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RE: Any WITP games for sale?

 
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RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/29/2007 3:15:45 PM   
tocaff


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From: USA now in Brasil
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I was looking for some software in Sao Paulo Brasil and when I asked about it in stores they all said the same thing:  Pay R$10 on the street and get a pirated copy.  I wasn't for a game, though they too are available, but a major office suite.  The price converted to $ at the time was about $4.00.  Nobody bats an eye at this and pirating is accepted in almost every aspect of retail goods from clothing to software.  I'm not saying it's right, just saying what is and no I bought a legit package elseware.

(in reply to birde)
Post #: 31
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/29/2007 5:22:58 PM   
viberpol


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I think you mess up the two things, tocaff.

Sure you can use the eMule and downolad illegal copies of almost every game published, for free, not even paying the 4USD for the street "hacked" game.
But this situation here is somewhat different: it has more in common with the purchasing power of society.

You can buy it from Matrix for 60USD in USA, where the average salary is (...fill in...).
You could buy it in Poland in a very fashionable chain of stores (Rafael said.. like EMPIK) for 6-8USD. But here in Poland the average salary is less than 600USD/a month. This had to be calculated by big companies whatever they sell -- big office suites or simple strategy games.
I think none could afford buying this game here if he'd have to pay 10% of his month salary!!

EMPIK or 3Kropki I recommended are all legal stores, and NOT computer pirats.

Companies have choice. Sell anything for a smaller price or sell nothing.
It's a free market rule.

/edited: of course, I had to wait more than a year after its first release to buy it here in Europe, and this is a major drawback, but still, IMO, Matrix should lower WITP price/

< Message edited by viberpol -- 3/29/2007 5:29:41 PM >

(in reply to tocaff)
Post #: 32
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/29/2007 5:48:55 PM   
tocaff


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OK, so in effect what we have here is a situation akin to that of prices charged by pharmacutical companies.  In the US it costs an arm and a leg for a particular medication and in another country the same product costs a fraction of the price.  This is charging a price that the market (buyers) can support and many goods are sold this way around the world.  Companies are always trying strategies to combat you from buying the product from a company in another country where it's cheaper and the internet is giving buyers the power to buy from anywhere in the world and possibly avoiding taxes also. 

(in reply to viberpol)
Post #: 33
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/29/2007 6:29:59 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 827
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Yup, it seems so..
Long live the Internet!

The "intel" here is what matters

< Message edited by viberpol -- 3/29/2007 6:30:33 PM >

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Post #: 34
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/30/2007 1:48:41 AM   
wdolson

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: tocaff

OK, so in effect what we have here is a situation akin to that of prices charged by pharmacutical companies. In the US it costs an arm and a leg for a particular medication and in another country the same product costs a fraction of the price. This is charging a price that the market (buyers) can support and many goods are sold this way around the world. Companies are always trying strategies to combat you from buying the product from a company in another country where it's cheaper and the internet is giving buyers the power to buy from anywhere in the world and possibly avoiding taxes also.


Electronic media makes it much easier, but it's been going on for a long time. The term gray market was coined in the 70s for Mercedes bought cheap in Europe and sent to the US. Even with shipping it can be cheaper to buy a Mercedes this way.

My father owned a photo supply company and he was getting Fuji film gray market. There was a company in the US who was buying large lots of Fuji film for Israel, but at least half of it ended up in the US market cheaper than from the US Fuji distributor.

I've been selling plastic model kits on Ebay for a few years as a side business. There are a few sellers in that niche who I'm sure are buying kits gray market from Asia. Their Ebay price is less that I can get the kit for from my supplier.

It's not illegal, though a lot of companies would like it to be. If the gray market buyers are getting their merchandise from the same place as the official importer, the importer may have a case for violation of contract. That could end up in a nasty international legal fight. When dealing with a developed country like an Western European nation, the US, Canada, Australia, Japan, etc. The courts tend to be somewhat impartial and a company claiming damaged from another country might get their way. However, in countries like China, unless you are a mega corporation that the government wants to keep happy, the courts tend to strongly favor the local, even if the law is not on their side.

Matrix could have a contract with the local distributor in Poland that says that licenses are only valid in Poland. If those copies get re-exported to the US, Matrix would have a contract beef with the distributor, or the retailer in Poland. However, unless Matrix is losing a lot of money on the deal, they would likely just let it go because it would be more trouble than it's worth to fight it. Since Poland is trying to join the EU, I would expect that Polish courts would be more open minded than Chinese ones, but probably not as impartial as some countries would be.

This has been an issue on my mind too. My other job is as half owner of a small software start up company. Our goal is not to be the next Microsoft, but we hope to be able to make a decent living from it. The nature of our products doesn't place us in an international market much, but because software is so easy to copy, it's also very easy to pirate. It's more trouble than it's worth to pirate a Mercedes.

The reason I've been pushed into starting my own company is because my old software niche went to India. American companies have found that they can hire Indian programmers at a fraction the cost of an American one, so everything I used to do is now done over seas. Both my SO and I have parents who owned their own businesses and we each have some small business experience, so we have some idea what we're doing. Those in my position who don't have the skills to start their own company are going bankrupt.

Bill

_____________________________

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(in reply to tocaff)
Post #: 35
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/30/2007 9:04:25 AM   
viberpol


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quote:

ORIGINAL: wdolson
Since Poland is trying to join the EU, I would expect that Polish courts would be more open minded than Chinese ones (...).

Bill


Bill, check your sources!
Actually, Poland joined the European Union in 2004

(in reply to wdolson)
Post #: 36
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/30/2007 5:53:46 PM   
grunt6971


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolfie1

quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

If you do manage to get a game CD from E-Bay, make sure you get the game's serial number so that you can load the game and the subsequent downloads - otherwise it could be a real bummer.



If he gets an original CD then the serial number is printed ON the CD.


I've got an original CD and the serial number is NOT printed on it - it is seperate.



Dito, but it appears that the serial number appearing on the CD is "hit-or-miss"

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(in reply to Wolfie1)
Post #: 37
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/30/2007 11:31:47 PM   
Xargun

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

The first release of WITP, at Origins back in '04, did not have the serial number printed on the disc. I do not know how many of these were made (without the serial #), but I do know that the first ones were released that way.


I know of at least 5 copies this way

Xargun

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 38
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/31/2007 12:26:44 AM   
viberpol


Posts: 827
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quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wolfie1
quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy
quote:

ORIGINAL: grunt6971

If you do manage to get a game CD from E-Bay, make sure you get the game's serial number so that you can load the game and the subsequent downloads - otherwise it could be a real bummer.



If he gets an original CD then the serial number is printed ON the CD.

I've got an original CD and the serial number is NOT printed on it - it is seperate.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun
I know of at least 5 copies this way
Xargun


Dito, but it appears that the serial number appearing on the CD is "hit-or-miss"




Yes, all digital downloads offered in Matrix store tend to have the serial number on their cds.
People, use your brains... ;)

< Message edited by viberpol -- 3/31/2007 12:31:14 AM >

(in reply to grunt6971)
Post #: 39
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/31/2007 4:38:16 AM   
wdolson

 

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From: Near Portland, OR
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quote:

ORIGINAL: viberpol
Bill, check your sources!
Actually, Poland joined the European Union in 2004


My bad. Sorry about that.

Bill

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WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

(in reply to viberpol)
Post #: 40
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 3/31/2007 7:07:53 PM   
fokkov


Posts: 83
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From: Gouda, Holland
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Fact is that companies in general adjust there selling price to what the consumer can and will afford in a country or region.
as Eastern Eeurope is still way behind US and Western Europe in earnings they have to go down by price so people are not spending a half weeks earning for a game
ans almost no copy will be sold.
For example,
You can see on the same site the new C&C3 for 109 zlotys which is about 29 euro's , official price on the web is 50 USD. (38 Eur).
I see the same with other goods , washingmachines etc.



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in to deep and out of time

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Post #: 41
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 4/1/2007 5:29:39 AM   
bradfordkay

 

Posts: 8251
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

The first release of WITP, at Origins back in '04, did not have the serial number printed on the disc. I do not know how many of these were made (without the serial #), but I do know that the first ones were released that way.


I know of at least 5 copies this way



Xargun




We were there first, and we're still here...says a lot for the depth of our addiction.

Thanks again!

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Xargun)
Post #: 42
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 4/1/2007 6:03:41 AM   
rogueusmc


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From: Texas...what country are YOU from?
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

quote:

ORIGINAL: Xargun

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

The first release of WITP, at Origins back in '04, did not have the serial number printed on the disc. I do not know how many of these were made (without the serial #), but I do know that the first ones were released that way.


I know of at least 5 copies this way



Xargun




We were there first, and we're still here...says a lot for the depth of our addiction.

Thanks again!
There are quite a few of us left that were pains in the @ss, asking every five minutes if it was out yet...

Xargun was the one that was the envy...posting pics of five copies in his hand before any of us got the DD...

Lee

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(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 43
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 4/1/2007 2:43:14 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 827
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From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
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quote:

ORIGINAL: fokkov
Fact is that companies in general adjust there selling price to what the consumer can and will afford in a country or region.
as Eastern Eeurope is still way behind US and Western Europe in earnings they have to go down by price so people are not spending a half weeks earning for a game
ans almost no copy will be sold.
For example,
You can see on the same site the new C&C3 for 109 zlotys which is about 29 euro's , official price on the web is 50 USD. (38 Eur).
I see the same with other goods , washingmachines etc.


Fortunately, a whole "life" is cheaper as consumer goods are...
I pay about 30 cents for a loaf of bread (and about 4 USD for a kilo of gouda cheese )


(in reply to fokkov)
Post #: 44
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 4/2/2007 12:18:17 AM   
fokkov


Posts: 83
Joined: 4/19/2005
From: Gouda, Holland
Status: offline
Here on the western end of the EEC we have allready skipped the cents.

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Post #: 45
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 7/11/2009 2:33:06 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 827
Joined: 10/20/2005
From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
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quote:

ORIGINAL: rogueusmc

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

The first release of WITP, at Origins back in '04, did not have the serial number printed on the disc. I do not know how many of these were made (without the serial #), but I do know that the first ones were released that way.
Yep...mine was in my confirmation e-mail.

Lee


Mine is also separate.
I just registered it in Members Area looking for AE, and everything went smoothly.
It looks like AE will need WITP installed.
For some folks, this increases the overall costs of AE to about 100-140 USD.

< Message edited by viberpol -- 7/11/2009 2:37:59 PM >


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RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 7/11/2009 3:42:40 PM   
Mobeer


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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay
Yes, any dealer who legitimately purchased copies of the game and has been unable to sell it at the original price is allowed to sell it for whatever he can get for it. Consider yourself lucky.


It's not a huge discount on the original price (from 19.99zl at Empik to 14.90zl at 3kropki), so I doubt this is a clearance price sale, more like a normal price.

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 47
RE: Any WITP games for sale? - 7/11/2009 7:18:33 PM   
viberpol


Posts: 827
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From: Gizycko, Poland, EU
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mobeer


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay
Yes, any dealer who legitimately purchased copies of the game and has been unable to sell it at the original price is allowed to sell it for whatever he can get for it. Consider yourself lucky.


It's not a huge discount on the original price (from 19.99zl at Empik to 14.90zl at 3kropki), so I doubt this is a clearance price sale, more like a normal price.



Yup, that's a regular price here of WITP licensed and distributed by Nicolas Games.

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Post #: 48
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