Help With A Scenario

[ArmouredLion]

Mike Tyson said, "Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the mouth."

Well, my plan is to run a semi / pseudo historical game of Russian V.S. Germans 1943-44. The second part of my plan is that my cohort and I will be making a war journal throughout the game along with screenshot and such to document it.
At the end, I will use my video editing skills to turn it into a documentary spliced in with real WW2 footage and all the movie magic bells and whistles I can muster.
All seemed well. I have some modding ability (I can change the nations fully from troops- cities), I am fairly knowledgeable on the genre, and I know editing and layout for film, and I have an opponent willing to try this crazy scheme...
...but, then I was punched in the face.
Two issues have arose:
1) I'm trying to use a scenario / mod other than the Dawn standard as the Graphics of the STF's on Bomburs (for instance) fit my effort better. But, I tried several with that look. Bomburs and several standard scenarios, WaW and maybe one other...but, events issues ended all my attempts.
2) How to give it a limited time frame that would fit the narrative. I guess I could just alter the dates at the end through cropping of screenshots and in "story mode" turn months into days. It will be on a small map and will be considered Division level -- so, I'm trying to make it cover months and not years.

Anyway, is this a lost cause as far as importing all those STF's or do I need to do it "by hand"? Is the time frame a possibility or must I just alter in editing? And last and pointers would be appreciated if this isn't a hair brained scheme.

Thanks all for your time and attention.

[ArmouredLion]

Alright, I think I might have solved most of my problems: I used the Third Reich as the Masterfile and even though I get event misfires it seems to progress to the turn. I start seeing if any bugs show...

[ArmouredLion]

...another punch in the mouth. No generation of Resources... guess I need to figure on doing it from scratch.

[Bombur]

I suggest you to use the Bombur mod masterfile to make the scenario. Tell me the map size you need and I can send you a file ready to be edited

[ArmouredLion]

You are the man...I was in the process of creating the mod from scratch...which I might do as a side project to learn more about editing. I'm thinking 60 w x 40L. Also, is it possible to alter some of the STF graphics? It's not an end all be all, but I noticed on the Third Reich mod Russia and German had historic pics for each unit i.e. MG 42 V.S. Maxim. I'm willing to invest time to get this right -- already pulled out my stack of book...and I said in the past, if you need any help snagging pics for your mod, I'd be a willing and eager goofer. Yeah, your mod moves at a short pace and would be perfect on more than one front. Thanks again sir!!

[ernieschwitz]

Of course you can modify anything that Bombur sends you.

Re: Importing stuff.
It is sometimes difficult to import things, because one thing, say SFTs are tied with the Items and Research pictures, which again are tied to the items, SFTs are tied to the landscape types too, regards movement. In the end, unless you customize a scenario just to fit, it can be hard to import stuff, via the import buttons. So much so that making a scenario with the masterfile is much more feasible.

Re: Map size. It is always possible to add to the map width or height. The recommended maximum size is anything below 200x200... which is big enough for almost everything.

[ArmouredLion]

alright, make it 100L x 80W. I'll use your mood as is, and then work on my own little scenario in conjunction...thanks. I start the design and deal with the issues...thanks so much.

[ernieschwitz]

Be aware that 40x50 is 1/4 of the number of hexes of a 80x100 map. This means it will take longer time to make the map... And bigger is not always better. Also the turn length can be generic (turn 1, turn 2, etc.) or start at a specific date and be increased in a number of days.

I am mentioning this cause if the ratio between hex size and timescale is off, then you might get a map where you move across it in no time, which would defeat the purpose of making it big...

[ArmouredLion]

Okay, I used the editor and imported your mod as the master file, but just for the purposes of importing data. Is that correct? No event issues should occur, correct? My rough estimation is this will be a division operation over the course of a (yet determined) short time-frame. If the Germans can't complete the objectives in that time, they lose. 'Research' will be considered requisition. Units will be a one-for-one ration: i.e. stack limits are 150, max one company per Hex. The hex value is yet to be determined as well. I was leaning towards half a mile. Any of this not meet the sniff test? I'll try and build the map on my own if I did the above correctly. It's time I left the nest and started modding on my own -- but, all wisdom is much appreciated.

[ernieschwitz]

Well... I am confused

The Mod is Bomburs I help him out some times, but he deserves all the credit for the many unittypes available, and research.

[ArmouredLion]

I'm silly rabbit!!! I meant his.... :O

[ernieschwitz]

It's quite ok, sometimes people assume I am part of Bomburs project, and we are more or less the same. Well, we have projects that are not cooperations too, and some that are a cooperative effort. Bombur is however a good friend of mine, and he does want me to help him now and then with Bombur mod.

[Bombur]

ORIGINAL: ArmouredLion

Okay, I used the editor and imported your mod as the master file, but just for the purposes of importing data. Is that correct? No event issues should occur, correct? My rough estimation is this will be a division operation over the course of a (yet determined) short time-frame. If the Germans can't complete the objectives in that time, they lose. 'Research' will be considered requisition. Units will be a one-for-one ration: i.e. stack limits are 150, max one company per Hex. The hex value is yet to be determined as well. I was leaning towards half a mile. Any of this not meet the sniff test? I'll try and build the map on my own if I did the above correctly. It's time I left the nest and started modding on my own -- but, all wisdom is much appreciated.

1-You´re right, you must open the editor and import the SFT
2-Remember that Bombur mod is set to 50km hex, that 1 SFT is more or less equal to a company and that you must do significant changes if you want to use it for operational scenarios. I´m actually considering to launch an operational version of my mod with 20km hexes and 3 days turns. I don´t think Bombur mod, as it is, is very useful for your purpose then.....I actually believe that ATG shouldn´t be used for scenarios below 5km/hex
3-You must delete some events that are specific for map building, althought I´m not sure how they work in a non random map. This must be done by trial and error.

[ArmouredLion]

Thanks Bombur....and sorry for the mix up with Ernie. Why don't you see ATG as being effective for operational and less than 5 KM /hex? I'm going to try a strictly Soviet / German scenario around early 44 meant as a unit template for randoms -- the size of the forces isn't essential. My main goal is to create army lists with distinctive facets with national pics to represent the STF's with slightly altered forces from standard to represent the pros / cons of each side: i.e. lightly boost ROF for MG 42, but raise its cost, and drop ROF for Maxim, but lower its cost -- something along those lines. It just irks me not to see the proper images and have a national flavor for randoms. YOUR mod has been the closet, in my opinion, as far as bringing forth the visceral flavor. I had, about a year, ago been able you use it for randoms, but for the life of me I can't remember how I did it! Maybe I'm hallucinating!So, basically at your current setting and stack limits you can have division per hex? I guess given the scope of the map that works. On a small map, not so much. No? Was messing around with the editor throughout the day...it's fun -- frustrating, but fun.

[Bombur]

From my POV, the vanilla ATG is a platform designed for strategic wargame, as it includes research, production, resources and has very long turns. Of course, it has no fixed hex size, it seems to work like more than 50km for some things (like aircraft range and ship movement) or 10km for others (artillery range). Unlike TOAW, it sacrifices detail for a much better simulation of logistics and a far more flexible event editor. It needs significant edition to be an effective operational simulation (unlike TOAW, which needs significant edition to be a more or less ineffective strategic simulation). When you decrease scale to 1km/hex, you are very close to tactical level and then you lack LOS, day/night cycles and also will be at a great pain to adjust time to scale and still obtain realistic movement rates. Not that it´s impossible to be done, it´s just above my abilities.

[ernieschwitz]

As Bombur has hinted at, range becomes a problem.

Would it be logical to hinder a plane to be able to travel less than it's full range in real life. ... and how much fun would it be if that was the entirety of the map.

Also there is the Artillery range, which could turn out to be quite long if scale is small.

Then there is the whole problem with Line of sight of other formations.

In the end I would tend to agree with Bombur that ATG is best suited for a strategic game, more so than a tactical one. That being said, it is neither to start off with, but a mixture, and if certain aspects are chosen over others, then it can become one or the other.

It is easy to forget that the more tactical Decisive Campaigns series games, are actually made with more or less the same engine as ATG. Of course it has evolved some, and ATG has had its updates too...

What I am trying to say is, that you can pretty much shoehorn ATG into both types of situations. Look around and you will see vast strategical games like World at War for ATG, GD 1938; you will also find scenarios of more specific actions, like the Finnish winter war. You can even find things like campaigns, where one scenario leads to a new one etc.

The many choices of ATG and the ways it can be molded into nearly anything is its great appeal (to me) and what makes this game worth every dollar.

[ArmouredLion]

Agree and good points.
I don' see this mod attempt as tactical (in my opinion)-- if an infantry unit can't 'shoot' across multiple hexes it isn't a true tactical, in my opinion. But, range of movement and weapons does get sticky with too small a hex key. I think you nailed it about 10 km a smallest unit. I guess I could either alter stack limits or even easier make the unit key increase by a factor of 10, so my original company per hex would grow to 2 battalions or smallish regiment -- which is fine.
Doing my rereading and study of slightly pre-Kursk to Bagration to get reference. I'm figuring it to be an operation of 6--10 divisions. This increase will force me to deeply consider turn / time ratio, but I think the day / night issue will just be let out.

One question I do have is this: I started to take the STF of rifle unit in the editor and duplicate it. Then I was renaming it Soviet Rifle, SS Rifle and German Rifle and then apply appropriate pics and slightly modify the stats...would this be an effective resolve? If so, I could then create 2 distinct armies without all the other issues attached to terrain and such that was described earlier.
Yeah, I looked over a bunch of scenarios. Originally, I was going to use the Ardennes and us U.S. V.S Germany, but Soviets V.S. Germans is too attractive to not go with. Thanks to you both.

And yeah, I love the graphic of ATG when not in WW2 mode...but, a few weeks back I cleaned up my man cave and going over my models, figurines and books...ww2 fever took hold[X(]

Ohh and this game is an addiction...my wife has fumed several times because of "One more turn"