Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Gary Grigsby’s War in the East: The German-Soviet War 1941-1945 is a turn-based World War II strategy game stretching across the entire Eastern Front. Gamers can engage in an epic campaign, including division-sized battles with realistic and historical terrain, weather, orders of battle, logistics and combat results.

The critically and fan-acclaimed Eastern Front mega-game Gary Grigsby’s War in the East just got bigger and better with Gary Grigsby’s War in the East: Don to the Danube! This expansion to the award-winning War in the East comes with a wide array of later war scenarios ranging from short but intense 6 turn bouts like the Battle for Kharkov (1942) to immense 37-turn engagements taking place across multiple nations like Drama on the Danube (Summer 1944 – Spring 1945).

Moderators: Joel Billings, elmo3, Sabre21

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MrBlizzard
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Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

Winter 1941, 25 december.
Germans choose to retreat some hexes away from a Voronezh left in ruins (9 manpower left with 80% damage) to shorten the front.
As the Soviets enter in the empty Voronezh hex, suddendly 1 more manpower is dead (now 8 left) and damage grows to 99% !! [X(]
It sounds a bit strange [&:]
It seems that the liberators completed the work of invaders [:D]

P.S. I'm playing with last beta 1.09.01
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821Bobo
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by 821Bobo »

All the collaborators has been shot [:D]
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

Yeah and their houses put to flames! [:D]
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

It happened again

Here Dneprpetrovsk after Rumenians left without fightings


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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

9 manpower 55% damaged

and... after Russian enter

one more manpower point lost and 99% damaged !!

I would understand if Germans entrench themselves in city and there were fightings,
but if you don't fight why population has to suffer losses again ?

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Joel Billings
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by Joel Billings »

I could be wrong, but one should assume this is what happened when the city was finally evacuated and then recaptured. If I'm right that it's always been this way in the game, it would be that way because there's no way to know when a city is fully evacuated other than when it is recaptured. Lack of a combat unit in the hex doesn't necessarily indicate loss of civil control (at least not to the computer code). Not meaning to belittle tragedy, but let's face it, transitions, especially in that war, could be difficult.
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morvael
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by morvael »

Damage going up to 99 is normal. Reduction is caused, I assume, by manpower evacuation. I'll check if it's allowed to happen when Soviets enter their city.
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

Thanks for answers,I assumed that manpower point was destroyed 'cause the usual "evacuation message" didn't appear.
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morvael
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by morvael »

Maybe the Germans evacuated Hiwis? Actually that was common occurence if the retreat was planned (as I have found in this book), they wanted to deny resources to the Soviets.
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

A migration of hiwis families and other collaborazionists toward west; also normal people simply to deny them to Soviets.
Interesting [:)]
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morvael
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by morvael »

I have checked the code, and indeed manpower points may be lost every turn under occupation, when a city is isolated, and when a city changes hands. There is no message for this like there is for evacuation (there was, but it's disabled now for reasons unknown - maybe because it's a sensitive subject), so you won't know it unless you look at the numbers.
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by Denniss »

If a city/location with population changes hands without combat + back to the original owner I see no reason to reduce population (or even have a chance for this to happen).
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morvael
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by morvael »

IMHO civilian population may suffer even if there is no intensive (counter vs counter) combat. Low level combat of patrols and delaying forces, mines, planned destruction upon withdrawal, artillery shelling and bombing is always possible.
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by MrBlizzard »

True, maybe the losses are just a little too severe
All 3 cities I gave a look (D-town, Lipetsk e Voronezh) suffered a complete destruction (99% damaged) after reconquer without fighting and 1 point mp loss. Maybe could be more random and less severe [:)]
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Joel Billings
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by Joel Billings »

Since Dominik hasn't worked on this, it's been this way since release and was intended to function this way. As Dominik and I have pointed out, the lack of unit counters doesn't mean lack of lethality to civilians.
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morvael
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by morvael »

MrBlizzard, have you played This War of Mine?
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RE: Welcome to the liberators! Or not?

Post by szmike »

well, looters, criminals and such were quite common, then retreating forces moving workforce, liberators punishing so called collaborators, ordinary people fleeing from all of above... it is war.
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