M60A3TTS Full of Hot Air - MarauderPL (Axis) vs M60 (Soviet)

[chaos45]

I also think M60s screenshots perfectly capture the game play issues with the Super Lvov move- there will be almost no soviet forces left in the far south by Soviet T3. So its leaves the Soviets players with basically no real army until around T8+

As T2 the Axis armor will sweep south to catch a lot of the units that pulled back from the Romanian border, and closing the pocket on the soviet reserve armor in the south.

This coupled with Frozen status for many soviet units quickly makes the Soviet players position almost impossible against an Axis player of any skill. Axis players can almost Reach Leningrad before forces there unfreeze its abit ridiculous.

[M60A3TTS]

Turn 2

Here is the area around Pskov. I am taking a page from HardLuckYetAgain's playbook in defending here. I haven't been blessed with any 60+ morale units, but Zhukov and the 27th Army are in this area. The 8th and 11th Army HQs of Northwest Front are still trying to get into a position where they can actually take control of units. In this screenshot, I have managed to take advantage of Marauder's aggressiveness by cutting off the supply path of a panzer division using a single security regiment.



The 27th receives all of the available AA support units.



AA support units were retrieved at Kiev and Pskov and will be sent to 27th Army next week as well.

Airpower is positioned to provide heavy coverage as the Germans advance on Leningrad. Northern and Northwest Air Commands receives over a thousand aircraft in support.






Long Range and Western Air Commands also have in the neighborhood of a thousand planes.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

Turn 2

The 27th receives all of the available AA support units.

Very interesting on the deployment of the AA. I tried this once with mixed feelings on my part. I want to see this play out with the increased effectiveness of the AA now against aircraft. Good luck M60

(Just a note that I never play around with the TOE of HQ's since I always keep them at 100% to not incur any penalties. 88% is more than fine but I just personally don't like riding that train)

[chaos45]

you want HQs at 100% of you can maintain it....as Morveal changed the dice rolls for command and you eat a penalty for ever single % you are under 100 now. Previously it was based on every 10% so you wanted 90-91% ToE but since the change you now want 100% if you can for no command roll penalties.

[M60A3TTS]

Thanks Chaos, I will set them as appropriate to 100%. I'm not clear why it was decided to set the sceanario to different levels in the first place.

[M60A3TTS]

Week 3 was primarily used by the Axis to bring the infantry up while the panzers bided their time. German units came within four hexes of Vitebsk, so all the AA units here were withdrawn at 1AP each.




Zhukov in command of 27th Army continues to receive priority on all the AA units released from city garrison duty.




Ivan Kopets was relieved of duty from Western Air Command and replaced by T. Khryukin.

[xhoel]

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

[Saulust]

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

That is what he said, so I hope so, since it would be good to have this subject in the one place on its own IMHO. [:)]

Oh boy jolly good, this is timely for me since I am just getting around to finally fixing my Soviet Airforce on turn 21 after neglecting it in my first real play through of a GC as the Reds. On T22 I shall finish off eliminating almost every single starting German ground unit and early arriving Divs/Bgds/Rgmts as well as the very last Italian ground unit, but I now soon need to take out the resurgent Ostheer 2.0 and the re-birthed Italian shells. So I need to prepare my Soviet airforce to assist effectively with the final offensive... or two. [8|]

This 'not' so full of hot air thread has already totally helped me out with my current game and on T21 alone I am spending 80 AP on Air stuff thanks M60tits. [&o]

[M60A3TTS]

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

The emphasis will be on the air campaign, but the ground part won't be ignored. It's easier to appreciate why certain things are going on in the air when you have an understanding of what is also happening on the ground. There are many fine AARs out there, including yours, but very few that extensively cover the air strategies.

Also, most of the recent patch changes have most significantly impacted Soviet air power, especially with the addition of many AA units that can be pulled from cities where they would otherwise die, and instead be massed in armies. Those will for the most part live to fight throughout the entire war, and have a negative effect on the Luftwaffe. How much of an effect it will have, we will find out.

[xhoel]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

The emphasis will be on the air campaign, but the ground part won't be ignored. It's easier to appreciate why certain things are going on in the air when you have an understanding of what is also happening on the ground. There are many fine AARs out there, including yours, but very few that extensively cover the air strategies.

Also, most of the recent patch changes have most significantly impacted Soviet air power, especially with the addition of many AA units that can be pulled from cities where they would otherwise die, and instead be massed in armies. Those will for the most part live to fight throughout the entire war, and have a negative effect on the Luftwaffe. How much of an effect it will have, we will find out.

That is really nice to hear. While I enjoy the air game quite a lot, I have only played the Axis side which is easier to manage due to fewer air groups. I guess managing (or rather micromanaging) the VVS will be quite a challenge. With that being said I look forward to reading the AAR and to learning new stuff about the air game.

With regards to AA guns, I know that the latest patches have increased the numbers of AA units present (as it was historically). AFAIK AA guns amount to almost 10k. How big of a difference is there numbers wise with the AA guns that the Soviets had in the older patches? How many more guns were added I mean?

Thanks for the comment about my AAR!

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

The emphasis will be on the air campaign, but the ground part won't be ignored. It's easier to appreciate why certain things are going on in the air when you have an understanding of what is also happening on the ground. There are many fine AARs out there, including yours, but very few that extensively cover the air strategies.

Also, most of the recent patch changes have most significantly impacted Soviet air power, especially with the addition of many AA units that can be pulled from cities where they would otherwise die, and instead be massed in armies. Those will for the most part live to fight throughout the entire war, and have a negative effect on the Luftwaffe. How much of an effect it will have, we will find out.

I have always advocated the strong use of Soviet Air power I like this so far. When I update my two AAR's maybe do a compare and contrast.

You could always pull out the AA from the cities (don't remember the patch that was initiated in). To some it was just not worth it before the current patch of .03 since Soviet AA was total crap before then. But, I will give one good thing about the AA now. Put your airbase with Soviet recon in a City with AA (i.e. Moscow) I bet the Germans wont come back to bomb that airfield a second time. Then during your turn just move it one hex out and Recon and at the end of the turn put it back.

I see you didn't send all of your VVS to reserves. That is a good thing To me that is a big thumbs up 👍 Seen that done so many times when I used to play Germany and I just shake my head.

[HardLuckYetAgain]

ORIGINAL: xhoel

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

ORIGINAL: xhoel

Interesting AAR. Will you be covering only the air game?

The emphasis will be on the air campaign, but the ground part won't be ignored. It's easier to appreciate why certain things are going on in the air when you have an understanding of what is also happening on the ground. There are many fine AARs out there, including yours, but very few that extensively cover the air strategies.

Also, most of the recent patch changes have most significantly impacted Soviet air power, especially with the addition of many AA units that can be pulled from cities where they would otherwise die, and instead be massed in armies. Those will for the most part live to fight throughout the entire war, and have a negative effect on the Luftwaffe. How much of an effect it will have, we will find out.

I guess managing (or rather micromanaging) the VVS will be quite a challenge.

IMO the VVS is pretty easy to take care of once you know what you are doing. Of course that takes a few games to get under your belt but the VVS really isn't that bad. By turn 4 you should have everything set for the long haul, turn 5 at the latest ✔

[HardLuckYetAgain]

Thank you for sharing this information M60 I am looking forward to your hard work which is always GREAT to read!!! ❤

[M60A3TTS]

Week 4

A couple more pics than last week...

At Pskov, units of Northern Front are joining in the defense. 28th Army under Ivan Konev begins to form to the east of Zhukov's 27th Army.




AA guns are split fairly evenly between the two main armies. These should help combat the Luftwaffe formations headed to this area.






The Finns also became active this week, so the AA guns from Vyborg were withdrawn as the city remains in Soviet hands this week.




In the center, Vitebsk is only held by a security regiment. Smolensk is held by Western Front for the moment.



Reserve Front has been formed with 20th, 24th, 29th and 31st Armies.



In the south, Southwestern and Southern Fronts are partially re-formed with what second echelon divisions are available. The Dnepr cannot be held for long, but the Red Army here is safe for the moment.




Aircraft distribution between the various commands continues to be spread among Northern, Northwestern and Western Air Commands in addition to Long Range Air Command.

[M60A3TTS]

ORIGINAL: xhoel
With regards to AA guns, I know that the latest patches have increased the numbers of AA units present (as it was historically). AFAIK AA guns amount to almost 10k. How big of a difference is there numbers wise with the AA guns that the Soviets had in the older patches? How many more guns were added I mean?

If you had started a game a little over a year ago as Soviets, you had about 1,450 in support units. The regiments were 1/5th the size of the current ones. As of Week 4 of this one, Zhukov and Konev alone have close to the same number, and there are another 7,000 more beyond that.


Here is what the 8MP game that started in 2017 roughly started out with.

[xhoel]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS

ORIGINAL: xhoel
With regards to AA guns, I know that the latest patches have increased the numbers of AA units present (as it was historically). AFAIK AA guns amount to almost 10k. How big of a difference is there numbers wise with the AA guns that the Soviets had in the older patches? How many more guns were added I mean?

If you had started a game a little over a year ago as Soviets, you had about 1,450 in support units. The regiments were 1/5th the size of the current ones. As of Week 4 of this one, Zhukov and Konev alone have close to the same number, and there are another 7,000 more beyond that.


Here is what the 8MP game that started in 2017 roughly started out with.

Thanks for providing the screenshot. It is a substantial increase but one that was needed, in order to come close to the actual numbers. Glad to see morvael and Dennis fixed it (together with the effectiveness of the AA).

In terms of AA activation does the AA put in the 2 Armies (27th and 29th) activate when the Luftwaffe attacks withing a certain hex range? Or they activate when the units under the command of the Army are attacked regardless of range from HQ?

[M60A3TTS]

All AA support units activate when an enemy air mission is within a 5 hex radius of the owning HQ.

[Telemecus]

Are there activation for overflights, no matter how far the battle results?

There were mentions of activations for non-owning HQs (as in not in the chain of command for that unit) for battles within two hexes.

I have never been too sure about these descriptions in addition to the owning HQ one.

Can these be confirmed or refuted?

[M60A3TTS]

ORIGINAL: Telemecus

Are there activation for overflights, no matter how far the battle results?

There were mentions of activations for non-owning HQs (as in not in the chain of command for that unit) for battles within two hexes.

I have never been too sure about these descriptions in addition to the owning HQ one.

Can these be confirmed or refuted?

Yes, the activation for overflights takes place if the combat unit is within 5 hexes of the parent HQ that has the AA units. If the overflight takes place on a unit greater than 5 hexes from its HQ, there is no activation.

[Telemecus]

ORIGINAL: M60A3TTS
Yes, the activation for overflights takes place if the combat unit is within 5 hexes of the parent HQ that has the AA units. If the overflight takes place on a unit greater than 5 hexes from its HQ, there is no activation.

Just to clarify - you are saying the AA can activate for a unit that is
i) overflown
ii) within five hexes of the parent HQ holding the AA
iii) does not have to be in the final battle destination for the airgroups?

So in theory if you place the units of HQs with AA correctly, you could create a "wall" of flak with them that must be crossed and battled, even if the target destination is far in the rear and has no flak?