Hastings 2016

Gamers can also use this forum to chat about any game related subject, news, rumours etc.

Moderator: maddog986

Zorch
Posts: 7087
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 4:21 pm

Hastings 2016

Post by Zorch »

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/201 ... nniversary

'Battle of Hastings to rage again as re-enactors celebrate anniversary'

Armies of enthusiasts led by King Harold and Duke William prepare for two days of warfare to mark 950 years since the battle



Image
Attachments
hastings.jpg
hastings.jpg (211.84 KiB) Viewed 258 times
User avatar
Orm
Posts: 27749
Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 7:53 pm
Location: Sweden

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Orm »

Thank you for sharing. [:)]

Are they going to celebrate the Battle of Stamford Bridge as well?
Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb -- they're often students, for heaven's sake. - Terry Pratchett
User avatar
zakblood
Posts: 22722
Joined: Thu Oct 04, 2012 11:19 am

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by zakblood »

1. The Battle of Hastings didn't take place in Hastings

It actually took place in a field seven miles from Hastings. That field has now become a town (appropriately named Battle.) History has recorded the event as happening at what is now Battle Abbey in the East Sussex town (although some dispute the precise location).

2. Harold was probably not killed by an arrow to the eye

About 10,000 men are believed to have died in the Battle of Hastings - King Harold included, abruptly ending the 43-year-old's brief nine-month reign.

Thanks to the Bayeux Tapestry, which depicts the Norman invasion, people have long believed he was slain by an arrow to the eye, and hacked to death by William's men. In reality, he probably died of wounds inflicted on the battlefield.

3. Harold did put up a decent fight

The Battle of Hastings may have been won decisively by William the Conqueror, but the English put up a good fight, despite their exhaustion and their opponents having better cavalry. In fact, the battle lasted most of the day – unusually long for a medieval battle.

The Saxons (about 6,000 soldiers) fought long and hard on high ground using a traditional shield wall – a solid defensive wall of shields – which the Normans (about 7,000 troops) were unable to break through for many hours.

Not bad for an army that had just marched 250 miles from Stamford Bridge near York, to the south coast after their epic victory against Viking warrior Harald Hardrada of Norway and Harold's rebel brother Tostig.

4. The Normans won by pretending to run away

The Norman invaders gained the winning advantage by tricking the Saxons and feigning retreat. Thinking the pressure was off, some Saxons broke rank from their protective shield wall, allowing other Norman soldiers to swoop in and attack.

5. It was a minstrel that killed the first Saxon

Ivo Taillefer (William’s minstrel whose name means 'hewer of iron') killed the first Saxon in the battle.

The Carmen de Hastingae Proelio ('Song of the Battle of Hastings' ) says that a Saxon soldier broke ranks, and Taillefer killed him, while later sources say that Taillefer charged into the enemy shield-wall, where he killed several Saxons before he was overwhelmed.

6. Halley’s Comet was an omen

The Bayeux Tapestry shows the audience witnessing Harold’s coronation watching Halley's Comet, which is depicted in the sky as an omen of Harold's fate.

7. No one knows where Harold's body is

According to early sources, William denied Harold’s mother his body, though she offered its weight in gold. However later sources say Harold's body was mutilated and identified by his mistress and buried at Waltham Abbey, Essex, which he had re-founded.

You can still see his alleged grave at the English Heritage-run site. But the exact location of Harold’s body is disputed to this day.

8. We all know more French than we think

After William's victory, French became the language of his court. The English we speak today is the product of a lot of intermingling with French words, making our language a lovely hybrid. For example, words in English for prepared foods took on their French equivalents. Saxon serfs bred the livestock, so cows, sheep, and pigs were slaughtered and served up to their Norman masters as beef, mutton, and pork respectively.

So, without the Norman Conquest, Shakespeare would not have been Shakespeare as we know it, because his language would have resembled 16th-century German or Dutch.

9. William was known as 'the Bastard'

No one called him William the Conqueror at the time. That didn't come until 200-odd years later. After the battle, he was called William 'the great'. However, his enemies referred to him as William 'the Bastard'. (He was born out of wedlock to his father, Robert I, Duke of Normandy's mistress).
Windows 11 Pro 64-bit (10.0, Build 22621) (22621.ni_release.220506-1250)
User avatar
TulliusDetritus
Posts: 5581
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 1:49 am
Location: The Zone™

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by TulliusDetritus »

ORIGINAL: zakblood
After William's victory, French became the language of his court. The English we speak today is the product of a lot of intermingling with French words

Not only the court but the elites in general. IIRC that's what Chaucer wrote. Between 40% and 60% of English vocabulary is of Latin origin (via the French).
"Hitler is a horrible sexual degenerate, a dangerous fool" - Mussolini, circa 1934
User avatar
TulliusDetritus
Posts: 5581
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 1:49 am
Location: The Zone™

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by TulliusDetritus »

ORIGINAL: Orm

Thank you for sharing. [:)]

Are they going to celebrate the Battle of Stamford Bridge as well?

You mean the sacking of Mourinho?
"Hitler is a horrible sexual degenerate, a dangerous fool" - Mussolini, circa 1934
User avatar
wings7
Posts: 4586
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2003 4:59 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by wings7 »

Thanks Zorch! How awesome is that? Are you attending or participating? [:)]
Please come and join and befriend me at the great Steam portal! There are quite a few Matrix/Slitherine players on Steam! My member page: http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197988402427
User avatar
wings7
Posts: 4586
Joined: Mon Aug 11, 2003 4:59 am
Location: Phoenix, Arizona

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by wings7 »

Thanks Zak for all the historical information...you're the man! [:)]
Please come and join and befriend me at the great Steam portal! There are quite a few Matrix/Slitherine players on Steam! My member page: http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197988402427
User avatar
Orm
Posts: 27749
Joined: Sat May 03, 2008 7:53 pm
Location: Sweden

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Orm »

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

ORIGINAL: Orm

Thank you for sharing. [:)]

Are they going to celebrate the Battle of Stamford Bridge as well?

You mean the sacking of Mourinho?
[&:]
Have a bit more patience with newbies. Of course some of them act dumb -- they're often students, for heaven's sake. - Terry Pratchett
Zorch
Posts: 7087
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 4:21 pm

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Zorch »

ORIGINAL: wings7

Thanks Zorch! How awesome is that? Are you attending or participating? [:)]
In spirit only, alas.
User avatar
MakeeLearn
Posts: 4274
Joined: Sun Sep 11, 2016 1:01 pm

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by MakeeLearn »

As a surname descendant of Harold ..... no civil comment.






JWW
Posts: 1684
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2000 8:00 am
Location: Louisiana, USA

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by JWW »

Re #4 on that list, there is dispute about whether the retreat by part of William's forces was planned or not. It appears just as likely that it was a real retreat but that the Saxons who broke ranks left themselves vulnerable to a counter-attack. And apparently the tactic was used more than once, with some historians thinking it was unplanned the first time and then planned the second and possibly third time. Of course like everything involving that battle except the final result, much is uncertain. So one could take either side on the retreat issue and make a good argument.
User avatar
Gilmer
Posts: 1483
Joined: Fri Jul 01, 2011 5:01 pm
Contact:

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Gilmer »

As an amateur Anglophile, I knew about the court speaking French. I think it was said Richard Lionheart ONLY spoke French. Of course, he spent much of his early years in France partly due to not getting along with his father, Henry II. Also, I think he was the Duke of Aquitaine so that probably had a lot to do with it as well.

If any of this is wrong, I am claiming someone else told me! [:D]
"Venimus, vidimus, Deus vicit" John III Sobieski as he entered Vienna on 9/12/1683. "I came, I saw, God conquered."
He that has a mind to fight, let him fight, for now is the time. - Anacreon
User avatar
Curtis Lemay
Posts: 13846
Joined: Fri Sep 17, 2004 3:12 pm
Location: Houston, TX

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Curtis Lemay »

Edward I was the first English King, post Hastings, that could speak English (and it was still a second language for him).
My TOAW web site:

Bob Cross's TOAW Site
User avatar
Toby42
Posts: 1629
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 11:34 pm
Location: Central Florida

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Toby42 »

I'm still not sure if the Norman Conquest was a good thing for Britain?
Tony
User avatar
rico21
Posts: 3034
Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2016 8:05 am

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by rico21 »

As a Norman, I always wondered.[:D]
And I'm waiting for a real game about the conquest of England by my fathers.
Zorch
Posts: 7087
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 4:21 pm

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Zorch »

Why isn't it called the William Conquest, seeing as he was the prime mover?
User avatar
warspite1
Posts: 41896
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:06 pm
Location: England

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Why isn't it called the William Conquest, seeing as he was the prime mover?
warspite1

Well it was carried out by the Normans - who were actually more Viking than French - and not William on his own......
Now Maitland, now's your time!

Duke of Wellington to 1st Guards Brigade - Waterloo 18 June 1815
Zorch
Posts: 7087
Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 4:21 pm

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by Zorch »

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Why isn't it called the William Conquest, seeing as he was the prime mover?
warspite1

Well it was carried out by the Normans - who were actually more Viking than French - and not William on his own......
Didn't William have a lot of non-Normans in his army? If memory serves, only the nobles/men at arms were Norman; the rest were a mix of mercenaries, peasants, and adventurers, etc. Without William the Bastard it would not have happened.
User avatar
warspite1
Posts: 41896
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 1:06 pm
Location: England

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by warspite1 »

ORIGINAL: Zorch

ORIGINAL: warspite1

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Why isn't it called the William Conquest, seeing as he was the prime mover?
warspite1

Well it was carried out by the Normans - who were actually more Viking than French - and not William on his own......
Didn't William have a lot of non-Normans in his army? If memory serves, only the nobles/men at arms were Norman; the rest were a mix of mercenaries, peasants, and adventurers, etc. Without William the Bastard it would not have happened.
warspite1

Not as far as I know - but then this is not exactly my specialist subject - so you may well be right.
Now Maitland, now's your time!

Duke of Wellington to 1st Guards Brigade - Waterloo 18 June 1815
nicwb
Posts: 518
Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 10:31 am

RE: Hastings 2016

Post by nicwb »

quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

Why isn't it called the William Conquest, seeing as he was the prime mover?
warspite1

Well it was carried out by the Normans - who were actually more Viking than French - and not William on his own......


Didn't William have a lot of non-Normans in his army? If memory serves, only the nobles/men at arms were Norman; the rest were a mix of mercenaries, peasants, and adventurers, etc. Without William the Bastard it would not have happened.
warspite1

Not as far as I know - but then this is not exactly my specialist subject - so you may well be right.

It is correct. William's force included troops from Flanders and Brittany.

Zakblood's list could also include the following oddities - Harold's forces were almost entirely infantry and archers; the myth about Harold being killed by an arrow to the eye is mostly based on where the words recording his death are placed on the Bayeaux tapestry, above a Saxon figure with an arrow protruding from the head and to top it off there is a strong body of opinion that the Bayeaux tapestry wasn't made in Bayeaux.
Post Reply

Return to “General Discussion”