.
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RE: Carrier Force - Matrix Games

Post by Chad Harrison »

ORIGINAL: Ike99
I better go and tell my fellow CF Beta Testers that CF is dead because Ike99 said so . . .

Which is a shame, becuase Justin and Mike are working on amazing game.

Yes go tell them I said it´s vaporware and you have nothing to show after 2 years and do not even monitor the forums or respond to customer feedback.

We´ll remember that when you come asking for our $50.

Just because you havnt seen it doesnt mean there is nothing to show.

As a beta tester, its certainly not my call on whether or not its time to post screenshots, or an AAR, or even field specific questions regarding CF; remember, *all* closed beta testers are always under a NDA (Non Disclosure Agreement).

My purpose in posting here was to let the other posters know that CF is not dead. Yes the process has been long. While you all have been waiting, anxiously no doubt, we have been alpha/beta testing for some time now. But that comes with the territory of having a primary development team of only a few people. And rember, this is not an graphic overhaul, OOB and TO&E mod similar to WPO. This is adding new code and gameplay features way beyond the original scope and structure of UV. In other words, from a development point of view, its not easy.

With the NDA, obviously I may have said too much already, but I just wanted to attempt to be one calming voice here.

Cut them some slack. CF has not been forgotten.

Hope this helps.

Chad
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