Beta 4 Attacking (Full Version)

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ComradeP -> Beta 4 Attacking (12/28/2012 9:57:29 AM)

I'm new to the series, and only bought the game shortly before the patch was released so I'm not entirely sure if the patch could actually have caused this to happen. If not, apologies, but I only noticed this in this patch and not in the demo or my short game of Hofen Ho-down.

I'm now seeing weaker attacks than before, in the sense that if I give a battalion an attack order, only 1 of its companies will actually tend to attack most of the time (the rest will be "in reserve"), resulting in me having to give manual attack orders to the companies to get anywhere.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/28/2012 12:06:27 PM)

Can you please provide a save where this happens and a screen shot. Thanks.



Alchenar -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/28/2012 2:58:25 PM)

No save but I can confirm this is a problem I've noticed:

Manhay Crossroads as Axis. Sent an Infantry batallion with an attached Panther company to 'Defend' the crossroad, with the procedural attacks option selected.

The HQ proceeds to forum up on the hill above the town and send a single company to assault the crossroads. After it gets routed, the next company is sent it.





GBS -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/28/2012 4:06:00 PM)

I going to look for this as well.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/28/2012 11:00:41 PM)

OK let me know when you have a save. Preferably I need one taken before the order and then one after the order has been processed.



piesym -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/29/2012 11:09:50 AM)

i have the same problem.i found the attacking become harder than before,often been stalled.



wdkruger -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/30/2012 6:58:24 PM)

Hi Dave:

Attached is a picture of the one company attacking problem. The bn in question is I bn 183 Pz Grn. Notice 5 co is attacking while 6 and 7 are back by the HQ with a "centre guard" and "right guard" role. The attacking co has no role.

How do I send you the save?

[image]local://upfiles/40920/2C291305847643648AC06EB9D0F7810C.jpg[/image]



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (12/31/2012 12:11:19 AM)

Thanks. Just zip the save and upload here or email to me at support[at]panthergames[dot]com



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 4:23:25 AM)

Warren,

Finally got time to review your save. I did a force dump on the Bn HQ and sure enough it has opted to allocate only one company to the assault and keep the other two in reserve. The AI can do so if it deems there is little oposition. But to work out exactly why I need a save from just before you issued the order which was at D2 0941. Do you have one?



wodin -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 7:35:51 AM)

Dave is there anychance you could programme the game to save every minute but each save wipes out the one before..purely for testing and bug finding reasons?

CO is a game you probably save little while playing compared to say a turn based game. It may help in this kind of situation.



phoenix -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 8:21:08 AM)

I'm seeing the one company attack behaviour frequently, Dave. And not in approropriate circs. I already sent you a save about it. Did you get? Would you like any more? They're easy to get. I have one form Manhay crossroads of you want. What happens is one company goes ahead, gets kicked out, then all the others join in. The others are labelled 'left guard', 'main guard' etc, but they don't do that, they just sit back.




Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 12:00:30 PM)

phoenix,

The ones marked left and right guard are not part of the assault task. Rather they are the left and right guards for the reserve task. The problem is the allocation. What I need to step through the allocation is a save from just prior to a situation in which you issue the attack order. So just before you are about to issue an attack oprder, save the game. Then issue your attack order and if it ends up only allocating one company of the battalion to the attack, then send me that save with an explanation of who you gave the attack oprder to. Then I will run it in the debugger, issue the orders and step through the process.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 12:02:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: wodin

Dave is there anychance you could programme the game to save every minute but each save wipes out the one before..purely for testing and bug finding reasons?

CO is a game you probably save little while playing compared to say a turn based game. It may help in this kind of situation.

wodin,

that sounds a nice idea but won't work unless we save all those saves. Invariably you realise you want a save from some time back. It's best to do a save before issuing orders. Save the file as Scenario name D1, 1315 or something like that.



wodin -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 4:07:39 PM)

True..maybe then save each time the player does an order and keep the last five..again that wont work as you need a save before the order.

I think those playing should make sure while it's in beta to save before every order...that way the saves are on hand..



phoenix -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 8:18:08 PM)

Dave. I've sent you 4 saves covering an Attack which seemed to replicate the behaviour mentioned. The first is before the orders are given. Hope this is helpful. I didn't have to play and play to get an example. This was first time I tried to get it to do it for you. I selected fastest, quickest and no rest, left everything else to the AI. Please note also the position of the left guard, right guard, rear guard (all, like the HQ, uninvolved in the actual attack) in save 4, relative to the attack objective. They look like they're pointing north to me, rather than east-ish, which is where the objective is. Hence they're not really left and right guarding. But maybe they know something I don't, and maybe that's a side issue. At any rate a single company put in the attack on Manhay Crossroads in the early hours, was forced to retreat then the whole thing stalled. Let me know if you get the saves ok. They were sent to support at panthergames.com Cheers.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/8/2013 11:32:27 PM)

Phoenix,

Thanks for the saves. They proved their worth. I was able to track down the cause of the errant behaviour and fix it quickly. It turns out that it was due to some new code I had added for the last build that pre allocated units to nearby threatened objectives. However, for attacks where the reserve loc is close to the enemy, this becomes a nearby threatened objective and so it was grabbing the units. I now exempt this code for attacks.

[image]local://upfiles/8882/FCB5F16AEA5C4598A40BF1330A73DD35.jpg[/image]



wdkruger -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 1:33:24 AM)

This is good news.



Deathtreader -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 5:56:48 AM)


Hi,

Does the exemption also apply to move orders where the attack box is also checked??

Just curious..........

Rob.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 6:56:12 AM)

No because a Move mission will not have multiple objectives at different locations ubless they are independent groups due to low fuel, fatigue etc. So it doesn't affect these anyway.



phoenix -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 8:08:09 AM)

Great. Thanks Dave. Can't wait to get rid of that little issue and use attacks as they seem to go in much faster (the one unit attacks much faster than before) - is that right? In which case I will be tempted to use them more as they are meant to be used.

Is your fix good even if you dont specify a formation (as I hadn't)? I notice you have specified successive lines up above, I think.

For me that issue is the only issue of real significance I've come across in quite a few games so far with patch 4 (believe it or not....). I think the routing behaviour needs changing so they don't run miles (as if flying...), but it's a cosmetic thing, in a way, as they don't generally run into difficulty. It would be nice not to see the 'flying units' though. Shorter routs to cover, maybe? And I would have thought that the 'safety' of their own lines should maybe be a good choice, no? (Safety in numbers) They seem to rarely rout back to friendly lines. Could be wrong. I can get you routing saves easy enough too, if you like - though you may have enough already?

So far I have not seen long lists of halting (and I'm still playing through From the Meuse to the Rhine). Four max, maybe, over a shorter time period. Which is fine too.

It's looking like maybe it will work really well once the beta is finalised. Excellent. Thanks again, Panther.



Arjuna -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 8:35:43 AM)

I did not specify a formation for the attack in the screen dump above. So yes it works for "unspecified" formation types.

Re routing. I made mode this aftyernoon. I reduced the min and max ranges out to which a unit can rout from 1800-2700 to 1200-2100. I also ensured that where possible it will choose a safest route. It looks to be doing fine from my short test.



phoenix -> RE: Beta 4 Attacking (1/9/2013 9:48:28 AM)

Great. Have to say, the formation in your attack above looks beautiful - two up front, one to come in right after, plus a reserve. Nice. Would love to see some of that in my games! Look forward to the finalisation now!



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