Opening Soviet game plan? (Full Version)

All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Decisive Campaigns: Case Blue



Message


RCH -> Opening Soviet game plan? (10/20/2012 7:56:34 PM)

I have played around with the Axis enough that I am just about ready to start a pbem game. First though I want to play the Soviets to get a feel of that side. In the opening of the Case Blue Scenario what things should the Soviet player be doing. I have read somewhere that Soviet supply is insufficient. Do I need to place certain armies at like 75% supply or how do I administer supply. The Soviet air force is a mess. Any thoughts here? Do the Soviets get enough reinforcements or should I be rebuilding units as they are lost? How best do I manage manpower? Do the Soviet players bring all the units in the south north? Does the Soviet need to guard the coast? Is there any real danger from Axis amphibious operations?

Any Soviet suggestions appreciated.

A few questions:

I can create a Romanian army/corp, but how do I fill it out with staff etc. I build them, but they never are able to do anything because they never fill out. The game should open with a Romanian Army.

Can anyone take Rostov by direct assault. Even against the AI I give up because the casualties become so great. I just flank it and win it that way. That way takes a lot of troops though and a lot more time.

The low mountain hexes can be a bear to take. I guess that is just the way it is. It can make for slow going through the south though.

I treat the engineers as combat units even holding portions of the line at times. I find even small units can have a decent combat value. When I catch a lone AA or artillery unit they always put up a good fight when I would think that I would just blow through them. Even the HQs can put up a decent fight.

I like being able to create units. A big plus. I don't agree with being able to create SS units from fresh or rebuilding a destroyed regiment. I would rather see them with higher moral and unable to create any more.

I know the Axis satellites are weak, but a little too weak?

I think the engineers should be able to build pontoon bridges, though not unlimited.

I'd like to see a button where you could direct the AI to order out the recon planes and I'd like to see actual recon planes. Then if more info was needed the player could send out more planes.

Anyway, there it is. I am liking the game and I see a lot of potential with it. I think soon I will be looking for an opponent.





LiquidSky -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/20/2012 9:39:43 PM)



On the first turn of the game, I create an army for the Hungarians, Italians and Romanians (Trappenjagd)....for Case Blue, it would be the Romanians only, as the other two exist.

Every turn you get a random chance at getting some Axis minor replacements. As the game goes on, their spirit rises, and the chance goes up. By the time it matters, you should have enough staff in them to make them useful. In fact, by the time you have to rely on them to hold a line, you will probably have extra staff in reserve.

I should add, that you don't really need a lot of staff in an Army HQ. You won't be attaching any combat units directly to the army, so the staff/troop ratio won't matter. You just want enough staff to make it operational, so it can move. The Corp HQ's need all the staff....so they can have divisions attached to them.

My last game, after the fall of Kerch/Sevastopol, I sent the 11th army with all the German Artillery on the map to Rostov, and assaulted it. It was a slow, somewhat painful process, but as long as you can roll the artillery (fire a quarter of it every turn, so it is near full strength), and use your air, and attack from three sides....the hexes will fall. Manstien will help with Freedom or Gamble as well. I dont recall if the casualties were onerous or not. Constant hammering, and never attacking over your stacking level, will keep his readiness down. And reinforcing russians won't be entrenched.

Any hex (even clear) can be hard to take, if the enemy is fortified to the maximum entrenchment level. Terrain increases the level, but so will forts, and the russians will have a lot of forts. They have several leaders who can spend command points to plop down forts.

I spent 2 SS infantry cards, an ss artillery card, two ss truck cards, and an ss Tank card so that I could build a new SS motorized division, last game. Was it worth it? Not really...for the same points I probably could avoid an objective, or put an extra 30k infantry in my pool, and will probably not do that again.

I find the axis minors to be about the same as the Russians. Only trouble with them is that losses subtract from spirit level, so you can't just use them to attrition.

There is a game rule that can be changed (in editor, Rule um 320) to allow engineers to build bridges without needing a road and/or rail line. Trouble is you could pop them up anywhere, and they are permanent. As the game goes on, there would be a plethora of bridges on the map...trivializing their need. I was in the process of writing an event to use a card to place a bridge ( so only one per turn, and with some cost), but all the reading I do on the subject points to this:

The Germans would use pontoons, rafts, boats to establish a bridgehead and supply it...after the bridgehead expands, they will move the bridge to replace the damaged/destroyed bridge at an existing road/rail bridge. They didnt throw them up in out of the way places. An argument for the Russians could be made that they did throw them up all over the place, using local man/woman power, but that was more often in the later part of the war, then in 1942. I think the existing system of 25AP's for a small river, 50AP's for a medium, 75AP's for a large and 100AP's for the Volga (supply movment costs) is a fine way to represent all the low scale bridges/rafts etc that both sides would be using.

I suppose you could raise the cost to 100 AP's for all rivers, then allow us to use engineers to build the permanent bridge to supply the bridgehead..

Reconning is a funny one...in WiTE I would spend an hour (or more) flying endless recon missions, blanketing the front so that I could get near perfect intel on where every Russian unit is sitting. This game gives me far fewer planes, and a lot less intel per recon mission. But then I discovered I don't particularily care as much, as I cant move my tanks 25 hexes in a turn, driving around the enemy like they are pylons in an obstacle course. I only really care about what is near the front. One trick I do use, is to use my fighters to attack cities behind the lines, in the hopes of catching planes on the ground, or causing his airforce to come up and fight. You also get very good recon value in the city itself, which may hold an HQ/unit to identify rear reserves.





James Ward -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/20/2012 9:46:39 PM)

The first thing the russians need to do is run and survive. The second thing they need to do is replace all the crappy leaders they have, which also helps with the first thing.
If you can do these two things and not lose to many troops/units then you have chance.




The Red Baron -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/21/2012 4:03:12 PM)

I've been playing Uranus now as the Soviets for awhile, and, yes, Soviet supply is insufficient even in December; so, I can only imagine what it must be like in the May-June timeframe. The Soviet navy vacuums up an enormous amount of supply each turn that it sits in port. You can move the navy out of port to prevent this, but eventually their supply stock will reach zero, readiness and action points will drop, and, if you don't move them back into port, the ships will remain permanently immobile at sea, utterly useless and awaiting their destruction; not much you can do about the Soviet navy's need for supply.

In my game I'm into December and Stavka is pushing out only about 66% of the supply I need; however, I've been attacking all along the front but I've gotta stop this. Bottom Line Up Front: as I'm rapidly learning, you will need to prioritize your effort. Some armies will have to sit static while other armies make the push. For armies sitting static, adjust their supply % to 50%. This will allow them to maintain their current readiness level whatever it is (100 stays at 100, 75 stays at 75, etc) without attempting to stockpile add'l supply points. This ensures the maximum amount of supply flows to the armies which need it (you might also conider moving the navy out of port for a few turns if you have a Front which is in critical condition).

Even in December the Soviet AF is still terrible; don't expect much improvement there. The bomber divisions are mostly provisioned with U2s, not PE2s; completely ineffective even against personnel targets in the open. I use them as cannon fodder to lower the readiness of intercepting fighters or for reconnaisance duties in areas of the front not covered by German fighters. Hopefully, they do a good enough job that my REAL attack has a chance of success.

In the beginning of the campaign, you will find your fighter divisions provisioned with lots of LAGGs, MIGs and Polikarkov I-16s, all of them either sub-par when compared to the Bf109 series or utter cannon fodder (I-16); expect to lose a fair amount in any engagement (20+ planes). Even with these planes in the division, combat results frequently show that the JGs target my higher performing airframes just as much (especially the P-39d). Save your fighter divisions for reconnaisance duties in areas where it would be too dangerous for the bombers to operate and try to maintain their readiness so that they have a chance of intercepting enemy air attacks. You can use them to hammer enemy airfields occupied by KGs where the chance of an intercept is low, but be very wary of anything but small amounts of Flak. Once I reconned an airfield to discover it housed 3 KGs. The following turn I attacked with 100 fighters. In the meantime my opponent had crammed 30 Flak guns into the hex. I lost 25 planes, my readiness dropped from 100 to 23, I did absolutely no damage to the KGs, AND my attack was not even intercepted by enemy fighters.

The one bright spot in all this is the Sturmoviks; they are extremely effective against Panzers but the conditions have to be right. Lower the enemy fighters' readiness with sorties by your bomber and fighter divisions then attack the Panzers in clear terrain when they're not stacked with, or surrounded by, Flak guns. I've found German Flak tends to nullify any results I might achieve with my Sturmoviks while substantially lowering their readiness; 5-10 Flak guns is Ok, 15+ is probably a waste of your Sturmoviks (pick a different target).

When it comes to moutains, I avoid attacking in such terrain. Try to outmanuever your opponent and force him to withdraw. Even against Hungarian, Italian and Romanian units, I had to attack from 3 hexsides (preferably 4) with at least 3 divisions and 100 readiness to force a retreat; because of the modifiers, guns and bombers are virtually useless so there's no help there. It's the same with cities. Try to cut off your opponent's supply then wait 2-3 turns before attacking; otherwise, you risk a slaughter. I tried to take Voronezh without doing this and suffered 6,000+ casualties. My opponent? I lowered his readiness and entrenchment 10-15 points and killed about 200 infantry. Afterwards, he punched two holes in my weakened line causing a crisis, which took several turns to rectify.




rominet -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/21/2012 5:33:59 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: The Red Baron

I've been playing Uranus now as the Soviets for awhile, and, yes, Soviet supply is insufficient even in December; so, I can only imagine what it must be like in the May-June timeframe. The Soviet navy vacuums up an enormous amount of supply each turn that it sits in port. You can move the navy out of port to prevent this, but eventually their supply stock will reach zero, readiness and action points will drop, and, if you don't move them back into port, the ships will remain permanently immobile at sea, utterly useless and awaiting their destruction; not much you can do about the Soviet navy's need for supply.


Is it possible to disband navy units?
I suppose battleship won't be able to go to Saratov?? [sm=innocent0009.gif]




LiquidSky -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/21/2012 5:58:47 PM)


Hmm..I imagine you can disband them, but then then the pieces would just go to STAVKA and probably draw supply while they are there. Easiest way to get rid of them is to select HQ for them, then hit the red circle with the red line through it for no HQ.

Presumably it will draw no supplies then.


Just tested it with the Easy supply rules...they draw no supplies, but will use up their stockpile.




rominet -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/21/2012 6:44:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky


Hmm..I imagine you can disband them, but then then the pieces would just go to STAVKA and probably draw supply while they are there. Easiest way to get rid of them is to select HQ for them, then hit the red circle with the red line through it for no HQ.

Presumably it will draw no supplies then.


Just tested it with the Easy supply rules...they draw no supplies, but will use up their stockpile.


Thanks Liquid, it works as you said.




The Red Baron -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/22/2012 3:16:43 AM)

Be careful of assigning the naval units to no HQ and reducing their supply stockpile to zero. You may suddenly receive an order from Stavka to take an objective behind the German lines, which requires an amphibious assault (like I did). It will take 2-3 turns for your fleet to build up enough of a supply stockpile to travel the distance to the objective and back to port. This assumes your objective is fairly close and you sortie from the northernmost port in the Transcaucasus region (add 1-2 more turns if you need to lauch your attack from farther south). In the meantime your navy will consume huge quantities of supplies; might be better to set the supply % at 50% to maintain a "slow burn" rather than shock your supply system.




Keunert -> RE: Opening Soviet game plan? (10/22/2012 5:57:21 AM)

here are my thoughts so far:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3170237




Page: [1]

Valid CSS!




Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI
1.953125E-02