winter turns

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pratttroy
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:53 pm

winter turns

Post by pratttroy »

The manual states that America will enter the war in the winter of 1943 if it is not attacked or a frozen area violated. However the computer always trears winter turns as if in the next year,ie if it is winter 1942 the computer trears it as winter 1943 an in comes America. I am assuming this just the way it is an America can only be kept out until winter 1942, is this correct? If it is correct then the manual should be changed.

I was playing a games as Germany and japan against tge AI, Russia was gaone and i thought i had another 4 turns to get organized to face America. Winter 1942 came and Japan got to face the surprise rule as America became unfrozen and attacked. It ruined my dreams of world conquest.
Forwarn45
Posts: 718
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:53 am

RE: winter turns

Post by Forwarn45 »

The manual is correct that the US will unfreeze in Winter of 43. What I suspect happened in your game is that Japan attacked both inland China (non-coastal province) and the USSR. In that case, the US enters early (noted at another point in the manual I think) - in Winter of 42.
JanSorensen
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Joined: Sun May 01, 2005 10:18 pm
Location: Aalborg, Denmark

RE: winter turns

Post by JanSorensen »

In this game the year starts with the Winter Season.

In Denmark we traditionally count the seasons as Spring, Summer, Fall, Winter - could that be different elsewhere I wonder and this be the reason for this question?

I know I was surprised for a brief moment too that Fall 40 was followed by Winter 41 making winter the first season of the year rather than the last - but after seeing that in 1940 I realized that winter was simply the first season of the year in WaW.

I did a little search and found this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Season
In the United States, the seasons are often considered to begin at the astronomical solstices and equinoxes: these are sometimes known as the "astronomical seasons". By this reckoning, summer begins at summer solstice, winter at winter solstice, spring at the vernal equinox and autumn at the autumnal equinox.

In the United Kingdom, the seasons are traditionally considered to begin about seven weeks earlier: spring begins on Candlemas, summer on May Day, autumn on Lammas, and winter on All Hallows.

Maybe the confusion is related to this difference.
aauminki
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:05 am

RE: winter turns

Post by aauminki »

I think that simply because two of three winter months fall in Jan/Feb, then that is considered the Winter of the year. Ie. First season of a year is Winter that year, so Winter '43 would be Jan/Feb '43 aka the turn after Fall '42.
JanSorensen
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Location: Aalborg, Denmark

RE: winter turns

Post by JanSorensen »

That is indeed the Scandinavian way of counting the seasons Aauminki.

Does that hold true around the world too?
Forwarn45
Posts: 718
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 1:53 am

RE: winter turns

Post by Forwarn45 »

Winter is usually considered the fourth season in the US. But I think for game purposes aauminki is right and it is the first season of a year in the game because most of the months covered (January and February at least) are at the beginning of the year. But what do I know, here in California we don't have much in the way of seasons. [8D]
aauminki
Posts: 46
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2005 5:05 am

RE: winter turns

Post by aauminki »

ORIGINAL: JanSorensen

That is indeed the Scandinavian way of counting the seasons Aauminki.

Does that hold true around the world too?
I have no idea, but Im pretty sure that the North Pole also is quite cold in Jan/Feb - and as such, we've covered most places worth mentioning in the world, so I suppose it doesnt matter what they call it other places.

On a different note, Im sure the Australians would disagree though [:'(]
pratttroy
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 2:53 pm

RE: winter turns

Post by pratttroy »

I have thought about your idea and it seems to fit the facts, the question is why?If you read in a manual or rule book that an event will take place in the winter of 1943 most people in America would expect the winter 1943 to come after a spring, summer and fall 1943 , not after fall 1942. Seems like a way to caues needless confusion. And if you are going to change the a year starts the manual should make note of it.
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Andrew Brown
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RE: winter turns

Post by Andrew Brown »

ORIGINAL: aauminki
On a different note, Im sure the Australians would disagree though [:'(]

Well I can hardly resist such a challenge [8D]

For us in the Southern hemisphere, calling a turn that covers January to March "winter", when our winter is June to August, is incorrect whatever year it occurs in. However, having the first turn of a year called "winter" makes a lot more sense than having it as the last turn, given that the great majority of the Northern winter is at the start of the year. So the game is correct as far as I am concerned.
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