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Goeben?

 
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Goeben? - 7/29/2007 10:42:16 PM   
Bismarck


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Am I missing something? The Germans had a small squadron in the Med based around SMS Goeben?

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RE: Goeben? - 7/29/2007 11:28:38 PM   
hartwig.modrow

 

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Yes they had... Rear Admiral Wilhelm Souchon in command, I think... Goeben and Breslau.

Short campaign under German flag though... they shot at some French bases in Algeria, then a short encounter with HMS Gloucester who preferred to break off when they saw what they were encountering on their way EAST (which confused Sir Milne a bit). They reached the Dardanelles (sp?) by August 10th and were transferred to Turkey a few days later - if I recall correctly, many people think that's what triggered Turkey's joining the central powers.

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RE: Goeben? - 7/29/2007 11:33:49 PM   
Arinvald


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They start in the Turkish Navy. As sonn as Turkey joins the CP, look at the Turkish Naval page.

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 12:53:38 AM   
Bismarck


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Thanks. A tiny shame because they MAY have been able to disrupt the transfer of French troops to France from Algeria. I think Milne got a rocket from the Admiralty for not stopping them.

< Message edited by Bismarck -- 7/30/2007 12:59:03 AM >


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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 12:54:21 AM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bismarck

Thanks. A tiny shame because they MAY have been able to disrupt the transfer of French troops to France from Algeria.


Goeben is simulated in TOAW

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 1:52:27 AM   
SMK-at-work

 

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The order for Goeben to sail for Turkey was given befoer the outbreak of the war, and is often regarded as one of hte things that helped Turkey into the war.

sure it might disrupt Med shipments, but only until it got caught (it was lucky to get away as it was), and then you'd have a question whether or not Turkey would join.......

Does the TOAW scenario give these options?  (I'm a great TOAW fan - haven't played WW1 tho)

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 1:58:23 AM   
7th Somersets

 

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There is nothing to stop the Turks setting sail in the Goeben though... I have had many a vicious naval battle in the Eastern Med with the Turks and AH naval forces causing trouble and stopping me from successfully forcing the straits...


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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 12:53:49 PM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

The order for Goeben to sail for Turkey was given befoer the outbreak of the war, and is often regarded as one of hte things that helped Turkey into the war.

sure it might disrupt Med shipments, but only until it got caught (it was lucky to get away as it was), and then you'd have a question whether or not Turkey would join.......

Does the TOAW scenario give these options? (I'm a great TOAW fan - haven't played WW1 tho)


You are right. Goeben couldn't do too much in reality because it will be sunk by Anglo French forces... he bombed some ports and that's it. TOAW simulates ability to actually sink it before it get's away (not without losses of course, he was very modern). Turkey joins CP anyway and if it is damaged he will show up near Constantinople when repaired from the pool.

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 2:01:48 PM   
SMK-at-work

 

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It actually did quite well in hte Black sea - it was instrumental in keeping hte Russian fleet away from the Bosphorous for example.

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 3:40:02 PM   
Monkeys Brain


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quote:

ORIGINAL: SMK-at-work

It actually did quite well in hte Black sea - it was instrumental in keeping hte Russian fleet away from the Bosphorous for example.


Yeah, I know I have many books on that. Massie, Halpern...
I am history junkie with more than 100 books on ww1, ww2, napoleonic etc...

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RE: Goeben? - 7/30/2007 5:47:07 PM   
jimi3


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This link is to a great history of early WW1 med ops. And it's free !!!
The flight of the 'Goeben' and the 'Breslau,' an episode in naval history ([1921])
http://www.archive.org/details/flightofgoebenbr00milnuoft
Anyone remember the old Strategy and Tactics game Flight of the Goeben?

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RE: Goeben? - 7/31/2007 12:33:48 AM   
SMK-at-work

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Monkeys Brain

I am history junkie with more than 100 books on ww1, ww2, napoleonic etc...


Only 100?? Pfft.....rank amateur!! But I guess you have to start somewhere

< Message edited by SMK-at-work -- 7/31/2007 12:34:00 AM >

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RE: Goeben? - 7/31/2007 10:35:54 AM   
Monkeys Brain


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[/quote]

Only 100?? Pfft.....rank amateur!! But I guess you have to start somewhere
[/quote]

Exactly

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RE: Goeben? - 7/31/2007 4:39:56 PM   
Redan


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The Author Barbara Tuchman was aboard an Italian liner bound for Istanbul and witnessed the encounter between G and G. She was a child. See her book Guns of August for detailed account of the whole incident. The Brits cancelled delivery of 2 completed drednoughts to Ottomans, which also added to Turkish decision to enter war.

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RE: Goeben? - 8/3/2007 4:54:54 AM   
Def Zep


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quote:

jimi3 -

Anyone remember the old Strategy and Tactics game Flight of the Goeben?


Dave Williams (strategic board)/Tony Morale (tactical system), iirc. S&T 21. Dave Williams also did Anzio & the Anzio Beach-head mini-game (intended for inclusion in AH's Anzio, but dropped for space/cost reasons; appeared instead in S&T 19). Anzio introduced step reduction; Anzio Beach-head was notable for being one of the first games with impulse movement turns.

One of my favorite games in high school. I remember re-doing all of Jutland (AH) to use the tactical system, and liking "Flight of the Goeben" 's strategic map quite a bit better for moving fleets than plotting.

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