Best weapon systems of WWII

SPWaW is a tactical squad-level World War II game on single platoon or up to an entire battalion through Europe and the Pacific (1939 to 1945).

Moderator: MOD_SPWaW

Einar Fridgeirs
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 6:00 am
Contact:

Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Einar Fridgeirs »

Just for kicks, I´d like to see what all you forumites think were the weapon systems that just plain kicked ass in WWII. I´ve seperated them into 5 categories. Think of this as the Oscars of WWII warfare [:D] The judging criteria are effectiveness, longevity, ubiquiety and amount of fear they put into the opposition.

Best Artillery piece: This one was easy. The German 88mm gun, although nominally designed as an AA gun was also one of the most effective tank killers of the war, and could also be used for direct and indirect anti-personell use. SPWaW gamers know full well that you can never have too many 88´s!

Best Sidearm: The Colt .45 M1911. This one´s a no-brainer. The Colt M1911 and it´s later deriviaties may very well represent the pinnacle of handgun design and the longest-lived weapon system in military history. I´ve fired one of these babies and it not only has excellent stopping power but it´s exquisitely balanced weight makes it almost "idiot-proof" - with no prior handgun training besides firing one clip out of the same gun I was able to empty the clip as fast as I could pull the trigger and still land every single round onto a torso-sized target at 20 feet. I couldn´t do that with any other handgun that I tried, including much more expensive Berettas and Sig Sauers.

Best Tank:
T-34. Do I really need to justify this [:D]. All the German models that on paper superseded this bad boy were plagued by engineering problems and only available in small quantities.

Best infantry support weapon: The MG-42. A monster of a machinegun whose clones are still in use today in many hotspots around the world.

Best all-round aircraft: I´m torn between the British Spitfire and the P-47 Thunderbolt. The Spitfire, along with the radar system won the Battle of Britain but the P-47 was IMO more of a threat to german tanks than allied tanks ever were! Maybe I can solve my dillemna by having two categories: best interceptor and best ground support plane(although the Sturmovik also has a special place in my heart: it´s the closest we´ve ever seen an actual flying tank!)

So, bring it on and tell me how wrong I am! [:D]
While interviewing an anonymous US SF soldier, a Reuters News agent asked the soldier what he felt when sniping members of Al Quaeda in Afghanistan.
The soldier shrugged and replied, "Recoil."
azraelck
Posts: 581
Joined: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:00 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by azraelck »

Best Artillery piece:
I actually agree. The 88 was a killer; effective against damn near everything possible.

Best Sidearm:
Again, I agree; though in comparing the 9mm Luger against the colt, It'll be a difference in accuracy and range vs stopping power. Both are sidearms, however, so don't expect much of either. The 9mm is a higher-velocity round, with a flatter trajectory; whereas the .45ACP was a low-velocity, high weight round. I have no experiences with the TT-33 or Webley, or any of the minor players' side arms, so I can't really compare them.

Best Tank:
T34/85 was the best tank. It was reliable, reasonably well armored (it's still a medium tank), and had a powerful gun. T34 in whole was not, as the older model T34 were much poorer tanks, and at the time they were fighting they would not match up to a Panzer IV.

Best Infantry Support Weapon:
The Browning MMG. Variants are still in use by the US Military; which have very little differences to the WWII guns. The .50 BMG used today is effectively the same MG.

Best all-round aircraft:
P51 Mustang. Don't ask me why; I'm not much into aircraft.

Best Infantry Rifle:
M1 Garand. Obvious reason is that it was reliable, accurate, powerful, and when the US entered the war it was the only Semi-auto in service. And I seriously doubt that the en bloc clip ejecting would have made that much noise compared to the machine gun, rifle, and cannon fire in actual combat situations.

Best Squad Support Weapon:
Browning Automatic Rifle. Only disadvantage was it's 20 round clip. As accurate as a rifle, and capable of providing excellent suppressing fire against entrenched positions.
"Wait... Holden was a cat. Suddenly it makes sense."
Einar Fridgeirs
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 6:00 am
Contact:

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Einar Fridgeirs »

Thanks for the input! I actually had the T34/85 in mind, so we are in agreement there as well....

As for the BAR, good call,

Anyone wanting to nominate other categories feel free to chime in!

While interviewing an anonymous US SF soldier, a Reuters News agent asked the soldier what he felt when sniping members of Al Quaeda in Afghanistan.
The soldier shrugged and replied, "Recoil."
User avatar
FNG
Posts: 510
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2002 10:00 am
Location: Devizes, UK

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by FNG »

As above, with the exception of Squad Support Weapon; I'd have to go for the Bren. It's what I played with as a cadet and is a scarily accurate piece of kit. 32 round mag is a disadvantage, but IMHO the accuracy makes up for it... a real killer. I have a de-ac 1944 Inglis (Canadian) Bren... I love it so [8D]
FNG
Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good we oft might win by fearing to attempt.
Einar Fridgeirs
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 6:00 am
Contact:

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Einar Fridgeirs »

A real one? Or a replica?

I´d love to test fire a Bren...are there any shooting ranges in the UK where one can try WWII ear guns under supervision?

While interviewing an anonymous US SF soldier, a Reuters News agent asked the soldier what he felt when sniping members of Al Quaeda in Afghanistan.
The soldier shrugged and replied, "Recoil."
User avatar
KG Erwin
Posts: 8366
Joined: Tue Jul 25, 2000 8:00 am
Location: Cross Lanes WV USA

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by KG Erwin »

Best Machine Gun, by far: the American 50 cal "Ma Deuce". Still in service today. A beautiful piece of vehicle-mounted weaponry. [&o]

As for the BAR, I strongly agree. Its successor, the Squad Automatic Weapon (SAW), is a modernized version.
Image
User avatar
Dragoon 45
Posts: 434
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2004 2:57 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Dragoon 45 »

On the question of artillery pieces, I would have to rate the M-2 105mm howitzer as better. The FLAK and PAK series of 8.8cm guns were without a question excellent anti-tank guns and very reasonable anti-aircraft weapons. But their use as indirect fire weapons is questionable. Yes they were used in that capability, but to the average soldier in World War II, every artillery round that impacted in their general vicinity was an 88. While this happened occasionally, by far more 10.5cm and 15cm rounds were fired as artillery than 88's. Also the 88 HE round itself did not have that big of a bursting charge. A high velocity round has a much thicker shell casing which decreases the HE load in the round than that of a lower velocity howitzer round with a much thinner shell casing and much larger HE charge compared to the round of similiar size.
Artillery always has the Right of Way
264rifle
Posts: 168
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:19 pm

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by 264rifle »

Gentlemen:
The only reason the BAR survived so long in US service was that we DID HAVE the M-1 rifle. See also that abject failure of a LMG the M1919A6 Browning. The BAR was neither fish nor fowl. In "official" rates of fire that could be delivered without wrecking the gun (ignored in real crisis conditions, at least until gun crapped) the BAR was good for just under 4 magazines per minute. The BREN was good for four Mags a minute also. Four 20 round mags vrs four 28 (usual service loading, reduced jams) mags. Why did later US squads go to 2or 3 BAR's per squad? Maybe to get the rate of fire of ONE real LMG. The BAR was a solid, reliable weapon (unlike some other countries LMGs) but it was not designed as a light machinegun. Hanging a bipod on an automatic rifle doesn't make it a LMG.

The Colt .45 is the top handgun. Flat trajectory has very little to do with a combat handgun. What is wanted is adequite power and reliablity. IF you are fighting at pistol ranges and you are using a pistol it is because your primary weapon is unavailable ( jammed, broken, leaning against a tree or won't shoot this close). What is wanted first is a pistol that WILL GO BANG every time the trigger is pulled. Second is the power to stop the attacker. Just about everything else comes in 3rd or lower.

The M-1 was best rifle not only for being semi-auto but for reliability and just about the best set of sights on a WWII rifle (for those few troops who actually used the sights). Apature rear sight, just look through rear sight and place front post on target.
User avatar
Korpraali V
Posts: 659
Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 6:52 am
Location: Finland

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Korpraali V »

Artillery piece: Stalin's organ. Inaccurate, but very big psychological effect. Feared and well known all over the eastern front. And the damage...
Image
User avatar
Afrika Korps
Posts: 203
Joined: Tue Jul 02, 2002 6:05 pm
Location: Rhode Island

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Afrika Korps »

The first thing that comes to mind is the Airman, Marine, Sailer or Soldier...

...but if I have to pick a non-sentient only...I pick the Panzerfaust for infantry support weapon...this one weapon, with the shaped charge, basically changed the face of armored warfare (before it ever had the chance to reign supreme). Now, a man could defeat a tank at range...the impact of the development of the panzerfaust is still rippling today...
DAK
User avatar
Goblin
Posts: 5418
Joined: Fri Mar 29, 2002 7:57 pm
Location: Erie,Pa. USA
Contact:

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Goblin »

Pistol - Colt 1911

Rifle - Stg44 - First assault rifle. Also like to give a nod to the Soviet SVT40, and the German G43. Both could be reloaded easily in mid-clip, unlike the Garand. The Lee Enfield was a fine weapon too.

Support weapon - MG34. Reliable, steady weapon, used continuously and in every role imaginable. I would give a nod to the Bren also, even with its top load clip which blocked LOS. Also must acknowledge the bazooka as a support weapon.

Machinegun - M2 .50 calibre.

Tank - Including production and reliability, I would have to say T34. Sheer combat ability, a nod to the Panther.

Artillery - The 88, with a nod to the 105mm.

Aircraft - So many performed different functions, this could have 10 sub-categories. I would have to say the P47 or P51.



Goblin





soldier
Posts: 195
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by soldier »

Aircraft - I vote for the Focke Wulf fw 190
It was faster, lighter, more powerful and provided a very small target to hit while being substantially more heavily armed itself. It was more agile and had superior roll rate and handling over other allied aircraft of the time (41), particularly the excellent spitfire V. It featured stable wide track landing gear and a canopy with better all round view than its contemporaries. Its Sturdy frame enabled easy upgrades without much structural change and allowed it to keep ahead of the competition for many years while it giving it the ability to perform a wide variety of combat roles that the luftwaffe so desperatley needed.
Fortunatley for the allies the Luftwaffe's doctrinal outlook, production planning and 3 front war demands were so badly organised that it was never able to achieve anything other than temporary dominance over its adversaries and never supplanted the messerschmidt (itself a fair design) as Germanys main fighter.

Tank- the T34 (excellent design to work with, initially crude but still very effective)

Don't no nothing about little bang bangs sorry, I'll leave best gun up to the experts here
soldier
Posts: 195
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by soldier »

Heres something funny

October 1943
When an overenthusiastic American manufacturer printed an advertisement that displayed an FW-190 to mock it with the caption: "Who's Afraid Of The Big Bad Wulf?" -- they got a copy of the ad sent back to them in the mail along with a letter signed by everyone in a bomber unit that said: "We are."
Einar Fridgeirs
Posts: 90
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 6:00 am
Contact:

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Einar Fridgeirs »

ORIGINAL: soldier

Heres something funny

October 1943
When an overenthusiastic American manufacturer printed an advertisement that displayed an FW-190 to mock it with the caption: "Who's Afraid Of The Big Bad Wulf?" -- they got a copy of the ad sent back to them in the mail along with a letter signed by everyone in a bomber unit that said: "We are."

LOL!!! So true
While interviewing an anonymous US SF soldier, a Reuters News agent asked the soldier what he felt when sniping members of Al Quaeda in Afghanistan.
The soldier shrugged and replied, "Recoil."
264rifle
Posts: 168
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:19 pm

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by 264rifle »

The .50 cal Browning was only a great machine gun if you did not have to carry it on foot. Or carry the ammo (weighs about 4 times what a .30 cal does per round). Or needed to fire more than short bursts with long pauses between bursts.

Of course if you want to shoot through walls, wreck motor vehicles, destroy airplanes and such there is no other.

Bren might get the nod over the MG34 because of reliability and accuracy.

Anybody have any numbers on the reliabilty of the T-34[&:]

With aircraft you kind of have say what job it did. Other wise tou are trying to compare single seat racecars to dump trucks.[;)]
User avatar
FNG
Posts: 510
Joined: Thu Jan 03, 2002 10:00 am
Location: Devizes, UK

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by FNG »

ORIGINAL: Einar Fridgeirs

A real one? Or a replica?

I´d love to test fire a Bren...are there any shooting ranges in the UK where one can try WWII ear guns under supervision?


I have a de-activated 1944 Canadian manufactured (Inglis) Bren. As for firing one, I have only done that at military ranges when I was an army cadet in the 80s.




Image
Attachments
bren_1.jpg
bren_1.jpg (90.37 KiB) Viewed 184 times
FNG
Our doubts are traitors, and make us lose the good we oft might win by fearing to attempt.
Stonewall2036
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2006 3:10 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Stonewall2036 »

ORIGINAL: 264rifle

Anybody have any numbers on the reliabilty of the T-34[&:]

I think the Germans killed well over 20,000 of them. [;)]
264rifle
Posts: 168
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:19 pm

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by 264rifle »

I was thinking about time between overhauls on engines, life of tracks, life of main and steering clutches. Early ones sometimes went into battle with spare transmission tied onto engine deck which prevented turret from traversing 360 degrees.
User avatar
Dragoon 45
Posts: 434
Joined: Tue Aug 10, 2004 2:57 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by Dragoon 45 »

Standard piece of equipment for a T-34 driver was a small sledge hammer used to knock the transmission into gear on the earlier models. I doubt there is much out there on the overall reliability of the T-34. In the Soviet scheme of things that would have been highly classified information and under the new Russian system, unless some very sharp historian saved it, was probably destroyed when the former Soviet classified archives were opened up to the public. My understanding is that a lot of documents that would have shed a very poor light on the Soviet Military were destroyed before the archives were opened up.
ORIGINAL: 264rifle

I was thinking about time between overhauls on engines, life of tracks, life of main and steering clutches. Early ones sometimes went into battle with spare transmission tied onto engine deck which prevented turret from traversing 360 degrees.
Artillery always has the Right of Way
soldier
Posts: 195
Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Best weapon systems of WWII

Post by soldier »

I think the Germans killed well over 20,000 of them.

Thanks to Russian tactics (or should i say lack of them) and an attitude that men and equipment were more expendable in their own army than in those of the other combatant nations. Still a good tank just mishandled somewhat against the weremacht.
Post Reply

Return to “Steel Panthers World At War & Mega Campaigns”