Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Brian Kellys Desert War: 1940-42 captures the drama of the campaign for North Africa during World War II.
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76mm
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by 76mm »

ORIGINAL: jjdenver
One preview said that one of the game devs actually got angry (on a forum I think) at someone who didn't get the interface or didn't like the interface. This felt a bit weird and made me think the devs aren't really interested in helping customers enjoy the game so that put me off but just a bit.
I've seen this mentioned a couple of times now and want to say that I gave the dev quite a few comments over the years while the game was being developed and he was never anything but totally gracious and appreciative of feedback. Of course my feedback was in the vein of "constructive criticism" so if this previewer came across as an asshat troll, Brian might have reacted differently, dunno. But to argue that he is "not really interested in helping customers enjoy the game" is a real stretch...this thread would seem to prove that!
Rusty1961
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Rusty1961 »

No grand campaign. Sorry, this is 2018, not 1998.
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Tejszd
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Tejszd »

Very tempted due to the WEGO system. Owned all the V for Victory and World At War games....

But haven’t bought this due to the following concerns;
1) java - prefer to have the least things installed. Especially that need/want to auto start, call home and needs updates to be secure.
2) number of clicks - prefer smaller scenarios or larger units. An option for all units to go to the HQ’s destination.
3) AI - does it being scripted hurt replay ability?
4) lack of campaign
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Okayrun3254
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Okayrun3254 »

I am curious. What sort of "campaign" is expected? Are there any other solid games at this scale and time period that offer a "campaign"?
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by KarlXII »

Thought of buying this with my anniversary coupon but choosed Piercing Fortress Europe due to the fact it had campaign mode and seemed a bit easier to learn.
Still thinking of buying this game if and when it goes for sale but lacking a campaign (the whole north africa 1940-1943 or at least smaller campaigns with linked scenarios) is a major downside for me.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by kch »

ORIGINAL: bcgames

ORIGINAL: scout1

I started as a beta tester and struggled to figure out the game system .... and I am a long time gamer .....
lack of a campaign or LONG term scenario was a downer ..... really attracted to the WEGO approach .....
Sorry to hear of your beta experience. Have things become more clear with the publication of the game, quick-start guide, manual, and tutorials? What other questions do you have on the subject?

Also sorry to say, there will never be a "long-term" scenario for Desert War at 3-turns per day. The immediate future for the engine is the Eastern Front @ 5-turns per day--scenarios short and sweet. I recommend looking to other, more capable game engines for your Full Med Experience. I am ever hopeful for a Gary Grigsby treatment of the topic. Fingers crossed.

Hope you can find the time to discover Desert War for what it is...warts and all.

Thanks for all the energy you have put into this game. Will the Eastern Front game track individual equipment (vehicles, artillery etc) in the units and tally up losses? I know that it is a detail, but I do like tonnes of stats in my games.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by canuckgamer »

Although I like the WEGO system I haven't bought the game yet because I don't like the look of the counters. I know, it sounds trivial but there is just something about the look of them that doesn't appeal to me. I may still end up buying it because when WEGO is done well like the Combat Mission series, it is the way to go for wargames.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

ORIGINAL: canuckgamer
Although I like the WEGO system I haven't bought the game yet because I don't like the look of the counters.
Thanks for the feedback. How would you change the look of the counters?
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Firebri
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Firebri »

Have a look at the counters, used in LnL Heroes of Stalingrad.

The are quite smart.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

I'll have a look. Thanks.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by jjdenver »

ORIGINAL: Okayrun3254
I am curious. What sort of "campaign" is expected? Are there any other solid games at this scale and time period that offer a "campaign"?

Lack of campaign is also a big decision factor for me in any game. But I think I'd buy a game that made the scale/stacking and possibly interface level improvements from this developer just to get the battles. I always prefer campaigns but I remember really enjoying the operational level scenarios that Atomic Games Operation Crusader included. Those were not small scale - they covered large battles that were very interesting but at a playable scale (# of units to manage was high but not ridiculous). I also played some even larger scenarios in Atomic Games Stalingrad game including the monster full campaign scenario (just 1 scenario but covered a huge map and long timeline. It was large but you could build up to it by playing some smaller scenarios that simulated just some parts of the full campaign scenario, and unit stacks never became too much of a burden iirc.

Anyway on to campaign. I think there are 2(?) basic types of campaigns that could be included:

1) chained scenarios with some carry-over effect and branching a la panzer general. This can be accomplished by letting units (slowly!!) accumulate experience, by giving some currency for achievements during the previous battles and the currency can be spent to mildly improve your situation in the next battle (i.e. extra air support, or an extra regiment of artillery, etc), or in other ways.
2) A large "campaign" single scenario that covers the full timeline of all the small scenarios and the full map area. This is of think harder for developers to play balance and get right since there will be various events (reinforcements or negative effects triggered by player actions in game). For example if an airfield is taken maybe air missions are reduced, or if a rail station is captured supply is harder to distribute, or if a port is captured enemy supply might be easier, etc etc.

In any case I hope the next game can include some campaign(s) since I think I'd enjoy it and so would most players. Campaigns is one of the main reasons for the popularity of panzer general imo. The tactical battles aren't really very awesome and imo the campaign design is kinda stupid (why are there an infinite number of polish tanks rolling at the germans in a scenario for example) but have a bigger/longer picture to consider while playing the tactical battles.
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Steely Glint
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Steely Glint »

Too much clicking.
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Ron
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Ron »

I did have this on my wish list, but held back from buying due to AI limitations. I messed around with the previous free version and was very interested in seeing the concept develop, especially the Desert War theatre, but that too had almost an almost non existent AI, forgivable due to the state of the game. However, after reading AARs and people's impressions it appears nothing has really changed in that regard. Perhaps not a fair comparison at all but I ended up revisiting and getting the updated TOAWIV, great game and has a fairly challenging AI imo.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Omnius »

Just waiting for the Xmas sale coming soon. I don't buy games upon initial release, they're just not ready for prime time. I like to buy games that are pretty much developed and patched, at least a year after release. I recently bought the Distant Worlds:Universe game and enjoy playing a game that has few bugs. I'll also buy the TOAW4 game this Xmas sale since it's over a year old now and I'll play that first before delving into Desert War. By then there may be a third or fourth patch. I'm looking forward to seeing what comes next in this series. I love WEGO games so am rooting for this game to be successful!
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by sIg3b »

Didn´t buy it, because the AI is generally said no to be cut-throat. I am only interested in SP and want a terribly strong Computer opponent.

Also, I don´t care much for WEGO. A Chess-like IGOUGO with a (nearly) Chess-like AI would have been an instant buy.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

Thanks for the feedback everyone. Keep it coming. Every bit is considered.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

Bump.
Werewolf13
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by Werewolf13 »

1) Price too high. Definitely buy at a $19.99 price point. Leaning towards buying at the sale price point but...
2) Number of units in most scenarios too high for my liking. Used to like monster games (this one looks like a small monster) but as I grow older I find myself becoming less and less tolerant of having to deal with a 100+ units/turn.

N. Africa Campaign is one of my favorite in WWII, Italy campaign being my favorite. N.Africa is a big selling point for me.
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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

ORIGINAL: Werewolf13
N. Africa Campaign is one of my favorite in WWII, Italy campaign being my favorite.
If the Italian Campaign is your favorite, keep an eye out for my upcoming Salerno scenario. I've been working hard on this one:

tm.asp?m=4572815

Stay tuned.

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RE: Desert War: Why Didn't You Buy?

Post by bcgames »

ORIGINAL: sIg3b

Didn´t buy it, because the AI is generally said no to be cut-throat. I am only interested in SP and want a terribly strong Computer opponent.
We got the message on this one; Slitherine coached us to exert a soft AI-hand over The Player. Our intent now is to deliver the opponent back to the Stone Age. Let's see what we can do to make single-player less soft-handed.
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