Late war

[dhucul2011]

Hi Bill:

Some changes to look at for late war:

1. After I DOW Vichy France as the Allies they get some partisans that pop up in the following turns saying "French Liberate Corsica etc." However, they are Axis partisans and I have to attack them. This is not as intended I don't think.
2. Romania and Bulgaria should surrender much sooner than they do. I had to take both capitals even though I had dozens of Soviet units moving upon them.
3. Italy should also surrender much sooner. I had taken all of Northern Italy and had to take Rome before they surrendered.\

Thanks!

[BillRunacre]

Hi David

Thanks for this. [:)]

1. I'll probably have to add a dummy DECISION to deal with this situation.

2. I could possibly increase the % chance of them switching sides when Soviet units approach, especially Bulgaria. Though I don't intend to make it guaranteed either.

3. It may be that the juicy National Morale targets are more in the south. I'll see about this.

[The Land]

On the subject of Vichy partisans, it find it a bit odd that after an Axis invasion of Vichy, any partisans that appear will not move into non-Vichy France.

I understand this is because partisans are restricted to 'their' country, but it's kinda odd in these circumstances (maybe a dummy event to recombine conquered Vichy with conquered France?)

[BillRunacre]

Interesting, I'll have a think about that, and also consider how much work it might be.

[PvtBenjamin]

ORIGINAL: dhucul2011

Hi Bill:

Some changes to look at for late war:


2. Romania and Bulgaria should surrender much sooner than they do. I had to take both capitals even though I had dozens of Soviet units moving upon them.
3. Italy should also surrender much sooner. I had taken all of Northern Italy and had to take Rome before they surrendered.\

Thanks!

2) I don't agree.

3) Can't agree again. There are several cities/ports that will drive the Italians away from the Axis. Many are South/East of Rome.

[dhucul2011]

You don’t think that if the invasion had come in the North taking Turin, Milan and Venice the Italians wouldn’t have surrendered just as quickly.....absolutely they would have. Allies shouldn’t be forced to take the Southern route when they can instead take the industrial north and achieve the same effect.

When millions of Soviets on the Romanian border Romania and Bulgaria were itching to surrender.

Sorry, don’t agree with your rather vague “don’t agree”.

[PvtBenjamin]

Bulgaria already has the possibility of switching sides.

Its the general consensus (tournament backs it up) that v1.15 in PBEM was close to equilibrium in the game. v1.16 with new changes we'll see.

Your Romania argument certainly has some historic validity. IMO the issue is a history vs "the game" one. Changing the Romania surrender conditions as you suggest would be a large advantage for the Allies. This advantage would have to be offset some where else in the game. IMO its marginal and not worth searching for an offset.

In the case of Italy historically if the Allies controlled Northern Italy but not NA/Albania/Sicily/Rome Im not sure they would surrender. When it comes to SC3 as Allies you need to drive Italian national morale to 0. Knowing all the targets that reduce Italian Morale and focusing your attack accordingly will result in an easier surrender.

[dhucul2011]

Easy solution is to have Venice and Milan have same NM value as Naples.

Also to increase distance check for Soviet units near Bucharest to 6 and Sofia to 10.

This is more historical. Play balance should not trump realism in every case.

[PvtBenjamin]

Are you familiar with the NM Objectives? Venice, Milan & Naples are all NM Objectives, that is capturing them lowers Italian NM by 10% each. There are 5 NM Objectives in Northern Italy. In your game did you take all the NM objectives in Northern Africa. There are 3.

Again if the Allies in the real war controlled Northern Italy but not Rome, Albania, Sicily & Northern Africa I'm not sure the Italians would have surrendered.

If the game allowed Italy to surrender with just Northern Italy NM captured the gamer would take advantage. Like an all out assault on Northern Italy the minute Italy declared war. Thus possibly making Italy surrender in 1939 by losing Northern Italy.

At best for the Axis Italy would have to keep a majority of its troops in Northern Italy to defend and wouldn't be able to defend Northern Africa. This would lead to the Africa Corp entering at a unfavorable location.

Your Romania idea would also need much stronger constraints. What if the Axis has 3x the troops in Romania of the SU would Romania still switch. What is the Germans controlled Leningrad/Moscow/Stalingrad and your soviet troops were encircled? Would Romania switch then?

see my points?

[ArmouredLion]

Are you familiar with the NM Objectives?

Man, I wasn't...thanks. Glad I read this post. I thought it just gave you supply... Time to top skimming and read the good ole' manual.

[PvtBenjamin]

ORIGINAL: ArmouredLion

Are you familiar with the NM Objectives?

Man, I wasn't...thanks. Glad I read this post. I thought it just gave you supply... Time to top skimming and read the good ole' manual.

Your dumb as fox my man, dumb as a fox

[ArmouredLion]

... Unfortunately, my'stellar' record of 1 and about 15 says dumb as a stump...

Only one way to go is up, I guess...

... Some day I'll get my revenge on you (wrings hands menacingly)... Maybe this NM revelation will kick me into gear.