Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs Falken (A))

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Hotei
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Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs Falken (A))

Post by Hotei »

(This AAR is more about getting help when the need arises and giving a general picture of the operations, I will not have time to report every detail or turn.)

Shuin Sakusen (Operation Red Seal)

Image

Japanese Red seal trade in the early 17th century.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_seal_ships



Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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witpqs
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

Probably the same reason no one ever just stands down all the KB's aircraft and parks them one hex off of Pearl Harbor until they are all sunk.
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

ORIGINAL: witpqs

Probably the same reason no one ever just stands down all the KB's aircraft and parks them one hex off of Pearl Harbor until they are all sunk.

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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

OK, I'll be direct: "Because it's a really bad idea."

But if you think it worthy to try, try it. Gain experience with how it works out. [8D]
Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

ORIGINAL: witpqs

OK, I'll be direct: "Because it's a really bad idea."

But if you think it worthy to try, try it. Gain experience with how it works out. [8D]

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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

ORIGINAL: Hotei

ORIGINAL: witpqs

OK, I'll be direct: "Because it's a really bad idea."

But if you think it worthy to try, try it. Gain experience with how it works out. [8D]

Why is it a bad idea?
When you pass Pearl you have Manila and the submarines left, they also are no sure thing if your hit goes badly.
What are you giving up?
You are giving up damaging/destroying anything with KB on turn 1. Unless your mod or rules say turn it off, Japan has surprise on turn 1. It helps a great deal for attacks that day.
My priority target after carriers are long range search capable planes, you can get some in the Philippines with LBA.
In my experience long range search planes are destroyed in greatest numbers at Pearl Harbor on turn 1.
Hiding KB will make the allies hesitant to act anywhere or with good luck even getting a shot at the carriers.
It is a pretty standard rule "no carrier hunting on turn 1" because the Japan player knows exactly where they start, something which was not true in real life. Some PBM partners extend that to turns 2 or 3, but IMO turn 1 is appropriate. So if you do have such a rule (no carrier hunting on turn 1), do you plan to search for the carriers, or do you plan to hide KB to keep the Allied player guessing? You are saying both and those options conflict with each other.
The Allies don't NEED to use their carriers early, they can wait for more to arrive to strengthen the fleet. If you get the Allied carriers good for you, but if you don't then you have held back your most potent offensive weapon for nothing. You have denied use of it to your various expansion operations.
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

And if you do plan to hunt for the Allied carriers after turn 1, what is your plan for doing that? Do you think that KB will remain undetected during such a hunt, even without finding and engaging the Allied carriers?
Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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witpqs
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

My second post crossed with yours.
Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

ORIGINAL: witpqs

And if you do plan to hunt for the Allied carriers after turn 1, what is your plan for doing that? Do you think that KB will remain undetected during such a hunt, even without finding and engaging the Allied carriers?

No allied carrier hunting in the plans in the first turn.

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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by witpqs »

In that case, IMO you are allowing the existence of the USN carriers to tie the KB to a plan of inaction.
Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

ORIGINAL: witpqs

In that case, IMO you are allowing the existence of the USN carriers to tie the KB to a plan of inaction.

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Hotei
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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Lowpe »

You need to cripple Allied catalina forces and heavy bombers at start. Losses at Pearl are almost 0 if you let the fighters bomb from 7000 feet instead of strafe.

You need to tie up Pearls repair facilities at start.

You need to gain victory points at every favorable chance you can.

You need to to make an honest effort to sink Force Z. If you can bomb the subs in manila, so much the better.

The CS are unreliable, I see you know that. save them and the fuel for when you can stuff Rufes on them.

You can use sig int to mislead Allied...but you have to know that your opponent will look at it and react accordingly.

nagasaki is a poor major port for you to use.



Hotei
Posts: 110
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:38 am

RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

You need to cripple Allied catalina forces and heavy bombers at start. Losses at Pearl are almost 0 if you let the fighters bomb from 7000 feet instead of strafe.

You need to tie up Pearls repair facilities at start.

You need to gain victory points at every favorable chance you can.

You need to to make an honest effort to sink Force Z. If you can bomb the subs in manila, so much the better.

The CS are unreliable, I see you know that. save them and the fuel for when you can stuff Rufes on them.

You can use sig int to mislead Allied...but you have to know that your opponent will look at it and react accordingly.

nagasaki is a poor major port for you to use.




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Hotei
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:38 am

RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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Hotei
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:38 am

RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »

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Hotei
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Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2017 9:38 am

RE: Shuin Sakusen (B-MOD Hotei (J) vs walkerd (A))

Post by Hotei »




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