French

[petrosian]

There needs to be some tweaks to the French. Against the AI it was ok but not against human players.There is no advantage to defend Paris, as they won't surrender until mid August 1940. So human players use the French to blockade Norway, invade Italy or anything to cost Axis mpp's. France should surrender as soon as Paris is taken.

[vonik]

No tweaks are needed - France surrenders when Paris is taken .
It is just necessary to get its moral below 10 000 and this is not so hard (there is a thread in the War Room about how to beat France fast)
And France can't invade anything because it has not amphibious research and on land you just put italians on the border .

[petrosian]

I have had opponents invade Italy by AV. Not on the border. This forces you to move units into Italy. Also France morale will not go below 10,000 until mid August against a clever opponent no matter what you do.

[petrosian]

My point is there is no incentive to defend Paris, since it's defeat is inevitable.So the options are use the French as fodder.

[vonik]

ORIGINAL: Petrosian

I have had opponents invade Italy by AV. Not on the border. This forces you to move units into Italy. Also France morale will not go below 10,000 until mid August against a clever opponent no matter what you do.

I don't know with whom you play but the French moral is at 13 000 after only 2 turns what puts the 10 000 2, maximum 3 turns later .
So if you start in April, France surrenders long before mid august .
You can see how it is done here : tm.asp?m=4253830
And it is no special magics - just knowing how to occupy Belgium and Holland in the first turn, this is what gives the biggest hit on the French moral .

[petrosian]

I am familiar with that post. That is against the AI.Against a human is a bit different.

[FriendlyKomissar]

ORIGINAL: Petrosian

My point is there is no incentive to defend Paris, since it's defeat is inevitable.So the options are use the French as fodder.

Does sound like a bit of abuse but what can be done about it?

I have often thought of not putting in a strong UK defence in France since it will fall anyway. There is pretty much nothing one can do to stop France falling but I feel its very unrealistic to not try and defend it.

Maybe that's just me

[johanssb]

Shouldn't they be trying to cost the Axis mpps ?

[battlevonwar]

France can hold a bit, but really if it does too well the game is over. The French can destroy a ton of Production Point for the Axis by just vamping them out. Their job is to die more or less in Strategic Command terms and bleed the Axis on the way out. British Units dying there is up to you, that will cost you both ways. BEF really helps! Though it also sucks out British Resources for afterwards!

[Dmondragon75]

Agreed on that, only purpose of the French seems to be damaging Germans as much as possible

[johanssb]

And that is how the French should be used.

In my experience, more often than not, the fall of Paris does spell the fall of France.

I'm not sure I see what the problem is here ? If you are looking for an easy victory then play against the AI on beginner level.

A human French player should be fighting to kill / damage as many Axis units as possible, or launching surprise attacks to screw with the Axis timetable.