Kokoda airstrip

[Yaab]

https://kokodatrekkingaust.com.au/history-of-kokoda/

"November 1942 (Aust. Advance) Just three months later, on the first day of November, but after long weeks of heavy fighting in sometimes horrendous conditions, the Australians were back in Kokoda – their entry unopposed. The Japanese were by now in full retreat. The air-strip, which the Japanese had not used and allowed to become overgrown, was cleaned up, and Kokoda quickly became a central part of the next stage of the campaign, the thrust to the sea and victory in Papua New Guinea (Ham pp383-5)."

Why didn't the Japs use the Kokoda airstrip? Did they resupply the troops by air perhaps?

[spence]

Logistics was not the IJA's strong suit. From some incidental reading I have done (relating more to the CAS question in the Forum) it seems that the Japanese did not have a lot of transport aircraft and parceled those they did have into "penny packets". I don't know whether the games flexibility allows for the IJ Player to remedy this while still expanding their more combat capable aircraft.

The initial IJA plan seems to have been for a rapid overland advance supplied by pack horses counting on the IJAs ability to move rapidly over tough terrain. Their leadership in Tokyo told them there was a "road" from Buna to Port Moresby. They didn't count on the "road" being a track and the terrain to be as forbidding as it was in fact.

Multiple mentions of the disease ridden swamps/jungle present would make life hard on the soldiers but from what I've read of the Campaigns in Russia, the First World War and in the American Civil War horses were even more susceptible to disease and exhaustion than people. Thus their supply chain basically broke down.

[rustysi]

it seems that the Japanese did not have a lot of transport aircraft and parceled those they did have into "penny packets". I don't know whether the games flexibility allows for the IJ Player to remedy this while still expanding their more combat capable aircraft.

Japan doesn't have a whole lot of transport aircraft in the game either. Their ability to move stuff is limited by small numbers and low capacity.

[ericv]

One only needs to consider the implications of the battle of the Coral Sea and the landings at Guadalcanal to put this in the proper context. Besides that, Industrially they were outdone.

[SierraJuliet]

This was Kokoda last November. Somewhat hard to see in the distance but it is to the left of centre seen as a thin strip of light green in the darker green. I took the photo from the northern end of the Owen Stanley Range just before we made the final descent and then the steamy final flat walk into Kokoda.

[jamesjohns]

From all the reading, Japan had a very poor logistics system. Even ignoring industrial production issues, getting the "beans and bullets" from the factory to the front-line was very poorly done. Reasons included lack of shipping and motorized transport and also a lack of dedicated, logistics-trained personal. As you can guess, majority of their military officers wanted to be "on the front line" so to speak and had no interest in studying or serving in a logistics role.

[Yaab]

From Craig Collie, Hajime Marutani "The Path of Infinite Sorrow. The Japanese on the Kokoda Track", page 74

"There had been gains of weapons and territory, including an airstrip the Japanese would never use, but the price paid in casualties was not cheap. Lieutenant Hirano, whose platoon had been carrying provisions to the front line, heard that over twenty men had been killed or wounded in taking Kokoda, including a company commander, Lieutenant Ogama. ‘It left me dazed for a while,’ he wrote. Returning to his company, Hirano prayed for the dead and consoled the wounded. He then went back to carrier duties."

So the Japs never used this airfield for resupply, air drops or evacuation.

[RichardAckermann]

I guess it would have been difficult to ensure a save airtransport that close to the allied airfield at port moresby.

[LargeSlowTarget]

According to https://www.pacificwrecks.com/airfields ... index.html, the runway was "described as 1000 yard grass surfaced strip". That's pretty short, no? Maybe the Japanese did not have the aircraft capable of using that strip available?

[Yaab]

Strange, because the Australians used the small airstrip to fly in reinforcements.

http://www.kokodaexpeditions.com.au/war ... story.html

"Lieutenant Colonel Owen arrived at Kokoda by plane on 25 July and decided to make a stand at Gorari. He returned to Kokoda expecting reinforcements by air.

The Japanese attacked Gorari with such conviction that all Australian units pulled back to Oivi.

On 26th July only two flights with 32 men (one Platoon) arrived in Kokoda and reinforced Oivi. D Company which was meant to leave Port Moresby that day, didn’t."

[witpqs]

Last month I finished reading The Coastwatchers by Eric A. Feldt who was one of those in charge of the program. They used small airstrips quite a bit here and there so certainly the commanders in a small aircraft could get in and out. I wonder when that 1,000 ft reference was and whether the strip was extended after that? Anybody know how much run a DC-3 needs?

[witpqs]

Found this

http://krepelka.com/fsweb/learningcenter/aircraft/flightnotesdouglasdc3.htm

and this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egUPX1ugy80

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Last month I finished reading The Coastwatchers by Eric A. Feldt who was one of those in charge of the program. They used small airstrips quite a bit here and there so certainly the commanders in a small aircraft could get in and out. I wonder when that 1,000 ft reference was and whether the strip was extended after that? Anybody know how much run a DC-3 needs?

The reference was 1000 yards - should be enough for a DC-3 landing but maybe not enough for takeoff with a full load (e.g. extracting a beat up unit).

[witpqs]

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Last month I finished reading The Coastwatchers by Eric A. Feldt who was one of those in charge of the program. They used small airstrips quite a bit here and there so certainly the commanders in a small aircraft could get in and out. I wonder when that 1,000 ft reference was and whether the strip was extended after that? Anybody know how much run a DC-3 needs?

The reference was 1000 yards - should be enough for a DC-3 landing but maybe not enough for takeoff with a full load (e.g. extracting a beat up unit).

I misread that; yes plenty long enough. The first link I posted called for 2,500 ft for landing at 25,000 pounds and only 1,000 ft for takeoff at the same weight.

[BBfanboy]

ORIGINAL: witpqs

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Last month I finished reading The Coastwatchers by Eric A. Feldt who was one of those in charge of the program. They used small airstrips quite a bit here and there so certainly the commanders in a small aircraft could get in and out. I wonder when that 1,000 ft reference was and whether the strip was extended after that? Anybody know how much run a DC-3 needs?

The reference was 1000 yards - should be enough for a DC-3 landing but maybe not enough for takeoff with a full load (e.g. extracting a beat up unit).

I misread that; yes plenty long enough. The first link I posted called for 2,500 ft for landing at 25,000 pounds and only 1,000 ft for takeoff at the same weight.

In real world aviation a pilot would insist on having enough runway to abort a takeoff just before liftoff. The 1000 feet at 25K lbs (total weight of aircraft plus fuel plus load) is likely a wartime standard. If you have to abort, that's your tough luck buddy! Prepare to hug some trees.

[spence]

The stats above are for take-off/landing at sea level and at 15 degrees C. Although the 10 ft altitude wouldn't have any significant effect I'd imagine that they've never seen 15C at that airstrip: probably double that would be considered a cold spell. Don't know how much effect temperature would have...expect a real pilot would have some sort of chart/table to tell him such stuff.

I guess Kokoda is only 50 miles inland from Buna and still 100 miles from Port Moresby. Given that the staff weenies in Tokyo thought there was a road running from Buna to Port Moresby and those same geniuses would have been the guys to order up some air supply resources I don't imagine they would have found it necessary to do so.

[sanch]

The greater the humidity, the less the lift. Water is less weight than the other stuff in air, thus less density. Similarly, the higher the temperature, the less the lift; again less density. Thus, most of the entire PTO was one giant pilot's nightmare.

I started to learn to fly in steamy, summer weather. The first time I flew in cool, dry weather, I was amazed at how fast the plane jumped into the air.

[Apollo11]

Hi all,

Semi OT - if you guys possible missed this movie "Kokoda" (2006) - worth watching:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0481390/



Leo "Apollo11"

[crsutton]

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

According to https://www.pacificwrecks.com/airfields ... index.html, the runway was "described as 1000 yard grass surfaced strip". That's pretty short, no? Maybe the Japanese did not have the aircraft capable of using that strip available?

If you look at a photo of the strip, it was very primitive and surrounded by steep hills. If I recall the strip sloped a bit too but that may be another one in my mind. A dangerous place to be a pilot. For the Japanese, improving the strip would have been difficult and operational losses too high to sustain. The Allies were able to make improvements and with the help of radar and functioning radios make use the strip. I doubt that keeping an airfield that remote in supply was within the capacity of Japan at the time. The other thing is that with the severe losses of aircraft in the theater and at Guadalcanal, there just were not a whole lot of aircraft on hand for the Japanese to make use of the field anyway.

[Yaab]

ORIGINAL: Apollo11

Hi all,

Semi OT - if you guys possible missed this movie "Kokoda" (2006) - worth watching:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0481390/



Leo "Apollo11"

Definitely missed. Thanks for the tip!