IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (Full Version)

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CyrusSpitama -> IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/11/2012 7:01:44 PM)

quote:

Interesting Discussion Involving Decisions That Honestly Are Thought-provoking.

Simple idea of mine. I have many questions about decisions I make. I try to read the many AARs and Q&A that occur here, but minor details always make me wonder. So with smart bomb like precision, I am going to post a series of questions about very specific decisions I have made, that make me wonder. Please keep answers as focused as possible.


For this next subject, we have what I consider a clearer choice for the AK conversion. I present to you the Kongo Maru AMC class:


With the use of scout planes, this is an excellent addition to your amphib fleets while it last, in my opinion. However, I feel with the superior AA guns(as compared to other cargo ships), the Kongo Maru class begs to convert over to the AK option. Of course, this ship has other conversion options which you could utilize, saving you the hassle of removing a ship from your convoys to be converted. Either way, I consider this conversion a must, as soon as it becomes available.

Feedback? Questions?

[image]local://upfiles/37657/C02DAE4D0A124890A67BBCAA7DF8053D.jpg[/image]




Commander Stormwolf -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/11/2012 8:25:14 PM)


aah the yusen cargo vessels

my favourite all purpose merchant [:)]


yep AMC and AV are the best conversions

in particular the AV Kamikawa Maru category

.. always seems like you could fit an emily on the front, and an emily on the back [;)]




CyrusSpitama -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/11/2012 8:54:14 PM)

You are diverting off-topic slightly here :) I plan on AV discussions later as this series progresses. For now, I am focused on amphib capable shipping(specialized stuff, like AMCs and APDs), then migrating to cargo ships (which would incidentally include PBs), then to support(which includes many cargo conversions).

Also, you made me realize the photos are in reverse order. I must have been distracted at the time of creation. The AMC converts to the Kyushu class, not the other way around. The pics should explain this by the lack of the AMC button listed at the bottom of the screen but nonetheless, I hope this causes no confusion to folks not aware of that.

As for the question posed, I should have mentioned the only real loss here, in my rookie opinion, is the loss of the torp capability. Since it is low ammo and would require combat from a non-combat shipw tih 0 armor, I don't consider it a major loss.




Insano -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/11/2012 11:08:32 PM)

My 0.02: No way I convert these 2 ships for a reason you just mentioned, torpedoes. There are only 5 Japanese AMC equipped with torpedoes. If I was going to convert any, those would be the last 5.




Gräfin Zeppelin -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 1:11:02 AM)

Torpedoes, float planes and 14cm guns ? I take it :) AKs are very nice but Japan has a good bunch.




Chickenboy -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 3:21:36 AM)

I agree with Frau Zeppelin, et. al. Torpedoes, float planes, nice guns-this is the exception that proves the rule otherwise. It's worth keeping as an AMC IMO.




CyrusSpitama -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 4:00:03 AM)

Ahhhhhh... once again splashed in the face with mud. Excepting raiding, how would you utilize a non-armored ship like this AMC? One torp ammo (x2 launchers) plus the lack of armor appears to me a one hit wonder that is more likely to end up in Davy Jones' locker. True, those torps are awesome, but this ship has one good thing regarding combat imho, its endurance. Please add further feedback to this thread so I gain further understanding on these subtleties.




Shark7 -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 6:41:32 AM)

It's the float planes that keep me from converting them. How many standard AKs can provide their own ASW aircraft? [;)]




GreyJoy -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 11:21:02 AM)

I convert ONLY those without the embedded patrol air groups.
Those with Jakes aboard are used early on for raiding and spotting enemy convoys (like glenn-equipped subs), while later they act like normal transports in Convoys but those 2 Jakes become usefull in order to keep the pesky enemy subs spotted and so neutralized.
For this pourpose i tend to have at least 1 AV in every big and important convoy. The AMCs are used in those convoys moving troops from Japan to CENTPAC, SOPAC and SWPAC, while the AVs are used for the fuel convoys coming from the DEI-SRA




Dili -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 12:37:12 PM)

Using the AVs in convoys with air group working should be considered gamey since they couldn't launch while going underway.




Gräfin Zeppelin -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 12:57:11 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Using the AVs in convoys with air group working should be considered gamey since they couldn't launch while going underway.

They could and they did. Kamikawa Maru for example launched planes to intercept British planes while approaching Kota Bharu.




Commander Stormwolf -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 1:11:07 PM)


http://www.combinedfleet.com/Kamikawa%20Maru_t.htm

not only launch their own CAP / ASW, but also co-ordinated strikes in the solomons

rather bad for morale however.. to fly a pack of F1Ms into a swarm of F4Fs [:)]

unless you plan to ram them [:D]




Puhis -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 3:16:56 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Gräfin Zeppelin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

Using the AVs in convoys with air group working should be considered gamey since they couldn't launch while going underway.

They could and they did. Kamikawa Maru for example launched planes to intercept British planes while approaching Kota Bharu.



Indeed. Modern Japanese AVs had catapults, and early war they constantly operated planes while underway. AVs used float planes for ASW, recon, CAP, ground attack...




Shark7 -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/12/2012 4:25:44 PM)

For that matter, Langley should be able to operate underway as well, since it had a catapult and an elevator.




crsutton -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/13/2012 3:45:01 PM)

No way I would convert a ship that can utilize valuable float planes. Forget the AA value as any merchant on either side caught by aircraft is going to get sunk....The additional AA is meaningless in this case. I find Japanese AMC rather useless as surface raiders except early in the game. But sometimes a couple of float planes on board can really help.




Dili -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/13/2012 5:25:33 PM)

quote:

They could and they did. Kamikawa Maru for example launched planes to intercept British planes while approaching Kota Bharu.


My mistake, you are right.

From Combined Fleet website seems only Kamoi and Notoro didn't had catapult.




Puhis -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/13/2012 5:38:48 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

quote:

They could and they did. Kamikawa Maru for example launched planes to intercept British planes while approaching Kota Bharu.


My mistake, you are right.

From Combined Fleet website seems only Kamoi and Notoro didn't had catapult.



Also Akitsushima didn't have catapult. Akitsushima was flying boat tender and repair ship that didn't carry any planes.




Commander Stormwolf -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/13/2012 5:52:38 PM)


akitsushima was a scaled back project

original concept was for flying boat carriers that could place them in the water
and magnify the "operation K" concept, of using flying boats for long-range strikes

there was a group in the IJNAF that saw the potential,
but the lackluster results of using submarines to refuel,
the others (yamamoto included) were not convinced

[image]local://upfiles/28382/9288C6EDE8B04F05B095588FF9321699.jpg[/image]




Shark7 -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/14/2012 5:02:58 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Puhis


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dili

quote:

They could and they did. Kamikawa Maru for example launched planes to intercept British planes while approaching Kota Bharu.


My mistake, you are right.

From Combined Fleet website seems only Kamoi and Notoro didn't had catapult.



Also Akitsushima didn't have catapult. Akitsushima was flying boat tender and repair ship that didn't carry any planes.


Yep, and technically in game Akitsushima should only carry a single H8K or H6K, not 4 regular Float planes.




CyrusSpitama -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/14/2012 11:05:28 PM)

Hey guys, your comments are deviating off topic, but interesting comments nonetheless :) Be sure and bring those points up later when I cover AVs and conversions.


Back on topic: Since I am clearly wrong to rush to convert these AMCs (according to opinion so far anyhow), exactly how would y'all recommend using these AMCs ? Raiding I read is an option, but I am not messing with that against the AI. Once I am doing PBEM, I can consider raiding options. Currently, I use these AMCs to supplement the cover in amphib forces. They do very nicely at this function, often detecting many a sub I did not otherwise see (high skilled pilots helps here too). As a bonus, the guns help to pound those pesky roaches off the shores of my pretty little islands. As for a direct combat ship, I cannot see these as being very useful. A few bombs or shells and they should be sunk unless we are talking very minor shells/bombs.

Any additional feedback on the usage of these AMCs if I am not converting them? As always, I am humbled by the informed responses here on these forums. This is the exact reason I decided to start this Q&A series. [&o]




Gräfin Zeppelin -> RE: IDIDTHAT! Vol.2-Kongo AMC conversion (10/15/2012 1:20:34 AM)

They can also be used for fast transports. Very handy imo.




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