New bug . . . as far as I know

[Tristanjohn]

In my current PBEM with my Spanish friend Alvaro I was amazed to find Munda going from level 0 port to level 2 overnight.

[Tristanjohn]

All right. This new "sturdier" forum software apparently isn't, plus there's a limit of one image to a post.

Here's the second screen captrue from that game showing Munda at level 2 port the following turn.

[foliveti]

I have also noticed strange goings on with port construction on New Caledonia. At Koumac which has a max size of zero, I decided to scrape out a bit of a port just to move troops in and out without parking transports there forever. The port would build slowly, 1% a day, and then when it got to 10% it would increase to the next level. I wasn't so much surprised by the 1% per day as the big jump from 9% to 100%.

[Nomad]

TristenJohn,
From your screen shot I count 252 engineers and 97 engineering vechiles. Maybe that is enough to go from 0 to 2 for a base with an SPS of 2.

Folivete,
Are you using an old version? That was a problem in the early versions.

[bilbow]

Your base didn't go from 9% to 100%. There's a format problem with that screen- the second digit doesn't display. So the "9%" was really "9x%". Only happens on ports with sps of 0 for some reason.

[Tristanjohn]

Nomad wrote: From your screen shot I count 252 engineers and 97 engineering vechiles. Maybe that is enough to go from 0 to 2 for a base with an SPS of 2.

Folivete,
Are you using an old version? That was a problem in the early versions.

Obviously it is! What I'd like to know is what bug caused that reality this time at that place on the map.

This is bug, pure and simple.

The version I run is the latest and greatest thing. If this "was" a problem with earlier versions I put it to you that it never was completely squashed.

[Nomad]

I don't think it is bug happening at any particular time or place. It would seem that they did not take into account diminishing returns. It looks like they programmed it so that if 100 engineeers can do it in x days then 600 engineers can do it in x/6 days. They may never have considered what happens when a huge number of engineers and engineering vechiles are put on one base. The bottom line is that it is not something that would only happen for you but would happen to anyone putting a large engineering force at a level 0 base/port with a SPS of 2.

[Tristanjohn]

bilbow wrote: Your base didn't go from 9% to 100%. There's a format problem with that screen- the second digit doesn't display. So the "9%" was really "9x%". Only happens on ports with sps of 0 for some reason.

I can hardly read the files I posted but the third file (in the second post of mine to this thread) does show the correct "2" port build for Munda on the next turn. That second file imbedded in the first post of this thread was a system error.

Regardless, it ought to be clear from these imasges that the Munda "port" jumped from 0 (0) to 2 (2) in the space of one turn.

I've no idea what you mean to refer to re percentages. Please clarify.

[Damien Thorn]

ORIGINAL: Nomad
It looks like they programmed it so that if 100 engineeers can do it in x days then 600 engineers can do it in x/6 days. They may never have considered what happens when a huge number of engineers and engineering vechiles are put on one base.

A woman can make a baby in 9 months but I don't think 9 women can make a baby in one month.
[:)]

[Tristanjohn]

Nomad wrote: I don't think it is bug happening at any particular time or place. It would seem that they did not take into account diminishing returns. It looks like they programmed it so that if 100 engineeers can do it in x days then 600 engineers can do it in x/6 days. They may never have considered what happens when a huge number of engineers and engineering vechiles are put on one base. The bottom line is that it is not something that would only happen for you but would happen to anyone putting a large engineering force at a level 0 base/port with a SPS of 2.

That doesn't wash. I've had more engineerying potential still in, for example, Lunga, without seeing anything approaching this craziness.

I don't mean to be rude with this remark, but it strikes me that some of you people have no realistic conception of what is and what is not a "bug" based on any intuition for how a prgram like this ought to perform. I wonder if this is the same problem which apparnetly plagues the playtest team--or did plague it judging from the state I find UV to be in. I'd like to think that testing at Matrix has improved since the release of this game, but I don't know.

Be that as it may, this game is riddled with problems of well-nigh every description. This dual business concerning Munda (the port-build silliness and the inability for a TF to sail there for five or six turns or whatever it was--this is in another thread I posted yesterday) represents just more of the same. The deeper I get into this simulation the more I find that's broken or mistakenly conceived.

[Nomad]

Please read my reply. I did not say it wasn't a bug, only that it probably is not unique to the particular time and place. What were the particulars of you experience with this at Lunga? Since you say you had at least as much engineering power there was there still 2 left on the SPS? Lunga has an SPS of 6 for the airfield. If it was not a level 4 or less then you would not have seen a jump of two. The port has an SPS of 2 and starts as a level 1 port so you would not see it there either.

I know very well what a bug is. You don't seem to be able to read. And you are very rude.

My final remark to you is: Why do you play this game? You obviously find the game completly flawed. Why don't you go and design and program your own game?

[Zeta16]

Why is this not in the bug forum?

[Oleg Mastruko]

ORIGINAL: Tristanjohn

Nomad wrote: I don't think it is bug happening at any particular time or place. It would seem that they did not take into account diminishing returns. It looks like they programmed it so that if 100 engineeers can do it in x days then 600 engineers can do it in x/6 days. They may never have considered what happens when a huge number of engineers and engineering vechiles are put on one base. The bottom line is that it is not something that would only happen for you but would happen to anyone putting a large engineering force at a level 0 base/port with a SPS of 2.

That doesn't wash. I've had more engineerying potential still in, for example, Lunga, without seeing anything approaching this craziness.

I don't mean to be rude with this remark, but it strikes me that some of you people have no realistic conception of what is and what is not a "bug" based on any intuition for how a prgram like this ought to perform. I wonder if this is the same problem which apparnetly plagues the playtest team--or did plague it judging from the state I find UV to be in. I'd like to think that testing at Matrix has improved since the release of this game, but I don't know.

Be that as it may, this game is riddled with problems of well-nigh every description. This dual business concerning Munda (the port-build silliness and the inability for a TF to sail there for five or six turns or whatever it was--this is in another thread I posted yesterday) represents just more of the same. The deeper I get into this simulation the more I find that's broken or mistakenly conceived.

Tristan, overall tone of your posts gets boring really fast. Why do you play this game if it's so riddled with bugs in your opinion? And why didn't you post this in the "Bug report" forum as the netiquette and gentlemanly behavior would suggest? Of course, since you're so sure this is bug and nothing else...

In fact, it's not a bug, it's what others already TRIED to explain but you won't listen. You put mucho engineers in one place and they built what they were ordered to build real fast. End of story. Ah, it's not the first time you pollute the boards with your bug reports that happen to be nothing but your insufficient reading of the manual.

Note, that on the first screen Munda port capacity is not 0 (0) as you say few posts ago, but 0 (2), which means port size 2 can be built without problems at this place, and can be built real fast (provided you put lotsa ENG guys and their machines there, AS YOU DID)

Now why "had more engineerying potential still in, for example, Lunga, without seeing anything approaching this craziness.".

Wow, you won't believe this but it's in the manual, page 54:

"- Construction costs to increase an airfield or port by one increase as the current size of the airfield or port increases (i.e. it takes longer to go from a size 6 to size 7 than from a size 5 to a size 6)." <= See? That's why size 0 to size 2 gets built real fast, and size 4 to size 6 NOT AS FAST not even if it's Lunga with air SPS of 6

"- Once a port or airfield reaches its SPS, the cost of additional construction increases significantly, so you should consider halting construction or risk consuming large quantities of supplies for possibly little benefit. In addition to the normal costs, it takes 10 times longer than normal to increase a current
size 0 airfield with a SPS of zero to a size of 1. These size zero locations were very unsuitable for airfields (such as Wau, which was built on the sideof a mountain)." <= good to know, huh? May help with future "bug reports"

"- Fortification construction costs are based on the SPS of the airfield and port in the base, with longer time required for bases with larger potential. Construction costs lso increase as the current Fortification Level increases." <= again, good to know, that's why fortifying Lunga takes time, and fortifying 1-1 locatiog is done quickly

Now please let this thread die as it should have already...

Oleg