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Construction Battallions and Minesweepers

 
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Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 11:52:51 AM   
undercovergeek

 

Posts: 1455
Joined: 11/21/2006
From: UK
Status: offline 		More questions that never occurred to me in a PBEM but do now against the AI!!!

Anyway, i see 3 types of Construction groups - General, Airfield and Naval. I have looked at the TOE for these groups and it all seems pretty similar - if i send a Naval construction team to a damaged port do they repair it faster than a general one, or do they use less supplies, and if i sent the airfield team and the airfield was undamaged would they not touch the damaged port at all?

In a previous post i received some good advice about shifting minesweepers in a transport TF instead of a MSW TF - however, will these fellas still sweep if its a transport TF? i dont want to send in a bombard TF with the minesweepers only for them under transport orders to just cruise the harbour watching the fireworks, and knowing my luck setting off all the mines!!!!

any help, as always greatly appreciated from this excellent group of gamers
Post #: 1
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 11:55:49 AM   
JVSFugitive


Posts: 27
Joined: 4/2/2004
From: Halifax, Canada
Status: offline 		Minesweepers placed in a transport TF will still sweep.

(in reply to undercovergeek)
Post #: 2
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 12:01:34 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 39924
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		All the engineering/construction battalions work in the same way. The different names are just to show what they were called in real life.

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Post #: 3
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 12:25:19 PM   
undercovergeek

 

Posts: 1455
Joined: 11/21/2006
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

All the engineering/construction battalions work in the same way. The different names are just to show what they were called in real life.


never - goddamit - ive spent ages shipping construction AF to damaged airfields, and naval ones to broken ports - oh well, thanks.

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 4
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 12:31:58 PM   
rockmedic109

 

Posts: 1886
Joined: 5/17/2005
From: Citrus Heights, CA
Status: offline 		The ones with a lot of Engineering Vehicles work faster.  1 Engineering Vehicle is worth 5 Engineering Squads. 

I've seen a D8 Cat from this time period work {A friend lent my dad one to help with building our pond--impressive}.  Should be worth more than 5 squads but I guess not all engineering vehicles are as big as a D8. 

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Post #: 5
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 12:57:08 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 39924
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		Well, yeah... The ones with bulldozers are nice to have, of course, but there are no special task-oriented bonuses.

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Post #: 6
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 2:32:06 PM   
Panther Bait


Posts: 500
Joined: 8/30/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rockmedic109

The ones with a lot of Engineering Vehicles work faster.  1 Engineering Vehicle is worth 5 Engineering Squads. 

I've seen a D8 Cat from this time period work {A friend lent my dad one to help with building our pond--impressive}.  Should be worth more than 5 squads but I guess not all engineering vehicles are as big as a D8. 


The 5:1 ratio is probably supposed to represent it's utility at performing all the engineer's functions. Pushing dirt, it is certainly worth more than 50-60 guys shoveling, but it probably not worth 50 to 60 guys cutting down trees (especially if they are using dynamite instead of saws).

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(in reply to rockmedic109)
Post #: 7
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 2:59:12 PM   
rockmedic109

 

Posts: 1886
Joined: 5/17/2005
From: Citrus Heights, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Panther Bait


quote:

ORIGINAL: rockmedic109

The ones with a lot of Engineering Vehicles work faster.  1 Engineering Vehicle is worth 5 Engineering Squads. 

I've seen a D8 Cat from this time period work {A friend lent my dad one to help with building our pond--impressive}.  Should be worth more than 5 squads but I guess not all engineering vehicles are as big as a D8. 


The 5:1 ratio is probably supposed to represent it's utility at performing all the engineer's functions. Pushing dirt, it is certainly worth more than 50-60 guys shoveling, but it probably not worth 50 to 60 guys cutting down trees (especially if they are using dynamite instead of saws).

In general, I see your point. But a D8 can clear quite a bit of forest. Great for clearing stumps and pulling the fallen trees out of the area. I think it would be worth more than 50-60 guys for clearing trees.

(in reply to Panther Bait)
Post #: 8
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 6:37:10 PM   
Panther Bait


Posts: 500
Joined: 8/30/2006
Status: offline 		For clearing small to medium trees (say the average palm tree on a SOPAC atoll) and stumps dozers work well, but given enough room, fifty guys with manual saws can cut down 25 trees at once (up to 50 with chainsaws), while the dozer can only work on one at a time.  And as the trees get larger (more like tropical rain forest sized trees) they get to be more than a dozer can push over.

Also, there are plenty of other tasks that engineers do that dozers can't (laying marston mat, making and pouring concrete, building structures, etc.).

_____________________________

When you shoot at a destroyer and miss, it's like hit'in a wildcat in the ass with a banjo.

Nathan Dogan, USS Gurnard

(in reply to rockmedic109)
Post #: 9
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 10:04:01 PM   
niceguy2005


Posts: 12510
Joined: 7/4/2005
From: Super secret hidden base
Status: offline 		To undercovergeek:  Terminus is correct about the battalions all being general purpose.  Further, I bet you're aware of this, but there is a difference between the engineering battalions which are for construction and the engineering regiments which are for reducing forts during combat - seems worth mentioning since this was such a common misunderstanding back in the day.

To others:  Not to hijack the thread, but...two long standing questions....I notice that there are no engineering vehicles anywhere in Japan's arsenal.  Is this correct?  Did IJ really build with basically a shovel and pick?  I also have heard that many Manchurians and peoples from other "liberated" areas were pressed into service to do construction.  Would most of the IJ construction units consist of this type of conscript laborer?


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Post #: 10
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 10:15:27 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 39924
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

To others: Not to hijack the thread, but...two long standing questions....I notice that there are no engineering vehicles anywhere in Japan's arsenal. Is this correct? Did IJ really build with basically a shovel and pick? I also have heard that many Manchurians and peoples from other "liberated" areas were pressed into service to do construction. Would most of the IJ construction units consist of this type of conscript laborer?



There were a very teeny-tiny number of Japanese-built engineering vehicles, and they pressed what they could find in conquered territories into use, but yeah, most of the work was by pick and shovel and the sweat of conscripted labourers, many from Korea.

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Post #: 11
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/24/2008 11:03:24 PM   
rockmedic109

 

Posts: 1886
Joined: 5/17/2005
From: Citrus Heights, CA
Status: offline 		Another little thing to note on construction/engineering battlaions.  In CHS the SeaBees have an assault value of about 15 while the others have none.  A small bonus, but a good one nonetheless.  I do not know if SeaBees lower fortifications during assault, though.

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 12
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/25/2008 3:08:49 AM   
Dili

 

Posts: 2579
Joined: 9/10/2004
Status: offline
quote:

never - goddamit - ive spent ages shipping construction AF to damaged airfields, and naval ones to broken ports - oh well, thanks.


I usually respect the unit propose. It feels much more real.


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Post #: 13
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/25/2008 10:46:37 AM   
undercovergeek

 

Posts: 1455
Joined: 11/21/2006
From: UK
Status: offline 		thanks for all help and advice - i might try and follow dili's example

(in reply to Dili)
Post #: 14
RE: Construction Battallions and Minesweepers - 9/27/2008 9:00:43 AM   
LargeSlowTarget


Posts: 2529
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: The deepest, darkest pit of hell
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005
I notice that there are no engineering vehicles anywhere in Japan's arsenal.  Is this correct?


The Japanese did use some engineering vehicles, albeit not as sophisticated as the Allied counterparts, and much less numerous.
According to Frank: "Gudalcanal", the Marines not only captured dozens of hand shovels, handcarts, some generators and air compressors, but also six road rollers, six trucks and field railway equipment including two gasoline-powered locomotives and several hopper cars. This equipment was pressed into service to make Henderson Field operational, since almost no engineering assets had been landed (only one bulldozer, which had to be used for other pressing duties, building a road net I suppose).
I don't know whether the Japanese had any bulldozers. But having no engineering vehicles at all in WitP is not right. Admittedly, even if there were any, it would probably not make much difference, but for the sake of historical accuracy they should be included - and to make JFBs happy...



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Post #: 15
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