A worthy opponent... (Full Version)

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aprezto -> A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 1:49:20 AM)

Rather than a motto of name and shame of those that don't follow through on a game, because they lost a carrier or some such. I figured the other approach is worthwhile.

List the opponents you think ARE worthy of the investment of a PBEM game.

Hopefully this creates a complete enough list that it can be used to check the compatibility of your next opponent. As you list someone, I will edit this post and add them alphabetically.

The list:

1eyedjacks
Admiral Dadman
AndyMac
Aprezto
Bigred
Bourner
Bradford
Canoerebel
Capt
Cap_and_Gown
CapMandrake
CarnageINC
Chickenboy
Cuttlefish
FeurerKrieg
hart wig.morrow
Herbie/1275psi
John III
jomni
jwilkerson
ike99
Miller
Nemo121
PzB
Q-Ball
mc3744
nikerdemus
n01487477
OSO
Panzerjager Hjortlund
PresterJohn
Ramjet
Rgijn
Shark7
Sierra Juliet
Speedy
Tocaff
Tone
Tom Greco
USSHenrico
Vettim
Witpqs
Yubari
Zeta16




Nomad -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:08:07 AM)

aprezto
PzB

Thats a start.




witpqs -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:18:25 AM)

Adding:

cap_and_gown




Canoerebel -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:38:44 AM)

I can nominate the following:

John III
Miller
Q-Ball




DivePac88 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:43:39 AM)

I will nominate these worthy Guys;

aprezto (Wobbly)
Ramjet
Shark7
Tone




Zigurat666 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:45:40 AM)

Actually I find that there are more "reliable" opponents than "non-reliable" ones. I think I have played 7 or 8 PBEM's and all but one continued until it was mutually decided to end. When I am looking for an opponent I find it a better indicator to look up the members posts and you can get a good indication of how this person will play out. Composing a list such as this in my opinion can become discriminatory and detrimental to finding an opponent and the continued interest in the game.Anyways it would be my guess that anyone appearing on this list as a good player and reliable to go the distance will most likely be in a PBEM already.
Just my 2 cents




Yakface -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 2:33:39 PM)

Tom Greco
yubari

In games with these two that have reached mid 42 (have played Tom multiple times). Both are consistent with turns and yubari has previous long running AAR in WITP




Q-Ball -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 3:22:32 PM)

Cuttlefish fo sho




Kwik E Mart -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 10:01:03 PM)

the anti-Megan's list of AE....love it! [&o]




John 3rd -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 10:47:07 PM)

Canoerebel must be placed on that list.

Am not so sure I belong there currently!  [sm=00000030.gif]




OSO -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/9/2010 10:49:49 PM)

I would add:

FeurerKrieg




Canoerebel -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/10/2010 12:44:20 AM)

I haven't played the following gents, but they have established their bonafides through years (sometimes MANY years) of faithful play and AAR posting. All of these guys always go deep into games and have been faithful to their opponents:

Bradfordkay
Admiral Dadman
Speedy
Chickenboy
Vettim
CapMandrake




Ramjet -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/10/2010 12:49:32 AM)

Thanks DivePac88. I appriciate that. Although we weren't able to finish I really enjoyed our game.

To mention another, I have been playing against Zeta16 for some time now, and we typically go deep into a game, but right now it is September 1945 and we are still going. I am Japan and am totally defeated, but continue to put up a fight. The Allies should get the opportunity to use all those neat weapons and beat up on Japan, after all he has suffered numerous surface defeats during the game but didn't quit. Each time I won a battle, it seemed to only strengthen his resolve. Now I am getting creamed!!




Feurer Krieg -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/10/2010 7:34:19 AM)

OSO!




n01487477 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/10/2010 9:39:57 AM)

[edit..] removed Name

I've never been really comfortable with making a pecking order - but I posted anyway.




bbbf -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/10/2010 11:23:40 AM)

Herbie/1275psi
mc3744





indy58 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 1:35:09 AM)

Hey, What about the ones just now playing AE with a Human Opponent (PBEM)? I am playing my first PBEM oponent currently and would one day like to play the names listed above. Looks like if you are not on this list then you are not worthy to play. I think If you are active in the forums (posting or following along) you will know most of the names listed above already. I think this is a bad idea but just my opinion..

indy58




vonTirpitz -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 2:08:30 AM)

I would have to agree with you.

IMHO, Starting "lists" with the express purpose of segregation frequently does more harm than good.

I'll leave it at that. [8D]

quote:

ORIGINAL: indy58

Hey, What about the ones just now playing AE with a Human Opponent (PBEM)? I am playing my first PBEM oponent currently and would one day like to play the names listed above. Looks like if you are not on this list then you are not worthy to play. I think If you are active in the forums (posting or following along) you will know most of the names listed above already. I think this is a bad idea but just my opinion..

indy58




aprezto -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 2:32:28 AM)

I don't think this list is a work of law.

It is also specifically stated to exentuate the positive of being listed not implicate the negative of being absent.

You are still a sentient being able to make up your own mind. If you wish to play someone in PBEM that is not on this list I would say: 'go for it'.

However, if you happen to have an offer from an opponent and their name is on this list, you will know you have someone who has met the test of PBEM in the past and has been vouched for by another. IMHO that adds value.




Chickenboy -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 3:52:55 AM)

Well put, aprezto. I'm generally not a popularity list sort of guy, but need to vouch for some that aren't so active on the boards that are outstanding and loyal PBEM'ers.

USSHenrico has been a consistent and reliable opponent since the inception of our PBEM. Very solid.




Nemo121 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 9:41:57 AM)

Segregative lists are always a bad idea. Particularly when the list creator allows personal animus to influence list creation.

In this instance every name mentioned by contributors, bar one, has been added to the list. The missing name is someone the thread originator got annoyed with about a week ago. So it seems that apart from the publicly quoted criteria of being nominated by an opponent you also are screened by aprezto's personal bias and whom he likes and dislikes.

Since the inability to actually be objective is so common this particular failing is common to such lists. Lists with this failing can never be representative and thus are worthless IMO. To have even minimal value these sorts of lists would have to be completely objective and they clearly are not.




aprezto -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/11/2010 9:03:00 PM)

Nemo. Any paranoia? I've just missed your name - nothing sinister. Adding it now - althought by the sounds of it, you don't actually want to be on it anyway.





scott1964 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 6:55:39 AM)

[img]http://bestsmileys.com/peeping/5.gif[/img] [8D] [img]http://bestsmileys.com/peeping/7.gif[/img]




Nemo121 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 12:13:40 PM)

Aprezto's, even still it is a useful example of the even subconscious biases which make these sorts of lists less than useful.

As to being on the list: I'm neutral. Listing my name or anyone else's is neither help nor hindrance since such lists are, by their nature segregative popularity polls riven with bias which don't have validity beyond their face validity.

If a committee were to be formed which checked pbem dates reached and formed a list which was stickied with a view to running for months and years and in which multiple members and a transparent protocol insured against biases of individual members holding sway then I think we'd be on to something worthwhile even though still, necessarily less than complete. This current incarnation though is not very useful IMO.


With that said, and unbidden, I would suggest AndyMac, n01487477, hart wig.morrow, jwilkerson, nikademus and 1eyedjacks. Each of them more than meets the criteria you have established above. If this is going to be done it might as well be done as properly as possible.




Chickenboy -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 3:39:00 PM)

Whew. I'm relieved that you've shown us how to do this list properly, Nemo121. For a minute there, I thought our praise for excellent and upstanding opponents was being improperly displayed. Now that it has your approval and repeated input into the process, I can rest assured.

That being said, I can tell you that listing of my PBEM partner herein (USSHenrico) was based not upon popularity or 'riven with bias', but a culmination of many other factors. This includes subjective assessments of his communication style, adaptability to impediments to gameplay (adoption of HRs as necessary), acceptance of interruptions in the game cycle, willingness to teach and willingness to learn. My listing is also based on a culmination of objective factors, such as turn 'turn around time', frequency of interruptions of gameplay, duration of current game (very important track record) and adherence to previous agreements (e.g., HR fighter sweep altitudes).

I am currently playing three PBEMs, yet I listed only one opponent on this list. That doesn't mean that my other partners are wanting, it means that USSHenrico is the one that I would put into this 'great' category at this time based upon the factors I cite above.

Accepting a PBEM opponent is like accepting a long-term relationship. You're going to be with this person for a long time based upon a common bond. Having some feedback from others ahead of time is a great way to increase the chance that your partner is a quality one.

How refreshing that Azpresto / Wobbly is looking at this from the positive point of view.




AW1Steve -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 7:27:08 PM)

Might I suggest , that rather than an endless lovefest of nominations, newbies might do what practiced and responsible participants have done for some time? Ask for referrences when you post an "opponents wanted?" Anyone who is unwilling to provide refrences to his skill,character and honesty is either a total newbie (having never played a PBEM) or someone that you might want to avoid. You might ask , how many PBEMs they've played, who with and general character information. ASK, Then Verify, to misquote a president of the 1980's. In other words, take some responsibility upon yourself (not to mention do a little work ) and find out. Don't expect every other member of forum to do YOUR work for you. Or to broadcast everyones greatness, or faults. USE that PM button. Get off your virtual butt and show that YOU are worthy of playing against. [:-][:@]




Nemo121 -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 9:59:25 PM)

Chickenboy,

Well feel free to misrepresent things if you wish. I had thought that one of the reasons for a forum was to gather feedback. It seems however, here, that there is only interest in getting feedback one already agrees with and then misrepresenting the rest through the distorting prism of personal animus.

I offered my input in the same way others have offered theirs ( eg AW1STEVE etc ).. You can feel free to ignore it if you wish -that's fine - but to actively misrepresent it is unnecessary.




Deerslayer -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/12/2010 10:05:42 PM)

Jomni - Never seen such a reliable and fast turn around in all my years of PBEM of whatever game! We were well matched. :-)




bigred -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/13/2010 1:23:57 AM)

Probably the best advice is below. Ask your future opponent for a few referrences.
Not all your good players make posts. All the players on AARs are our Hollywood players. The best player you may face will finish you off quick and not have a very long AAR.
quote:

ORIGINAL: AW1Steve

Ask for referrences when you post an "opponents wanted?" Anyone who is unwilling to provide refrences to his skill,character and honesty is either a total newbie (having never played a PBEM) or someone that you might want to avoid. You might ask , how many PBEMs they've played, who with and general character information. ASK, Then Verify, to misquote a president of the 1980's. [:-][:@]



IMHO AARs are good for our collective ego as now most of us are too old to fight w/ our bodies so we fight w/ our minds. Keeps the mind and sword sharp as we study our future opponents.

I did recieve a comment about my partner from OSO once. After my partner stopped making turns.




bigred -> RE: A worthy opponent... (8/13/2010 1:33:22 AM)

FYI, I made some good friends on UV forum. I figure most of them will one day gravitate to AE.
Bourner
IKE99-who may be permanently banded from the forum.
RGIJN and
TOCAFF, who took my pbem virginity. He only plays newbies...[sm=00000622.gif]




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