Feud over where to bury Richard III (Full Version)

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Joe D. -> Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 3:15:29 PM)

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:06:22 PM)

I thought the car park was good enough....




warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:08:49 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.
warspite1

It should be taken seriously - he was our king, our head of state - and so deserves due respect.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:19:09 PM)

Really, he killed his nephews and was killed in turn by our king who I also expect deserves our respect . They were all thugs who lived off and abused the rights of ordinary people. Stick him back in the car park




rogo727 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:25:49 PM)

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.





warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:32:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Punk Reaper

Really, he killed his nephews and was killed in turn by our king who I also expect deserves our respect . They were all thugs who lived off and abused the rights of ordinary people. Stick him back in the car park
warspite1

Really? You have the proof that no one else has that he murdered his nephews? Wow - you should write a book you will make a fortune.

Yes Henry VII was our king too and has our respect - he is buried in Westminster Abbey - where Richard III should be laid to rest too.

They were all thugs and lived off and abused the rights of ordinary people? Yep, that sounds like most politicians I know - although probably with a little less thug (except John Reid or Ed Balls) and a bit more leeches.




warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:34:18 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.


warspite1

More to the point - who cares what foreigners - who have no English heritage - think about things that don't affect them?




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:36:34 PM)

They were all thugs and lived off and abused the rights of ordinary people? Yep, that sounds like most politicians I know - although probably with a little less thug (except John Reid or Ed Balls) and a bit more leeches.


Then my question is, why do they deserve our respect?




rogo727 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:37:59 PM)

Lol true mr. W. I am reading more about your heritage and culture tho. I don't know why but I find reading about the welsh really interesting . Is there a welsh movement in England now?
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.


warspite1

More to the point - who cares what foreigners - who have no English heritage - think about things that don't affect them?





warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:39:45 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Punk Reaper

They were all thugs and lived off and abused the rights of ordinary people? Yep, that sounds like most politicians I know - although probably with a little less thug (except John Reid or Ed Balls) and a bit more leeches.


Then my question is, why do they deserve our respect?
warspite1

They do not deserve your respect because - as you have made plain previously - you are not a monarchist, which is fair enough. However, most of us are. God save the Queen [&o]




warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:41:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Lol true mr. W. I am reading more about your heritage and culture tho. I don't know why but I find reading about the welsh really interesting . Is there a welsh movement in England now?
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.


warspite1

More to the point - who cares what foreigners - who have no English heritage - think about things that don't affect them?


warspite1

Welsh movement in England? Sorry I do not follow?




rogo727 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:43:41 PM)

Scots Irish English proper and southwest you have welsh.
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Lol true mr. W. I am reading more about your heritage and culture tho. I don't know why but I find reading about the welsh really interesting . Is there a welsh movement in England now?
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
quote:

ORIGINAL: Joe D.

"No one could accuse the Brits of a lack of passion for their history. As the feud continues over where to bury Richard III, the head of the York Minster church is getting hate mail, AFP reports. Nine of Richard's descendants have called for his reburial at York, where he had royal ties. But the UK has left the matter in the University of Leicester's hands; the school says he'll be placed in Leicester Cathedral.

"Not all are pleased with the decision, and some of the letters sent to the Dean of York 'are so extreme that she has referred the correspondence to the police ...'"

http://www.newser.com/story/164359/aftermath-of-richard-iii-discovery-hate-mail.html?utm_source=part&utm_medium=united&utm_campaign=rss_3_2

Apparently the Brits take their history as passionately as their soccer.


warspite1

More to the point - who cares what foreigners - who have no English heritage - think about things that don't affect them?


warspite1

Welsh movement in England? Sorry I do not follow?





rogo727 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:45:40 PM)

Sorry forgot about the northern Irish .




warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:48:05 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Sorry forgot about the northern Irish .
warspite1

Soz if I am being dense but I genuinely do not understand the question [&:]




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:56:45 PM)

Wales is a separate country that is part of the United Kingdom. They have their own parliament with limited powers. They have a strong culture and in parts of Wales Welsh is the first language.
Scotland is also a separate country that is part of the United Kingdom. They have their own parliament with more powers than Wales and are voting on leaving the United Kingdom.
Ireland is a totally separate country.
Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom with its own limited parliament.

Hope this is clear, it is a bit complicated.




warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 7:58:10 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Punk Reaper

Wales is a separate country that is part of the United Kingdom. They have their own parliament with limited powers. They have a strong culture and in parts of Wales Welsh is the first language.
Scotland is also a separate country that is part of the United Kingdom. They have their own parliament with more powers than Wales and are voting on leaving the United Kingdom.
Ireland is a totally separate country.
Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom with its own limited parliament.

Hope this is clear, it is a bit complicated.
warspite1

But the question was - is there a Welsh movement in England?




rogo727 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 8:04:45 PM)

You have Scotland with their own culture is it the same for the welsh?
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Sorry forgot about the northern Irish .
warspite1

Soz if I am being dense but I genuinely do not understand the question [&:]





warspite1 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 8:16:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

You have Scotland with their own culture is it the same for the welsh?
quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

Sorry forgot about the northern Irish .
warspite1

Soz if I am being dense but I genuinely do not understand the question [&:]


warspite1

Yes the Welsh, like the English, the Scots and the Irish all have their own nationality and thus identity/culture - in addition to a British or United Kingdom identity.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 8:18:30 PM)

I think the question comes from a flawed understanding of the complex political landscape of the United Kingdom. I notice Americans often use the word England for the United Kingdom. This not a criticism of Americans, since I don't have a have a great knowledge of their political system.


This was meant to appear a couple of posts higher




sulla05 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 9:37:25 PM)

I'm from the U.S and I believe Richard III should be in Westminster.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 9:39:19 PM)

Why?




Otto von Blotto -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 11:01:50 PM)

Why not he obviously had a huge impact on the country and was loved by his people.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/13/2013 11:35:24 PM)

You do realise that he died in 1485 and I am not sure what you base your assertion that he was loved by his people. The people had suffered badly for years due to the Wars of the Roses of which he and his brother were major players. You know, crops burnt, towns looted, famine... The usual things that occur when the nobility fight to see who will be king.




Otto von Blotto -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:12:02 AM)

Yes yes I know when it was, firstly I am English and know the story and the arguments, and to top that I've seen the first blackadder [8|]

Sorry but everyone suffered both before and after the Plantagenet wars lets face it if you weren't noble or attached to nobility in some way in those days you didn't matter at all so by his people I mean his barons his soldiers, the court and surfs not the peasants as they didn't count we are talking 15th Century politics, who cared if a town or two was destroyed, the crops were valuable but the people who grew them weren't.

He was the last English king to die in battle which means he fought with his subjects and did so on many occasions, that I would say earned his soldiers (Peoples) respect and also deserves ours.




Joe D. -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:13:45 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rogo727

I can speak for most Americans who have no English heritage who cares?
...


Reminds me of the scene from "Gettysburg" where the Brit officer observing Lee's forces notes the number of prominent combatants of English heritage from both sides now fighting one another.




Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:21:25 AM)

I couldn't tell that you are English as it isn't on your status. Historically it was incredible to find his bones under the car park and the forensics were really interesting but as for a state funeral for a long dead king I think in this time of austerity money could be better spent. And you know if Richard gets one Thatcher supporters will be clambering to get our uncrowned queen one as well.




sulla05 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:31:20 AM)

Please do not judge people from history with 20th or 21st century morals and ideas. For one thing it does not make any sense.

He was an English king and most English kings are buried there.

All regular people in 1485, 1099 or 200 BC lived pretty horrible lives if they are measured against the common man of these eras. The people suffered horribly in WWI, WWII and all the conflicts up to the present. It also happenes when political parties arm themselves and fight to see who will be in power.

But there is a choice of how you can govern in the modern world. I would not try to act like the U.N. or a fine upstanding republic in centuries past. Because, if you did not have a strong king with martial abilities in any previous century your crops would be burned your homes destroyed and if you were extremely lucky you would be sold into slavery and not horribly tortured to death.






Punk Reaper -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:49:58 AM)

I take your point about judging historic figures with today's morals. However the last English monarch buried at Westminister Abbey was George II in 1760 since then they have been buried at Windsor Castle as was Richard III 's brother Edward IV. Before then they were often buried in France or in a variety of places throughout the country.
As for Richard he was buried by the lawful king of the time in a future car park. Perhaps we shouldn't judge Henry's decision with our modern morals either.




Otto von Blotto -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 12:53:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Punk Reaper

And you know if Richard gets one Thatcher supporters will be clambering to get our uncrowned queen one as well.


Now here I am with you, but sadly like 15th century peasants I don't think we will get a say.




sulla05 -> RE: Feud over where to bury Richard III (3/14/2013 1:16:51 AM)

As far as the money involved I wasn't talking about making it a state funeral with all the trappings. Make whatever lords or royals are closest in blood ( I know not many are, but some must have some small connection ) pay for the internment.

If they want to bury him somewhere else that is fine too.

I really do not think Richard was " buried " in the parking lot. It pretty much looks like they dug a hole and threw the dog in after he died.







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