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RE: BANZAI! - 7/25/2009 3:59:37 AM   
n01487477


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hornblower

Ny59 (Gerris Wilkinson) has done none of that.


For a second or two, I thought "who the hell is that?" Still you guys probably have no idea who wears shirt no. 10 at Fulham FC

--Damian--

[edit]Actually, even Football (soccer) fans would have trouble with this one ...

< Message edited by n01487477 -- 7/25/2009 4:01:50 AM >

(in reply to Hornblower)
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RE: BANZAI! - 7/25/2009 4:03:10 AM   
Nemo121


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Hornblower,

Oh I don't think itsjustme was calling ny59 a jackass. He just doesn't have the integrity to PM me and call me one to my face OR the maturity to realise that two intelligent and sane people can disagree on something without stooping to vituperative name-calling two years down the road. I don't have a problem with him calling me names if that makes him feel better ( although I'd prefer if he'd have the integrity to be open about it ) but I do think it is selfish and non-constructive for him to hijack this thread to do so. I think it is also in breach of Matrix's terms of use and membership of the forums. 

Again, itsjustme, if you have a problem then PM me ( I'm perfectly happy to discuss things with you if you try to do so in a mature, adult manner ) and quit hijacking someone else's thread. As far as I'm concerned we interpreted a home rule differently, things got heated and the game ended. Its a pity, I wish things hadn't gone that way BUT it was 2 years ago, move on. Life's too short to hold a grudge that long.... and most assuredly a thread on someone's else's game isn't the place to prosecute your little personal vendetta.


ny59,
Just to be clear... I'm perfectly satisfied that you could exceed the HR limit unintentionally. My point is simply that the best way to proceed is to replay the turn with the same orders except those which require changing in order to end up with no more than 450 planes per hex.

That solves their issue ( and shouldn't really result in a majorly different outcome  as their force is far too weak for what they are doing ) and allows the game to proceed from a mutually agreeable basis.

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RE: BANZAI! - 7/25/2009 4:04:27 AM   
Nemo121


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Damian,

Fullham HAS strikers? Amazing, I'd never have guessed it from their results

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Re-Do - 7/25/2009 12:42:28 PM   
ny59giants_MatrixForum


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Gentlemen,

I waited till after 11pm my time to call John (free cell minutes after 9pm his time ) to confer on this matter. I'm filling in for John and Brad is off to the Bahamas for a short vacation with his wife until late Sunday night. I take full responsibility of not knowing what the HR are (just send out an email asking for a copy of them). He told me to do the Re-Do and I completed it this morning. I had not recieved word from our opponents on the matter, but did so anyways.

Admiral Benoit (I'm not Gerris Wilkinson!)

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RE: Re-Do - 7/25/2009 1:27:12 PM   
itsjustme

 

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Not sure what Nemo is so defensive about.  I was simply agreeing with him that house rules are inviolate.

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RE: Re-Do - 7/25/2009 5:37:21 PM   
flaggelant


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i'd say lets see that replay then!!



just some questions;

What cap lvl were you guys running?
was it 50 %??

And; 

is that gonna change when you move KB into two hexes?

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Post #: 1326
RE: Re-Do - 7/26/2009 1:28:38 AM   
John 3rd


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Michael and I chatted and he did redo the turn.  It was my fault because I didn't even THINK about the HR due to basically particpating in the campaign by remote viewing!  As soon as Michael told me I went---OOOOOOPPPPSSS---so we redid the turn.  It is only right to do so!

We'll still sink them ANYWAY!

BANZAI!!!

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RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 1:45:37 AM   
Q-Ball


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Wow, go away for a few days of R and R, and alot happens!

Still catching up, I don't believe 500K in supplies in Bombay for a second. I bet it's closer to 5K. In 3 months of bombing, how many airbase supply hits have we scored? I haven't kept track, but has to be at least 100.

They're bluffing big time. I bet that place is closer to 5K. Don't blame them for trying though.

And BTW, we did break a HR and should re-do....but for the record, sortieing with 2 CVs against what they knew to be basically the entire IJN is not very wise, and should be punished.

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RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 3:04:53 AM   
Q-Ball


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Combat Repot, Sept 22, 1942

After an appropriate redo due to a HR violation on our side, the real turn happened. Despite the IJN being split into 2 hexes, a nicely coordinated strike on our side succeeded in penetrating the USN Cap and inflicting real damage. Although we lost quite a few Zeros, this is certainly an IJN Victory. Michael did a nice job positioning the IJN to lurk in waters near Cold Bay. The USN obliged by making a move. I personally expected a move toward Cold Bay, because they are strategically tethered to the troops there, I just didn't think it would be with 2 CVs, and as early as they did. I normally don't like Combat Reports, but I'll post this one:

Day Air attack on TF at 110,35

Japanese aircraftStrike launched from 2 hexes, but perfect coordination
A6M2 Zero x 142
D3A Val x 59
B5N Kate x 229

Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 78

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 47 destroyed, 6 damaged
D3A Val: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged
B5N Kate: 8 destroyed, 42 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
F4F-4 Wildcat: 73 destroyed

Allied Ships
CV Saratoga, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 8, on fire, heavy damage
CL Helena, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 7, on fire, heavy damage
CLAA Atlanta, Bomb hits 2, Torpedo hits 1, on fire
DD Anderson
CA Northampton, Torpedo hits 4, on fire, heavy damage
CL St. Louis
DD Mahan, Bomb hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
DD Cushing
CA Portland, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
DD Fanning

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 110,35

Japanese aircraftSecond strike, much smaller, but little resistance
A6M2 Zero x 30
D3A Val x 17
B5N Kate x 41

Allied aircraft
F4F-4 Wildcat x 2

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
D3A Val: 1 destroyed, 6 damaged
B5N Kate: 1 destroyed, 3 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
F4F-4 Wildcat: 2 destroyed

Allied Ships
DD Mahan, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
CA Northampton, Bomb hits 3, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
CL Helena, on fire, heavy damage
CA Portland, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
CLAA Atlanta, Bomb hits 2, on fire


The USN did get off a strike, but they did no damage at all.

Saratoga, Northampton, and Helena were reported SUNK after this day.

We'll see what the next move is on their side, but they may abandon the troops on Cold Bay. As we foresaw earlier, their choice remains the same: Take on KB, or abandon 40K troops. I think now they will choose the latter, as painful as that probably is. If we can capture them, auto victory is in reach. They should be an easy bag once the weather turns to winter up there.

< Message edited by Q-Ball -- 7/27/2009 5:33:25 PM >


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RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 6:35:12 PM   
John 3rd


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I was going to do a Fuchida Report but Brad beat me to the punch.

Considering the fact that the Fleet IS in two hexes I could not believe the well done (much practice evidently) running rendezvous of the Strike Aircraft!  WISH we could have taken Wasp as well but this is a very nice result.  We sink Saratoga, CA Northampton, and CL Helena and cripple CA Portland and DD Mahan with some damage to CLAA Atlanta too...

NICE. 

The Americans did make a different move by only coming out 2 hexes from Kodiak instead of 6 like the original turn.  The range of 5 fixed it so the Americans couldn't launch a strike at us while we weren't able to launch an afternoon assault.  Should be noted that all of Saratoga's SBDs went down with her.  She did not have any Avengers and carried an extra Squadron of Wildcats.  Interesting choice...

Admiral Benoit is moving one hex closer to Kodiak (Range 6) to pick off any cripples and nail anything remaining out of LBA CAP there.  Also provides the opportunity to send in a strong STF of the 4 BC if wanted.  We discussed--pending on the next turn--a speed run NE into the Gulf of Alaska to nail any shipping there before it can run away.  Will have to see what happens...

Japanese LBA Zeros and Bettys have their range extended to 11 so they reach within one hex of Kodiak.

Sunk US CVs:  Lexington, Saratoga, and one Yorktown-Class
Remaining US CVs:  Wasp and 2 Yorktowns

We have 8 CV and 4 CVL! 

Plane losses were more serious with our Zeros losing 48 planes (33 pilots) but our bombers were hardly touched.  That is a good thing.  The exchange of 48 Zero for 75 Wildcats is REALLY nice for this time in the war! 

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(in reply to Q-Ball)
Post #: 1330
RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 6:40:47 PM   
John 3rd


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Michael and I gabbed last night that we will have to possibility of landing 2 Brigades, 1 Inf Division, and a Corps HQ at Cold Bay within the next few weeks.  Since roughly 15,000 supply is unloading now and another 20,000 will begin unloading pretty soon, the supply situation looks excellent too...  Figure a recapture of the base sometime in late-October/November.

Brad has a Deliberate Attack going into Bombay next turn.  We'll see if the Forts keep coming down.

A Vietnamese Infantry Division and a new Infantry brigade (reinforcement coming) will probably provide enough PUNCH to finish off the defenders of Manila and Bataan.

These three developments make the chances of auto-victory look excellent!


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RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 7:14:25 PM   
Q-Ball


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Interesting thing is that the last turn itself did hardly anything for the VP situation. Remember, we have to outscore 4 to 1 just to avoid losing ground; we sank 400 VPs worth of ships, and 124 planes, but lost 76 planes in return. That's what makes autovictory so hard to project.

But John is right, we probably need to capture a pocket of Allied troops, do so and Victory is ours. What the Battle of the Aleutians DID do is probably ensure that we can keep controlling the water and air around Cold Bay, which should seal the fate of the 40K US troops there.

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RE: Re-Do - 7/27/2009 8:48:10 PM   
Canoerebel


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I think auto-victory is interesting - you identified the challenge at the outset of the game (invade India and try for auto-victory); drafted a plan to try to achieve your objectives; tweaked the plan as needs and opportunities arose and circumstances changed; and now have a shot at it. I don't wish bad things for any Allied player, but my hat's off to you guys.

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RE: BANZAI! - 7/29/2009 5:03:29 PM   
Q-Ball


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Sept 24 Combat Report

I hope folks are still reading this in between AE turns, but for us, WITP continues.

Some minor stuff in the last couple days summarized, but after that action in the Aleutians, what next up there?

Australia
In the first real action in Australia in awhile, a small Aussie cruiser TF hit Exmouth, tangling with a TF of 5 Wakatake-class DDs. I expected to lose that night battle, but in return for medium damage to a DD, we seriously damaged DD Arunta. We saw the TF coming, but our Sallys managed Zero hits during the day against the retreating ships. Liberator IIIs began to pound the base, I now have Tojos and Tonys there which should put a stop to that. I think this is just a raid.

Bombay
Another attack on Bombay failed to drop the forts at all. I have been attacking once a week, but I need to slow the pace and allow units to recover more before giving it another try. We'll get there, just need to tap the breaks a bit. Forts currently sit at 5.

Aleutians
It's been quiet while we unload supplies at Cold Bay and Umnak, and Michael sent back Car Div 1 to replenish Zero losses from the last battle (at this point, we agree that we can afford to do that, still maintaining 4 CV, 2 Junyo CVs, and 5 CVLs on station, vs. 3 USN CVs). The rest of KB hovers off Cold Bay.

So, what next for the USN in the Aleutians? They have already lost Saratoga, California, and 2 cruisers, along with a bunch of transports. 40K Allied troops are stranded on Cold Bay, while Zeros circle overhead and Japanese AKs peacefully unload sake at the pier. At this point they have two choices: Give up on Cold Bay and write those troops off, OR, commit more ships/planes/troops to attempt to finish the job.

With 14 TFs and all that CAP at Kodiak, I think it's safe to say that's the whole USN at Kodiak still. If they were giving up on Cold Bay, they would have left by now; they did pull everyone back temporarily, but that was because they feared a strike on Kodiak. They probably now feel we aren't going to test the CAP there, so the moved everyone back. This to me confirms that they are making choice B: Another attempt to land troops and supplies at Cold Bay.

Time is on our side, as it is now 5 weeks before winter conditions hit. They have to come to US to make it happen there. At this point, I hope they attempt something before winter. If I am them, I might wait for the first week of November, hoping I can get there unmolested by IJNAF, because they do have superiority in BBs.



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RE: Re-Do - 7/29/2009 5:06:37 PM   
John 3rd


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Hey Dan!

It is amazing that Brad and I's initial strategy actually worked.  with your comments that we had a strategic goal, shaped our tactics to accomodate that goal, took advantage of opportunities, and have seen it through to the point of auto-victory.  For me the biggest turning points and/or events within the campaign were:

1.  New Zealand--The taking of New Zealand was NEVER planned.  The operation was cooked up as a diversion and a nuisance to the Allies.  When there was NO reaction to the landing, we were able to 'improvise' moving enough troops into the area to take the country.  Gained a BUNCH of VP for next to no cost.  This was really big from my point-of-view.

2.  Aleutians--My decision to airlift troops into the EMPTY Cold Bay hex truly paid off handsomely.  If one remembers the base was empty and I was trying to load supplies OFF of the port when the Allies were spotted moving towards the base.  I think I got 2-3 days to fly in troops (thank goodness for Tinas and their range!) and they managed to BARELY hold off the initial attack.  OUR decision then to use the base as a sinkhole for the Americans has really worked.

To me these are the two best examples of showing a certain flexibility while the campaign has raged.

When you add the easy CV Victory above Palmyra and the sinking of the Royal Navy CVs off of Bombay life looks pretty good for Japan at this point.

Thanks for the summary and thoughts Dan.  Haven't really looked BACKWARD over the AAR yet.  Brad's recent comments regarding the difficulty of 4-1 and maintaining our advantage truly shows how difficult that is...


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(in reply to Canoerebel)
Post #: 1335
RE: Re-Do - 7/29/2009 8:50:33 PM   
ny59giants_MatrixForum


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Aleutians

Cold Bay: I have the first re-supply convoy of AKs finishing up this turn and will head for Dutch Harbor before going back to Japan. A larger re-supply convoy of 20k is at Dutch Harbor ready to move in. The port is at 53% towards level 2 which will speed up the unloading process. A chutai of Dinah is based here to keep a close eye on Kodiak. Forts remain at 5. Supply is over 11k.

Dutch Harbor:  Our damaged MLs are slowly pumping out the water and may just survive.  We are out of fuel, but 44k is at Adak and will be here in a few days. Two chutai of Emily are doing naval search while a Jake is doing ASW search. The Americans subs are out in forces.

Umnak Island: The Naval LBA is here in force with total aircraft around 300 (AF 6). Army LBA is on brief R&R at Adak except for a sentai of fighters. The daily bombing runs of LB to Cold Bay has stopped for the moment with Zero, Nell, and Betty set for range 11 (1 less than Kodiak) to catch any shipping headed west towards Cold Bay. A large TF of AKs is unloading 25k worth of supplies at a size 1 port. A Command HQ and Army HQ are both prepping for Cold Bay. Forts at 3 and climbing. Base supply over 20k and will be over 40k when AKs finish unloading.

Adak: This is now my main supply/fuel base.  Supply is over 23k and fuel is over 100k. Port at size 3 and expanding to a 4 before increasing the AF from a 4 to 5. Small and medium APs are here for possible use to reinforce Cold Bay. Multiple ASW TFs are based here with more to come in the next few days. CV Akagi and Kaga along with CVL Zuiho will arrive tomorrow to replace pilots/planes (short 21 total).

Armchitka: A small TF of AKs is unloading to bring supplies above 20k. This base is for my transport planes (48 Tabby) and reserve aircraft. The Tina's have headed home for much needed R&R and/or I&I.

Attu: Truly the backwaters.

KB: The rest of the carriers are here with all but 1 AO, an ASW TF, and SCTF. They remain between Cold Bay and Kodiak to the south, but close enough to let the Allies know that reinforcing Cold Bay will be costly.

Overall: This area is now much more secure than when I took over for John about 1 1/2 months ago, game wise.

(in reply to John 3rd)
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The Great White North - 7/30/2009 6:02:42 PM   
John 3rd


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The Aleutians were unsecure ten game weeks ago in a PURPOSEFUL effort by me to LURE the evil American villians into this perfect trap! 

I would never, EVER over-expand and leave a whole chain of islands vulnerable to attack.  Why---that--would--be---foolish!!! 

I doth protest my innocence... 

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RE: The Great White North - 7/30/2009 6:03:53 PM   
John 3rd


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Michael:

When is my next counseling session?  I think I just lost whatever touch I maintain on reality with that last post!

John


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RE: The Great White North - 7/31/2009 2:07:50 AM   
Hornblower


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I'm glad you gents opted to re-do the turn.  Seemed the right thing to do..  But i agree the situation from the allied side may be to far gone to save...

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RE: The Great White North - 7/31/2009 6:07:58 PM   
John 3rd


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Hornblower--It was the right thing to do.  Simple mistake on our part and it got corrected.

We had a very BORING turn just go through.  No real news there at all.


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RE: The Great White North - 7/31/2009 7:52:54 PM   
flaggelant


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i dislike boring turns .. they're so .. boring?

how about a raid at pearl? that should create some excitement


Is there any sign of CAP over there (i believe there was some recon on pearl after KB went up north from Palmyra, maybe do so again to probe the CAP?) with the lot of Land based cap covering the long planned allied offensive up North there might be a little hole in their fighter line, giving space for some easy VP's?


or if you expect it to be heavily capped, maybe fake a raid (or just fake the move), to simulate a opening in your lines towards Coldbay (which would be just what the allies are waiting for to reinforce, or evacuate their forces there) to finish off more of the American fleet over there.



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RE: The Great White North - 8/2/2009 6:31:48 PM   
Q-Ball


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Sept 26th Combat Report

The only incident of note this turn is action over Exmouth, and a potential invasion.

A couple days ago, Liberators from Geraldton hit the base, and a small surface TF attempted to bombard the airstrip; they tangled with our TF of Wakatake class DDs inconclusively, and didn't do much damage.

Today, the Liberators came back, but were greeted by a CAP of 45 Japanese Fighters: Tojo, Tony, Zero, losing 15 bombers and another 25 or so were reported damaged.

A TF of APs appeared 8 hexes from Exmouth, probably an invasion force.

With the bomber losses yesterday, it will probably be apparent to them that they can't shut down the airstrip. Given that, they will probably bail on the invasion, but just in case, we have 100 Bettys now at Broome, and will shuttle tommorow to Exmouth if they keep coming.

Other than that, still very quiet.........USN still parked at Kodiak though

< Message edited by Q-Ball -- 8/5/2009 5:26:16 PM >


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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 5:27:48 PM   
Q-Ball


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Combat Report, Sept 27 1942

This game is moving slow, but still moving. Do we still have loyal readers?

EXMOUTH:
Another raid today, this one much smaller and doing less damage; I think their Liberators are at really poor morale, and are not effective. The damage at Exmouth is 100% repaired, and the AP TF we saw has disappeared; I think they were going to invade, but once they failed to shut the base down, realized that they can't without CV or P-38 support, and they have neither.

ALEUTIANS:
Only item of note: The large number of TF's at Kodiak are gone. We'll give it a day to see if that's just bad weather, but it looks like the USN has withdrawn. They see KB loitering around Cold Bay while we peacefully unload transports, so they may be scared off after losing Saratoga. If that's the case, we should be able to destroy the troops at Cold bay.

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 7:09:02 PM   
Canoerebel


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Of course!

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 7:36:03 PM   
Q-Ball


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OK, just checking! The AE forum is awful busy, wondering if everyone is over there. Sort of a limbo though, because I won't start an AE PBEM until a patch or two is out.

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 7:37:34 PM   
Canoerebel


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I'm in the same boat.

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 7:58:18 PM   
Coach Z

 

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I'm still reading....whenever anyone posts!

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 8:46:12 PM   
USSAmerica


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I'm subscribed. 

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/5/2009 11:19:39 PM   
Hornblower


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i'm lurking about..

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RE: BANZAI! - 8/6/2009 12:17:41 AM   
vettim89


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

OK, just checking! The AE forum is awful busy, wondering if everyone is over there. Sort of a limbo though, because I won't start an AE PBEM until a patch or two is out.


A. I'm here

and

B. Could not agree more about that point.

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