Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

This new stand alone release based on the legendary War in the Pacific from 2 by 3 Games adds significant improvements and changes to enhance game play, improve realism, and increase historical accuracy. With dozens of new features, new art, and engine improvements, War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition brings you the most realistic and immersive WWII Pacific Theater wargame ever!

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Rusty1961
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Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by Rusty1961 »

Okay, I've got F5 recon units (the P38 version) and while my pilots are in the 60 or 70 for recon, they give little detail on planes based on a hex they over-flew.

I find this hard to believe given the high resolution of Allied cameras during the later part of the war. I read that by '44 they had such incredible resolution that even if a German MG nest was entirely under cammoflage, the camera could detect the disturbance in the dirt from the muzzle blast of said MG after it shot.

Thus, I think that dedicated allied recon planes should be able to tell me what types of planes are at an airfield under optimum circumstances (weather, etc).

Yes, I have tried flying them at 10,000 feet to see if the accuracy improved the lower I flew, but to no avail.

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BBfanboy
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by BBfanboy »

ORIGINAL: Rusty1961

Okay, I've got F5 recon units (the P38 version) and while my pilots are in the 60 or 70 for recon, they give little detail on planes based on a hex they over-flew.

I find this hard to believe given the high resolution of Allied cameras during the later part of the war. I read that by '44 they had such incredible resolution that even if a German MG nest was entirely under cammoflage, the camera could detect the disturbance in the dirt from the muzzle blast of said MG after it shot.

Thus, I think that dedicated allied recon planes should be able to tell me what types of planes are at an airfield under optimum circumstances (weather, etc).

Yes, I have tried flying them at 10,000 feet to see if the accuracy improved the lower I flew, but to no avail.

Cameras of the era still could not see through cloud ...
No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth
Rusty1961
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by Rusty1961 »

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: Rusty1961

Okay, I've got F5 recon units (the P38 version) and while my pilots are in the 60 or 70 for recon, they give little detail on planes based on a hex they over-flew.

I find this hard to believe given the high resolution of Allied cameras during the later part of the war. I read that by '44 they had such incredible resolution that even if a German MG nest was entirely under cammoflage, the camera could detect the disturbance in the dirt from the muzzle blast of said MG after it shot.

Thus, I think that dedicated allied recon planes should be able to tell me what types of planes are at an airfield under optimum circumstances (weather, etc).

Yes, I have tried flying them at 10,000 feet to see if the accuracy improved the lower I flew, but to no avail.

Cameras of the era still could not see through cloud ...


"optimum".
God made man, but Sam Colt made them equal.
GetAssista
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by GetAssista »

Why would you assume that overflying plane would see all the present planes? They can be in hangars, on missions, camuflaged etc.
Yet, with X fighters, Y bombers, Z aux as a standard game intel info those estimated numbers are pretty close to reality with high detection levels.
If you want to see types of planes that would mean rewriting of the code (hardly any chance) and thinking a lot about how exactly to fit all this into pop-up base display. Names + numbers can take a lot of space
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obvert
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by obvert »

ORIGINAL: Rusty1961

Okay, I've got F5 recon units (the P38 version) and while my pilots are in the 60 or 70 for recon, they give little detail on planes based on a hex they over-flew.

I find this hard to believe given the high resolution of Allied cameras during the later part of the war. I read that by '44 they had such incredible resolution that even if a German MG nest was entirely under cammoflage, the camera could detect the disturbance in the dirt from the muzzle blast of said MG after it shot.

Thus, I think that dedicated allied recon planes should be able to tell me what types of planes are at an airfield under optimum circumstances (weather, etc).

Yes, I have tried flying them at 10,000 feet to see if the accuracy improved the lower I flew, but to no avail.


Most of the cameras used were very large format negatives with extreme telephoto lenses. So yes, you're absolutely correct. In fact the image below shows planes marked as "unserviceable," meaning the photo intelligence team could determine they'd been damaged and were not useable from this photo. I assume they could have easily identified them too.

I think the game balance is about right here, with the Allied getting a LOT more capability and reliability using recon, but neither side having perfect info.



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DanSez
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by DanSez »

There is a big difference in the ETO and PTO:
Greater distances
Jungle
Distance between supporting bases

In England, there were so many bases and ease of transport to disseminate photo and written reports
In PNG/Northern Australia/Solomons - try riding a bike with a backpack of photos between them.

There should be a consideration of the time it would take a plane to fly a 6 hour mission, get the photos developed, pass the photos out to the proper intel group, do the analysis and then get that report to the field commanders. Given we are shown 'real time' reports from the fliers, the information should be sketchy. Maybe a little more but not highly detailed in a 'real time' format.

I also wish there were more 'accumulated' intel within the game itself, but external programs like Intel Monkey, Combat Reporter and Tracker can help shape the Bigger Picture.


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MakeeLearn
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Fake Japanese AA gun.

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MakeeLearn
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Fake plane

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MakeeLearn
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Bamboo Bombers

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MakeeLearn
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Fake plane Japanese

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MakeeLearn
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Stone tank

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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

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Fake Japanese guns

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obvert
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by obvert »

Very cool. I've never seen these dummy guns, tanks and planes on the Japanese side. The allies did a lot of fake placement as we know, but this one is new to me. Thanks!
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crsutton
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by crsutton »

ORIGINAL: Rusty1961

Okay, I've got F5 recon units (the P38 version) and while my pilots are in the 60 or 70 for recon, they give little detail on planes based on a hex they over-flew.

I find this hard to believe given the high resolution of Allied cameras during the later part of the war. I read that by '44 they had such incredible resolution that even if a German MG nest was entirely under cammoflage, the camera could detect the disturbance in the dirt from the muzzle blast of said MG after it shot.

Thus, I think that dedicated allied recon planes should be able to tell me what types of planes are at an airfield under optimum circumstances (weather, etc).

Yes, I have tried flying them at 10,000 feet to see if the accuracy improved the lower I flew, but to no avail.


So you are asking someone to make a code change in a ten year old game engine? Good luck there..[:-]
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BBfanboy
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by BBfanboy »

ORIGINAL: obvert

Very cool. I've never seen these dummy guns, tanks and planes on the Japanese side. The allies did a lot of fake placement as we know, but this one is new to me. Thanks!
Cheap Japanese fakes of Western fakes!
No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth
alimentary
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by alimentary »

Cheap Japanese fakes of Western fakes!
They appear to be genuine fakes.
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Macclan5
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RE: Reconnaissance overflights...more detail needed?

Post by Macclan5 »

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy

ORIGINAL: obvert

Very cool. I've never seen these dummy guns, tanks and planes on the Japanese side. The allies did a lot of fake placement as we know, but this one is new to me. Thanks!
Cheap Japanese fakes of Western fakes!

Not quite legible on the bottom :

Manufactured by the Acme Manufacturing Company
Formosa / Burma / Okinawa / DEI

Whereas Allied versions

Manufactured by the Roadrunner Corporation
Flagstaff AZ

[8D]
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