Proposed changes to possum WIR? (Full Version)

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Possum -> Proposed changes to possum WIR? (3/25/2002 8:54:30 AM)

Hello All
I'm still working on the AFV's for version 5.
Unfortunately I now have much less time avaliable for this than I originally planned, so it's slow gowing; But I haven't stopped!
From reading various threads here on the board has got me thinking of doing some more changes to incorperate into possumOBWIR v5
1) delay the arrival of the He-177 until the 1st week of Febuary 1943
2) Change the arrival locations of the Soviet 2nd echelon divisions, so that they now arrive in their Military District/Front HQ's , rather than arrive in the RGVK HQ (This is because of the full implimentation of the no transfer if less than 50% rediness rule.) Previously I had not bothered with doing this because it was more convienient for a human player to have nearly all of the new units form in RVGK, and then be dispached to the appropriate front HQ as desired.
But now there is a problem with RGVK filling up too fast.




davewolf -> Where the **** is Model? (3/25/2002 10:28:36 AM)

Possum

Maybe this was already discussed, but I don't know. So why is Model available just from mid '42 on in your V4 (if I'm right)? He became 9th Army's commander in 15th Jan. '42!?

Dave




Possum -> (3/25/2002 11:29:47 AM)

Hello Davewolf.
Hmm....
I just checked my v4 file and Model becomes avaliable on turn 34 (15 Feb 1942 )
This is the same as in the original OBWIR.
Should it be Different?
Can you please check your copy to see if it is different?




davewolf -> (3/25/2002 12:46:55 PM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Possum
[B]Hello Davewolf.
Hmm....
I just checked my v4 file and Model becomes avaliable on turn 34 (15 Feb 1942 )
This is the same as in the original OBWIR.
Should it be Different?
Can you please check your copy to see if it is different? [/B][/QUOTE]

Possum

In the obwir there's 34 too. But I have one game running, it's june '42 and that certain general is still on vacation (or whereever), means: not available. Strange...!?

Dave




Chairman -> (3/25/2002 2:37:56 PM)

HE 177 could have been available earlier IF the 2 engine had been changed to a 4 engine that were proposed.

Göring did order that the HE 177 was not to bee a 4 engine bomber, but what IF Hitler had been there and messed a little to the right side?? Then there could have been a produktion line quit early.




moonfog -> (3/25/2002 3:54:42 PM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chairman
[B]HE 177 could have been available earlier IF the 2 engine had been changed to a 4 engine that were proposed.

Göring did order that the HE 177 was not to bee a 4 engine bomber, but what IF Hitler had been there and messed a little to the right side?? Then there could have been a produktion line quit early. [/B][/QUOTE]

Hi chairman,

I think we should keep the dates when equipment becomes available in WiR as historical as possible. WiR doesn't allow a player to micromanage resources or influence research efforts.

Concerning the He-177, the most built version (A-5) did enter service in February 1943. In the game, the 177's arrival in the 1st week of Feb. 43 seems ok to me.

Regards
Ray




Chairman -> (3/25/2002 4:27:35 PM)

If I remember right there were a 4 engine HE 177 in air in middle 41 or early 42, but it was named HE 177 B2 or something like that to not alert Göring.
This airplane was entirely built and supported by the Heinkel factories and this one had some problems that were solved when the 2 engine HE 177 were accepted by the Geraman
aircraft ministry?

If the 4 engine aircraft had been built there might have been possible to have some in action late 41 early 42.

But Göring did opose the 4 engine concept, dont know why but it might have been hard to build the amount of engines that were needed.




matt.buttsworth -> (3/25/2002 7:10:18 PM)

Thankyou very much for the possum wir, possum. they are a really interesting, well balanced form of wir that is fun to play.
Three questions all of which I have asked of normal wir (they were rejected) but may be possible in possum wir. Firstly, if there are spare axis units places, why not create some of the Wehrmacht/SS russian units to represent the many soviet people who did decide to fight against the Soviets?
Secondly, to represent the number (almost a million by some account) of Soviets who did fight on the German side I believe all Russian cities should offer a reduced manpower to the German side.
And thirdly, the Russian players suffer a shortage of manpower from late 1942 on stopping them using human wave tactics that is unrealistic and can result in a German/Russian stalemate where the german player bleeds the Russians to death. Very unrealistic. It should be the other way round.
I therefore propose that all Russian cities offer the Russians full manpower when recaptured and that the manpower ratios for the Russians be adjusted upwards to reflect their numerical superitory and to allow their very costly way of waging war.
Thanks again for creating the possum versions. M




Ed Cogburn -> (3/26/2002 6:08:47 AM)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Chairman
[B]If I remember right there were a 4 engine HE 177 in air in middle 41 or early 42, but it was named HE 177 B2 or something like that to not alert Göring.[/B][/QUOTE]


The He-177B0 I think, this project eventually developed into two projects called the He-274 and He-277. They had four seperate engines, but they came too late in the war to help, not 1941 or 1942.




Possum -> (3/26/2002 6:34:21 AM)

Thank You matt for the praise.
In answer to your questions.
1) Sorry, but I can't increase the number of units in the game. As I have stated befor, there are hundreds of units on both sides I had to leave out
due to a lack of slots. I concentrated on ensuring that all of the units that participated in the opening of Barbarossa where present instead.
2) Again, not possible with the current game engine.
The game engine allows only two options with city ownership; It's either an Axis City or a Soviet city.
3) I can increase the manpower value of the Soviet Cities, but allas once they have been captured, there is no growing the manpower back; Again a limitation of the game engine.
Does anyone have an Idea of how much they should be raiesd by?
Personally, I have never had a manpower shortage playing as the Russians, but then I only play vs the Computer.




Muzrub -> (3/26/2002 11:08:14 AM)

Its a shame Matt suggestions cannot be included!


But how's this!

Can the entrenchment value for German allies be lowered or slowed?

ie Rumanian units along the Don (Nov 42) had little anti-tank defenses (small calibre guns etc etc) low training, moral and leadership- and had an ability to abandon defensive postions at the drop of a hat (maybe not all ran- but many did).

Should not their entrenchment value be lowered to reflect their poor defensive skills?


Also believe German entrenchment should be lowered each year ie:

41-6
42 5-6
43 5-4
44 4-3
45 3-1

Something along those lines- this would remove the need for increased manpower for the Soviets- if German defences are decreased each year. It would also reflect the ability for the Soviets to force attacks through Germaan lines.

German defensive barriers always suffered from a lack of material, as it stands in the game the Germans can build a retreat line and it will hold- but with a lack of entrenchment it will give away sooner and reflect the great defesive battles which actually took place to a greater degree of historical accuracy!

I may add this post to its own thread to also invite wider discussion!

Thanks.




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