Matrix Games Forums

War in the West gets its first update!Flashpoint Campaigns: Red Storm version 2.08 is now available!Command gets huge update!Order of Battle: Pacific Featured on Weekly Streaming SessionA new fight for Battle Academy!Buzz Aldrin's Space Program Manager is out for Mac!The definitive wargame of the Western Front is out now! War in the West gets teaser trailer and Twitch Stream!New Preview AAR for War in the West!War in the West Manual preview
Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

best use of sub commanders

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [American Civil War] >> Gary Grigsby's War Between the States >> best use of sub commanders Page: [1]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
best use of sub commanders - 7/7/2008 4:52:38 AM   
jcjordan

 

Posts: 1772
Joined: 6/27/2001
Status: offline
What is the most effective way to form "corps" to make up an army? Should I use the inf leaders to only have inf under them & use art ldrs to have only art under them then when a battle comes along move all including the AC into the region or take the 2 star leaders then put the inf & art under them along w/ other inf/art ldrs?
Post #: 1
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/7/2008 5:02:05 AM   
heroldje

 

Posts: 95
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
i asked a similar question and never got a satisfactory answer.  what exactly is the benefit?  would it be worthwhile to attach like 10 subcommanders?  Nowhere in the documentation does it say anything about how this function works other than attaching subcommanders 'help'

(in reply to jcjordan)
Post #: 2
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/7/2008 5:07:07 AM   
PyleDriver


Posts: 5876
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Occupied Mexico aka Rio Grand Valley, S.Texas
Status: offline
JC, first of all, as a newbee, drop the sub-commanders it is advanced learning. Corps are your desire, attach Art to leaders with 2+ abilities. So guys like Longstreet they handle both well, and the rest is up to you...


Jon

(in reply to jcjordan)
Post #: 3
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/7/2008 7:25:44 AM   
JanSorensen

 

Posts: 3684
Joined: 5/2/2005
From: Aalborg, Denmark
Status: offline
In my opinion the answers depends on the number of decent INF leaders you have.
If you simply dont have enough good inf leaders to handle all your inf otherwise - then go with artilerry in seperate corps.
If you do have enough decent inf leaders to handle both inf and art units then do that. The way commitment works (art is very "cheap" to commit compared to inf) you will probably get the best result that way. Just remember never to lower the movement of a corps by attaching artillery - so dont attach arty to an inf leader with 3 inf 1 art stats.

As for the question heroldje asks - no, there is no additional befinit to adding more sub-commanders to a corps than there are units to be commanded - you wont get a double divisional command bonus and CP (commitment points) are not really an issue for sub-commanders. I dont know with full certainty what does happen if you have excess sub-commanders but I believe the allocation is random so you would have been (slightly) better off just having the better sub-commanders attached.

(in reply to PyleDriver)
Post #: 4
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 1:39:47 AM   
heroldje

 

Posts: 95
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
i apologize, and im not trying to be a pain... but i have read and reread both answers, and dont feel like i have any better understanding of how the system works.  what benefit do subcommanders give?  Is it better to have poor subcommander or no subcommanders?  What is the optimal number to have in a corps?  Why?  The way this whole system works is a total mystery to me. 

(in reply to JanSorensen)
Post #: 5
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 1:52:25 AM   
tedhealy


Posts: 138
Joined: 1/28/2005
From: St. Louis, MO, USA
Status: offline
18.3

Infantry CSCs (corps sub commanders) may only
assist  Infantry/Militia units, Artillery CSCs may only assist artillery/heavy artillery units, Cavalry
CSCs may only assist Cavalry/Mounted units, and naval CSCs may only assist naval combat units.
The number of units that a CSC may assist in combat is equal to the CSCs rank plus one (Colonel
=1, 1 Star General =2, etc.). CSCs use their appropriate specialty skill rating (infantry, cavalry or
artillery) to assist units in committing to battle and fring and defending in battle. There is no limit to
the number of CSCs that may be attached to another leader, however no more than 25 items (units
and/or leaders) may be attached to any leader.

Benefit: They help committing units to battle and firing and defending in battle.  Seems like it's better to have a poor CSC over no CSC.  Optimal number?  Seems like enough CSC's to cover as many units as possible.

(in reply to heroldje)
Post #: 6
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 2:19:26 AM   
hgilmer

 

Posts: 184
Joined: 6/2/2007
From: Birmingham, Alabama
Status: offline
    I believe another good reason is if you win (and sometimes even if you lose) their command rating has a chance to increase. So, the more in there, the more trained up and capable leaders you have?

(in reply to tedhealy)
Post #: 7
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 7:53:01 AM   
JanSorensen

 

Posts: 3684
Joined: 5/2/2005
From: Aalborg, Denmark
Status: offline
tedhealy is correct.

Any CSC is better than none - and once you have enough CSC to cover all the troops in the corps more are of no use.

CSC do not help with: Initiative or movement.
CSC do help with commitment, combat, scouting, raiding, blocading.

I dont 100% remember if CSC help with training or entrenching - but I do not believe so. 

(in reply to hgilmer)
Post #: 8
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 8:18:43 AM   
WarHunter


Posts: 1186
Joined: 3/21/2004
Status: offline
I have noticed if your leader fits the parameters of being a Corp commander, and you have no subcommanders, there is a -# equal to the lack of sub commander assistance.

If you have a Leader which is not able to command a corp, and it has a full complement of units, it has no adverse affect that i have seen.

Artillery early in the game have few leaders, and i find myself not attaching arty leaders to Infantry corps, but allow them to be seperate units. That 1star general with 3/4/5/6CP's as an indiviual leader seems more useful with 3/4/5/6 artillery attached, than as a subcommander helping only 2 units.

Maybe as the activations are used it gets better over time, but with attrition, i never seem to have enough artillery leaders.

Lately i've been sorting and stacking the corp commander's with sub commanders who have the same specialty rating. Seems to be working ok.

_____________________________


“We never felt like we were losing until we were actually dead.”
Marcus Luttrell

(in reply to JanSorensen)
Post #: 9
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/8/2008 11:29:13 PM   
tran505

 

Posts: 133
Joined: 11/11/2007
Status: offline

My assumption is that the Corps commander helps his subordinates no matter what the type. So even an "infantry" corps commmander will help an artillery formation and its leader. So I would think that overall even good artillery leaders are made better by being placed in with a good corps commander, even if the artillery leaders cannot command as many units within the corps, as they could as an independent formation.

This is just an assumption -- let me know if I am wrong!!

- P

(in reply to WarHunter)
Post #: 10
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/9/2008 1:03:34 AM   
heroldje

 

Posts: 95
Joined: 6/29/2008
Status: offline
thanks, that is exactly the answer i was looking for

i dont know how i missed it in the manual since i searched for it thoroughly

(in reply to tran505)
Post #: 11
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/9/2008 4:37:42 AM   
madgamer2

 

Posts: 1236
Joined: 11/24/2004
Status: offline
I love it when you talk this way. I wish I could understand what you are saying LOL. I have read the manual several times and still have a bit of a mental gap...must be old age...I have to get used to the basic leadership first then perhaps I will give it a try.

Madgamer

(in reply to WarHunter)
Post #: 12
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/9/2008 4:11:13 PM   
WarHunter


Posts: 1186
Joined: 3/21/2004
Status: offline
One of my favorite moments in the game, when using Sub-commanders, Promotion time.

Having a sub commander get his 2rd Star or 3rdStar, now outranking his Corp commander. Breaking up the corp and sometimes forcing a drastic change in leadership.

Another aspect of the Sub-commander rule, increased Leader casualties. In just 1 month we have seen 13 leaders KIA and WIA. While in March of 1863 AC Halleck was mortally wounded.

And i love it...

_____________________________


“We never felt like we were losing until we were actually dead.”
Marcus Luttrell

(in reply to madgamer2)
Post #: 13
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/9/2008 4:17:06 PM   
Berkut

 

Posts: 757
Joined: 5/16/2002
Status: offline
Does anyone else start thinking about the Hunley when they see this thread title?

Where is Lt. Payne????

(in reply to WarHunter)
Post #: 14
RE: best use of sub commanders - 7/9/2008 4:23:57 PM   
Massattack

 

Posts: 74
Joined: 10/28/2002
From: UK
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Berkut

Does anyone else start thinking about the Hunley when they see this thread title?

Where is Lt. Payne????



I was going to post a smartass reply referring the OP to the Silent Hunter 3 or 4 forums for further info. Ooops, sorry...!

(in reply to Berkut)
Post #: 15
Page:   [1]
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [American Civil War] >> Gary Grigsby's War Between the States >> best use of sub commanders Page: [1]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.086