Pearl Harbor's Red Hill
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Pearl Harbor's Red Hill
Red Hill was a top secret fuel depot built into a hill near Pearl Harbor. It was under construction at the beginning of the war. It quickly became a top priority project and over 3300 men worked around the clock to finish the project. The first tank was finished about 9 months after the attack on Pearl Harbor.
There are 20 tanks of 12 million gallons each.
These tanks are still in use today, being used for fuel for the Pacific Fleet. Some tanks are currently (4) used to handle Jet fuel.
I thought this might be of interest.
The facility was listed as a historical engineering landmark (or something like that) a few years ago.
There are 20 tanks of 12 million gallons each.
These tanks are still in use today, being used for fuel for the Pacific Fleet. Some tanks are currently (4) used to handle Jet fuel.
I thought this might be of interest.
The facility was listed as a historical engineering landmark (or something like that) a few years ago.
- madflava13
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- Location: Alexandria, VA
So it took 9 months to build.....
Considering that it WONT take anything like 9 months
to build a port from scratch and duplicate Pearl Harbor
in the game......
What then does that say about the games realism?
Just curious.
OR does Pearl Harbor get some enhanced utility that
no other port gets?
Considering that it WONT take anything like 9 months
to build a port from scratch and duplicate Pearl Harbor
in the game......
What then does that say about the games realism?
Just curious.
OR does Pearl Harbor get some enhanced utility that
no other port gets?
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
- madflava13
- Posts: 1501
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 10:00 am
- Location: Alexandria, VA
I think the port size is more of a reflection of docks, cranes, etc. Those items don't take nearly as long to complete as the Red Hill tanks. They were bored out of solid rock, often by hand. So for me, I don't have a problem with port build times - I think of it more as adding docks, dredging, etc. Red Hill was an extreme engineering project that isn't normally found in even a huge harbor. Just my $.02 though...
"The Paraguayan Air Force's request for spraying subsidies was not as Paraguayan as it were..."
What is your point, Chiteng?
I know nothing about Red Hill (don't watch the Travel Channel), but I'm guessing it's not modeled in the game. Due to its apparently unique nature (historic engineering feat having been dug inside a mountain, etc.), I don't see where anything else modeled in the game is comparable. Given favorable natural conditions and sufficient commitment of resources, I think nine months is a reasonable time to build sufficient facilities to enable a port to have Pearl Harbor-scaled capabilities - other than Red Hill, which isn't modeled anyway.
I'm just waiting for someone to request that, after January 1, 1943, x amount of fuel points at Pearl should be impervious to reduction by bombing.
I know nothing about Red Hill (don't watch the Travel Channel), but I'm guessing it's not modeled in the game. Due to its apparently unique nature (historic engineering feat having been dug inside a mountain, etc.), I don't see where anything else modeled in the game is comparable. Given favorable natural conditions and sufficient commitment of resources, I think nine months is a reasonable time to build sufficient facilities to enable a port to have Pearl Harbor-scaled capabilities - other than Red Hill, which isn't modeled anyway.
I'm just waiting for someone to request that, after January 1, 1943, x amount of fuel points at Pearl should be impervious to reduction by bombing.
Originally posted by byron13
What is your point, Chiteng?
I know nothing about Red Hill (don't watch the Travel Channel), but I'm guessing it's not modeled in the game. Due to its apparently unique nature (historic engineering feat having been dug inside a mountain, etc.), I don't see where anything else modeled in the game is comparable. Given favorable natural conditions and sufficient commitment of resources, I think nine months is a reasonable time to build sufficient facilities to enable a port to have Pearl Harbor-scaled capabilities - other than Red Hill, which isn't modeled anyway.
I'm just waiting for someone to request that, after January 1, 1943, x amount of fuel points at Pearl should be impervious to reduction by bombing.
The point obviously is I question some aspects of the games realism
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Originally posted by Chiteng
So it took 9 months to build.....
Considering that it WONT take anything like 9 months
to build a port from scratch and duplicate Pearl Harbor
in the game......
What then does that say about the games realism?
Just curious.
OR does Pearl Harbor get some enhanced utility that
no other port gets?
Chiteng
Now, how do you know this? Pearl Harbor is only represented abstractly in UV. If you are talking about a level 9 port doesnt take 9 months, then ok, but for all we know Pearl is a level 50 port.
Aren't you an alpha tester? What size is PH in WitP? How long does it take in the current alpha to build a port from nothing to max.
IMO, Japan, US, and PH should have enhanced utility, like quicker repair, load and unload times than any other ports regardless of size.
- madflava13
- Posts: 1501
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 10:00 am
- Location: Alexandria, VA
TIMJOT-
I'd possibly add Takao to that list. I know that at least at some points during the war there were several dry docks there so repair work would obviously be more effective... I couldn't tell you if those facilities were there from the get-go however.
I'd possibly add Takao to that list. I know that at least at some points during the war there were several dry docks there so repair work would obviously be more effective... I couldn't tell you if those facilities were there from the get-go however.
"The Paraguayan Air Force's request for spraying subsidies was not as Paraguayan as it were..."
Aren't you an alpha tester? What size is PH in WitP? How long does it take in the current alpha to build a port from nothing to max.
The building time depends on a number of factors such as engineers, supply, etc. I haven't tested how long it would take to build a port from scratch to full size, it would be difficult because I'm not sure there are any undeveloped natural harbors that have the potential to be raised to that high of a level. Also, keep in mind PH has things like merchant and naval shipyards, manpower, etc which aren't represented in a base rating of 1-10 and cannot be built in game.
Therefore Chiteng's comparison isn't accurate, and he also isn't a tester. If he were a tester he wouldn't be posting criticisms of that nature knowing that the game is still in Alpha phase and so many things are eligible to be changed.
The building time depends on a number of factors such as engineers, supply, etc. I haven't tested how long it would take to build a port from scratch to full size, it would be difficult because I'm not sure there are any undeveloped natural harbors that have the potential to be raised to that high of a level. Also, keep in mind PH has things like merchant and naval shipyards, manpower, etc which aren't represented in a base rating of 1-10 and cannot be built in game.
Therefore Chiteng's comparison isn't accurate, and he also isn't a tester. If he were a tester he wouldn't be posting criticisms of that nature knowing that the game is still in Alpha phase and so many things are eligible to be changed.
"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
"Habit is the balast that chains a dog to it's vomit." -Samuel Becket
"He has weapons of mass destruction- the world's deadliest weapons- which pose a direct threat to the
Madflava,Originally posted by madflava13
TIMJOT-
I'd possibly add Takao to that list. I know that at least at some points during the war there were several dry docks there so repair work would obviously be more effective... I couldn't tell you if those facilities were there from the get-go however.
Yes, I agree Takao should also be considered. I am sure there are a few others as well. Singapore comes to mind. If the Brits could have supplied and maned it properly it would have made a first rate base.
Originally posted by Snigbert
Aren't you an alpha tester? What size is PH in WitP? How long does it take in the current alpha to build a port from nothing to max.
The building time depends on a number of factors such as engineers, supply, etc. I haven't tested how long it would take to build a port from scratch to full size, it would be difficult because I'm not sure there are any undeveloped natural harbors that have the potential to be raised to that high of a level. Also, keep in mind PH has things like merchant and naval shipyards, manpower, etc which aren't represented in a base rating of 1-10 and cannot be built in game.
Therefore Chiteng's comparison isn't accurate, and he also isn't a tester. If he were a tester he wouldn't be posting criticisms of that nature knowing that the game is still in Alpha phase and so many things are eligible to be changed.
Snigbert
Sorry my bad, I guess I got Chiteng confused with someone else. Thanks for setting me straight.
Its sounds like the baseing issues are being addressed. Thanks for the insite.
Regards
Originally posted by Snigbert
Aren't you an alpha tester? What size is PH in WitP? How long does it take in the current alpha to build a port from nothing to max.
The building time depends on a number of factors such as engineers, supply, etc. I haven't tested how long it would take to build a port from scratch to full size, it would be difficult because I'm not sure there are any undeveloped natural harbors that have the potential to be raised to that high of a level. Also, keep in mind PH has things like merchant and naval shipyards, manpower, etc which aren't represented in a base rating of 1-10 and cannot be built in game.
Therefore Chiteng's comparison isn't accurate, and he also isn't a tester. If he were a tester he wouldn't be posting criticisms of that nature knowing that the game is still in Alpha phase and so many things are eligible to be changed.
Yes I would. To me the MOST important aspect is its realism.
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
- madflava13
- Posts: 1501
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 10:00 am
- Location: Alexandria, VA
I say let's save our freak-outs until it's Beta time and we're nearer to the release date. If we're close and a PT boat sinks the Yamato after repairing in a port that was just built to level 9 in 6 hours while millions of B-29s fly clear across the Pacific to bomb Tokyo from San Francisco, then let's scream bloody murder. Until then, I say wait and see before critcizing...
The testers shouldn't have to keep reminding everyone what stage we're in, ok? And there's also that ultimate power we have as consumers to not buy the game if we're not satisfied...
The testers shouldn't have to keep reminding everyone what stage we're in, ok? And there's also that ultimate power we have as consumers to not buy the game if we're not satisfied...
"The Paraguayan Air Force's request for spraying subsidies was not as Paraguayan as it were..."
- pasternakski
- Posts: 5567
- Joined: Sat Jun 29, 2002 7:42 pm
Originally posted by Chiteng
Yes I would. To me the MOST important aspect is its realism.
The most important aspect to me is employee loyalty and understanding of your role. I doubt that a self-important horse's @$$ like you would last long in my organization.
Put my faith in the people
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.
And the people let me down.
So, I turned the other way,
And I carry on anyhow.
12 Million Gallons vs Port Size
I don't see what one has to do with the other.
Currently there is no limit / waste mechanism for warehousing / POL storage in the game.
Port size only effects repair and loading / unloading rates. Not storage of material or the number of ships that may load / unload or refuel at a time.
Currently there is no limit / waste mechanism for warehousing / POL storage in the game.
Port size only effects repair and loading / unloading rates. Not storage of material or the number of ships that may load / unload or refuel at a time.
The Wake
Originally posted by pasternakski
The most important aspect to me is employee loyalty and understanding of your role. I doubt that a self-important horse's @$$ like you would last long in my organization.
And why would I want to belong to any organization controlled
by you?
What possible purpose would be served?
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Originally posted by madflava13
I say let's save our freak-outs until it's Beta time and we're nearer to the release date. If we're close and a PT boat sinks the Yamato after repairing in a port that was just built to level 9 in 6 hours while millions of B-29s fly clear across the Pacific to bomb Tokyo from San Francisco, then let's scream bloody murder. Until then, I say wait and see before critcizing...
The testers shouldn't have to keep reminding everyone what stage we're in, ok? And there's also that ultimate power we have as consumers to not buy the game if we're not satisfied...
I will just offer the experience of UV to highlight why I dont wait.
Do you see any chance that Matrix will modify the UV engine in the future? And that is a finished product.
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
- madflava13
- Posts: 1501
- Joined: Wed Feb 07, 2001 10:00 am
- Location: Alexandria, VA
It's been said repeatedly that WiTP is the main focus right now. Once it's out, another patch for UV will be forthcoming. I would suggest to anyone such as yourself with nothing but negative comments that instead of complaining all the time about how unworkable these titles are, why not either wait and see what the final project is or else just stop being a customer. I for one am very tired of reading your bitching months before you have a clue what the game will be like...
"The Paraguayan Air Force's request for spraying subsidies was not as Paraguayan as it were..."
Originally posted by madflava13
It's been said repeatedly that WiTP is the main focus right now. Once it's out, another patch for UV will be forthcoming. I would suggest to anyone such as yourself with nothing but negative comments that instead of complaining all the time about how unworkable these titles are, why not either wait and see what the final project is or else just stop being a customer. I for one am very tired of reading your bitching months before you have a clue what the game will be like...
How unfortunate for you =)
Ignore exists, I suggest you use it then. I dont allow other people
to define my actions.
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Originally posted by madflava13
It's been said repeatedly that WiTP is the main focus right now. Once it's out, another patch for UV will be forthcoming. I would suggest to anyone such as yourself with nothing but negative comments that instead of complaining all the time about how unworkable these titles are, why not either wait and see what the final project is or else just stop being a customer. I for one am very tired of reading your bitching months before you have a clue what the game will be like...
I dont care in WITP is the main focus. If it is merely a port of UV
then ALL the things I dont like in UV, are just as germane in WitP.
So far I have heard NOTHING to indicate that it is anything other than a simple port.
“It is clear that the individual who persecutes a man, his brother, because he is not of the same opinion, is a monster.”
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic
Voltaire
'For those with faith, no proof is needed. For those without faith, no proof is enough'
French Priest
"Statistic